Layover?
 

Hello. Does AA, USAir, or any domestic airline allow for a "free" layover or stopover anymore? Sorry if this is "OLD" news, but I tried 4 different searches and could not find an answer. I want to fly into PHX with a late afternoon/early evening arrival, on either AA or USAir; the next flight out to Hawaii (either HNL or LIH) is not until the next morning. I know they used to allow a free layover in this circumstance; not sure if they do anymore. My husband is AA Gold, so I don't know if this makes any difference at all. Thank you.

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If PHX is a valid connecting point on your itinerary, you should be able to get around the four-hours-to-connect rule if you take the last scheduled flight of the day from your origination city to PHX, and connect on the first scheduled flight of the (next) day from PHX to your destination city.

If you take any flight other than the last flight of the day from your origination city to PHX, your stay in PHX will be treated as a stopover, rather than a connection, and this will usually result in a higher fare.

You don't say what your originating city is. That aside, the stopover rules are specific to each fare, and are not general airline rules. Generally speaking, the more expensive the fare, the more flexible the stopover rules are. They go from "no stopovers permitted" to "stopovers permitted at $x surcharge" to "free unlimited stopovers", depending on the fare.

I picked PHL as an originating city just for grins, going to HNL, 4/10-4/20 (so, no advanced purchase).

The cheapest AA fare says " 2 STOPOVERS PERMITTED ON THE PRICING UNIT - 1 IN EACH DIRECTION IN DFW/CHI/LAX/SFO AT USD 55.81 EACH. NO STOPOVER OCCURS IF PASSENGER TAKES NEXT AVAILABLE FLIGHT WITHIN 4 HOURS." So in that case, it would not work for you, as a stopover is defined as being anything over 4 hours, and is permitted only in certain cities.

The cheapest US fare says "NO STOPOVERS PERMITTED ON THE PRICING UNIT. NO STOPOVER OCCURS IF PASSENGER TAKES NEXT AVAILABLE FLIGHT WITHIN 18 HOURS." So, in that case, you could spend the night in PHX, as long as the flight the next morning was a) the next flight, and b) within 18 hours of your arrival.

Note that you have to read the fare rules carefully: in the US case cited above, the rule is very clear: NO STOPOVERS, but then it goes on to define a "stopover" in a way that what you want to do is not considered a stopover. This is important, as when you're shopping around, you don't want to tell an airline or travel agent that you "need a stopover in PHX" as an inexperienced agent might simply gloss over any fare that says NO STOPOVERS.

Looking forward a month so that deep discount fares are available, the prices are a lot lower, but the stopover rules are the same. I used ExpertFlyer to do the research.

Since PHX is a hub for USAirways and since US has direct flights from PHX to HNL, that would be the most likely airline to allow an overnight in PHX. I suggest you call US - that is likely to provide you with the fastest and most accurate response. Being AA Gold would not alter the fare rules.

Does any US carrier provide STPC on domestic itineraries?

I have never heard of such a thing in 25 years of traveling domestically on my own. At least within the 48 contiguous US states, most carriers operate enough frequencies that there are at least several non-stop, direct, or connecting options per day between city pairs. And, in the odd case where there's not, there's probably a competitor that does offer a reasonable schedule. Very few business travelers are going to want to add another 10+ hours to the journey just to overnight under all but the most unusual situations. And leisure travelers that will book only the cheapest available option are going to be difficult to make money off of if you have to add a STPC to the cost.

Can't say for your flights, but I have a flight coming up from New York to Belize, and there was no difference in fare for an evening flight out of NYC to Houston (and not the last flight of the evening, at least four earlier flights are also the same price) and the connection is not until the next morning to Belize. There was no fare difference between that and flights that did not overnight, or the last flight from Newark to IAH.

So yes, some airlines apparently still allow it, but can't say if US Air will be one of them.

Not that I am aware of. The domestic market is too competitive to really allow most carriers to make a margin while paying for you to spend a night in a hotel on the carrier. Usually in Intl markets on higher cost, premium cabin fares, where a carrier's routing may require the stopover in order to compete on price with a carrier who either has direct or same day connections, these are offered.

Layover
 

Hello and thank you all for your responses. The scenario is this: I would like to use AA or USAir award miles to "design" my own flight itinerary and, if possible get a free layover. I would like to depart from either MDT (preferred), AVP, or PHL with the final destination of HNL or LIH. I would like to put the itinerary together to route through PHX since I have a brother who lives there. I would choose an early afternoon flight to PHX (if available with award miles), fully knowing that there are no connecting flights to HNL/LIH until the next morning. Since there legitimately are no flights from PHX to HNL/LIH until the next morning (on AA or USAIR that I could find anyway) do I qualify for a free layover? Maybe AA will not allow me to use award miles to route thru PHX anyway, but I have enough SPG points to convert to 2 award tickets on other airlines if need be. We have traveled from PA to HNL on AA award tickets many times over the years, routing from PA to either DFW or ORD.

The long, 11.5 hours of airtime alone from the east coast to HI are becoming nearly impossible for my husband and I to tolerate as we have gotten older. We have done the free layover thing in DFW and LAX in the past (it has been at least 4 years since we have done that), but it seems like prolonging the "agony", not to mention the expense of a taxi/hotel room for the night, and enduring security again. If we can route through PHX with award tickets we would have someone to pick us up/drop us off at the airport the next morning and have a free place to sleep. In addition, when we return from HNL/LIH to PHX I thought we could "throw away" the return portion of our award ticket from PHX to PA, purchase inexpensive returns, and stay with my brother for a few days visit. I asked an AA reservation agent about the option of a free layover last year and she told me (not very pleasantly) that there were NO free layovers anymore......? I don't know why, if there are NO connecting flights available until the next morning. Airlines certainly do this themselves (long layover until next morning connection) for their own purposes. After being told by the AA phone reservation agent that there were no more free layovers/stopovers, I opened the SPG card so that I might find more flexibility with other airlines. I thought I would ask the experts here at Flyer Talk for your ideas/recommendations. Thank your very much!

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nittfan, if US does not permit stopovers on its awards between the continental U.S. and Hawaii, then the issue is going to be how much time you are given to "connect" in PHX before your stop there becomes a "stopover." A prior poster has indicated that on a paid ticket on US Airways, the passenger has 18 hours to connect. If that same rule applies to award tickets, then you should be able to get your lengthy overnight stay in PHX on the outbound with no trouble. As for your return, you may have a problem "throwing away" the PHX-XXX segment if you are checking bags: you'll be in PHX, but your luggage will continue on to your home airport.

My suggestion is to call US Airways and ask about the maximum connection time in PHX on an award ticket to Hawaii. If it is 18 hours, then ask if an "open jaw" award is permitted. That would permit you to ticket the award as XXX-PHX-Hawaii-PHX, with no remaining segment to throw away. I would also ask if US permits stopovers on their awards between the continental U.S. and Hawaii.

If the US Airways award rules do not work for you, then -- if there is award-seat availability at the "low" level on US -- I would think about transferring SPG points to Air Canada's Aeroplan program, and redeeming Aeroplan miles for the trip on US. Aeroplan's redemption rules permit both an en route stopover and an open jaw when you redeem for an award between the continental U.S. and Hawaii, even when redeeming on U.S. Airways flights. But I would make sure that Aeroplan can get the US flights you want before I transferred any SPG points into Aeroplan.

Since you are looking to route through PHX on this trip, AA will not work for you. But just so you know, AA eliminated roundtrip awards a couple of years ago, and with that, the free en-route stopover on domestic awards was lost. All AA awards are now one-ways (except for their distance-based oneworld awards which are a completely different animal). On its one-way awards, AA now permits a free stopover only on awards between North America and another zone, and then only at the North American "gateway" on the award itinerary. So, for example, for as little as 20,000 miles, you can get an AA Coach award from Hawaii to Europe, with a lengthy (weeks or months) stopover in NYC, as long as you are booked on a direct flight from JFK or EWR to Europe. That's a great deal for some folks, but won't do you much good on an award trip between Pennsylvania and Hawaii.

Layover
 

Hello guv1976 (and also Steve M!). Thank you both for your help and the information. I will look into the Air Canada program as you suggest. What we may do is book one way award tickets with AA to HNL, since we have a lot of FF miles with AA, and on the return trip book one way with USAir from HNL to PHX. Or, book the entire thing with US if I can arrange a late afternoon/early evening flight from MDT (or AVP)- PHX and an early a.m. departure the next day to LIH that adheres to their rules of maximum connection time and therefore not being considered a "stopover". Yes, we have not done a free stopover with AA (in either DFW or LAX) for at least 4-5 years; you suggest that this is not allowed anymore, award ticket or no? I know this is not an option when I try to book an award ticket on line, as ALL award flights originating from MDT or AVP (our closest airports) route thru ORD and then on to HNL. PHL routes thru ORD or DFW to HNL, but all of these award flights have connections available. If I was permitted to do so, I would consider utilizing AA award mileage to route thru LAX for late arrival and then departure out the next morning, but once again, I am assuming you mean AA will not allow this?

When we go to HI, it is usually a 20 hour day from the time we arrive at our home airport (usually MDT) until our arrival into LIH. This has become exhausting since we are now in our 60's and with some minor medical issues. So, we are looking for some way to remedy the exhaustion of the trip without burning up extra air miles or $$ which is what the official stopovers would incur. Regarding us possibly routing MDT-PHX-HNL-PHX on USAir utilizing an open jaw, this is good if USAir will indeed allow us the long (overnight) connection time in PHX on the outbound without considering it a stopover. I will call them and ask the questions (maximum connection time and permitted stopovers with US mainland and HI flights) that you suggested. Thank you VERY much!

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Assuming that you could find award seat availability on all flights, AA should permit an overnight connection at LAX, as long as you adhere to the last flight in/first flight out rule. Such connections might not show up on aa.com, so a call to AA reservations might be required.

Also, I'm not sure that US Airways currently offers one-way awards, so that might be a problem if you want to use AA miles on the outbound, and US miles on the return.

By the way, did you know that AA now serves ABE also?

Layover
 

Thank you for your suggestions Steve M. Two years ago I asked an AA phone rep. about a stopover, I am sure what you suggest is what happened. I asked her straight out if an overnight stopover was still allowed when arriving late into a city (in the past this has been DFW or LAX) where there were no connecting flights to HI until the next day. I will have to be more savvy in the future..........

Our plans involve utilizing AA (with whom we currently have beaucoup FF miles), USAir or SPG points/miles for award tickets from MDT (or AVP) with the ultimate destination either HNL or LIH. I would like to arrange this with a late afternoon routing through PHX because I have a brother who lives there and it would be great to overnight there. I am assuming that AA will not route through PHX on an award trip to HI, and even if they did, the connections to continue on to HI are time consuming, complicated and not worth it. Another option for us would be to fly from MDT (or AVP) to LAX on a late afternoon/evening flight with a next morning connection to HNL or LIH, but I do not know if AA will allow routing from MDT/AVP to LAX on an award ticket? Another scenario for us would be to use AA miles for an award ticket from MDT/AVP to HI and then utilize US Air miles for the return from LIH/HNL to PHX and then purchase a cheap return ticket from PHX to MDT/AVP several days later. We are trying to find a way to make the exhausting trip from the east coast to HI more tolerable without burning up all of our FF miles or $$ and visiting my brother for a few days would be a big plus!

Thanks for telling me about Expert Flyer...........

HI guv, yes, I actually did know that AA service is available from ABE, but thanks for the reminder. AVP is the closest to us at just about an hour away and MDT is about 90 minutes away. ABE is 95-100 minutes away, but would certainly be worth at least looking into to compare the flight details. We have not had many award flights on USAir so no, I didn't know that their award flights were roundtrip only but I should have. I will check into a late afternoon, AA award flight from PA (MDT/AVP/ABE) to LAX and see what the connection rules are for continuing on to HI. One good thing is that I always plan WAY ahead; I am planning for late Feb. or March, 2012, so I usually get my desired award tickets. And, another thing is there is one evening flight direct from LAX to LIH with AA that does not incur an additional inter-island flight/expense. Only problem with this routing (PA to LAX, overnighting, waiting for an even flight to LIH) is that although we get to sleep in and rest, the entire itinerary seems to take FOREVER, so we only did this once! Regarding your comment about luggage on an earlier post when I said I was considering a MDT(AVP)-PHX-LIH-PHX-MDT routing and throwing away the final return segment from PHX-MDT in favor of a purchased return, PHX-MDT several days later - we almost always travel with carry ons only so our baggage wouldn't be a problem (being sent on without us). Can you still be "penalized" in any way for throwing away the last segment of a flight itinerary? Thanks!

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I doubt that US would care very much if one threw away the last segment on an award ticket, but if you end up flying US in both directions, redeeming through Aeroplan would avoid any problems: if the overnight stop at PHX on the outbound qualifies as a connection under Aeroplan's rules, you could then get a full stopover at PHX on the return, and get your travel from PHX to Pennsylvania included on the same award; if the overnight stop at PHX does not qualify as a connection, you can make it your permitted Aeroplan stopover, and just have the return trip end at PHX, since Aeroplan permits both a stopover and an open jaw on the same award.