what to do when airline warned me about numerous throw-away ticketing? ($95 vs $497)
#751
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Correct, there is no ethical issue here, but from the point of view of the airline, there is a contractual one.
The price from A to B is 200. The price from A to C, via B, is 100. The fact that you can get off in B is a happy coincidence (for you). This works in a hub/spoke system. I don't want to defend these pricing policies, but there is a very real (but not immediate, or immediately obvious) loss of revenue in hidden city ticketing.
The price from A to B is 200. The price from A to C, via B, is 100. The fact that you can get off in B is a happy coincidence (for you). This works in a hub/spoke system. I don't want to defend these pricing policies, but there is a very real (but not immediate, or immediately obvious) loss of revenue in hidden city ticketing.
If they could sell those individual sectors and fill their planes at the higher prices, there'd be no availability of seats for the cheaper connecting traffic.
So the airline is trying to off load unsold seats and at least make some money.
*there may be an argument against this for fares which are goverment subsidised for routes which form essential services.
#752
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That may be true, but not essential to the contract violation argument. I'm not taking sides on the issue, and I've dropped a final segment more than once in my life, AND I don't believe anyone is ever going to make a big fuss about it, but I'll reiterate...the airline is offering different fares to different cities. That this fare pricing may seem illogical to us is not relevant. From the perspective of the airline, they are perfectly within their rights to reroute you to get to the final ticketed city C in a way which avoids the traveller's intended destination in B.
From the consumer's perspective I can also understand the tempting argument that no one is getting hurt by only flying half of what was bought, but it is a circumvention of the original fare.
From the consumer's perspective I can also understand the tempting argument that no one is getting hurt by only flying half of what was bought, but it is a circumvention of the original fare.
#753
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That may be true, but not essential to the contract violation argument. I'm not taking sides on the issue, and I've dropped a final segment more than once in my life, AND I don't believe anyone is ever going to make a big fuss about it, but I'll reiterate...the airline is offering different fares to different cities. That this fare pricing may seem illogical to us is not relevant. From the perspective of the airline, they are perfectly within their rights to reroute you to get to the final ticketed city C in a way which avoids the traveller's intended destination in B.
From the consumer's perspective I can also understand the tempting argument that no one is getting hurt by only flying half of what was bought, but it is a circumvention of the original fare.
From the consumer's perspective I can also understand the tempting argument that no one is getting hurt by only flying half of what was bought, but it is a circumvention of the original fare.
If the seat is one that is essentially unsold, a bill $500 for the missed segment may not be an actual assessment of damages? Therefore it might be an invalid contract term.
i haven't done the hidden ticketing, but i have purchased a round-trip fare when intending to fly one way only. This was just last year for an internal European flight where LH wanted E600 one way, but were selling the return for E129.
Bit of a no brainer.
#754
Join Date: Nov 2013
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If I pay the airline to fly A-B-C, but only fly A-B, I've still paid for the B-C segment. I've also let them fly that segment with less fuel consumption due to lower weight. Really I don't care what price they've evaluated that segment at, if I pay for it and choose not to use it, I've still paid for it.
For me its like buying a combo at McDonalds, its often cheaper to get a Big Mac combo, then to buy a Big Mac, Fries, and a Drink seperately. Therefore I will take the combo and throw out the fries. I still paid for the fries, so McDonalds can't punish me for throwing them in the garbage.
Its not my fault McDonalds chooses to the give me a discount for taking the fries over not taking them.
For me its like buying a combo at McDonalds, its often cheaper to get a Big Mac combo, then to buy a Big Mac, Fries, and a Drink seperately. Therefore I will take the combo and throw out the fries. I still paid for the fries, so McDonalds can't punish me for throwing them in the garbage.
Its not my fault McDonalds chooses to the give me a discount for taking the fries over not taking them.
#755
Join Date: Jan 2008
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The price from A to B is 200. The price from A to C, via B, is 100. The fact that you can get off in B is a happy coincidence (for you). This works in a hub/spoke system. I don't want to defend these pricing policies, but there is a very real (but not immediate, or immediately obvious) loss of revenue in hidden city ticketing.
#756
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If I pay the airline to fly A-B-C, but only fly A-B, I've still paid for the B-C segment. I've also let them fly that segment with less fuel consumption due to lower weight. Really I don't care what price they've evaluated that segment at, if I pay for it and choose not to use it, I've still paid for it.
For me its like buying a combo at McDonalds, its often cheaper to get a Big Mac combo, then to buy a Big Mac, Fries, and a Drink seperately. Therefore I will take the combo and throw out the fries. I still paid for the fries, so McDonalds can't punish me for throwing them in the garbage.
Its not my fault McDonalds chooses to the give me a discount for taking the fries over not taking them.
For me its like buying a combo at McDonalds, its often cheaper to get a Big Mac combo, then to buy a Big Mac, Fries, and a Drink seperately. Therefore I will take the combo and throw out the fries. I still paid for the fries, so McDonalds can't punish me for throwing them in the garbage.
Its not my fault McDonalds chooses to the give me a discount for taking the fries over not taking them.
#757
Join Date: Jan 2008
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Jumping off the flight halfway to pay less aside, a passenger might be planning on using that layover in B specifically to meet with family, conduct business, etc. Changing the interim stop represents a quite significant change in the agreement - infinitely more than a passenger not flying all segments.
#758
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You'll probably be successful in getting a refund if you choose not to travel, but from a hidden city ticketing perspective it rather defeats the purpose if you do this again and again.
#759
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Not without a notification and option for refund they're not.
Jumping off the flight halfway to pay less aside, a passenger might be planning on using that layover in B specifically to meet with family, conduct business, etc. Changing the interim stop represents a quite significant change in the agreement - infinitely more than a passenger not flying all segments.
Jumping off the flight halfway to pay less aside, a passenger might be planning on using that layover in B specifically to meet with family, conduct business, etc. Changing the interim stop represents a quite significant change in the agreement - infinitely more than a passenger not flying all segments.
#760
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#761
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No, absolutely incorrect. The service of getting you from A to B and the service of getting you from A to C are two different offerings, with different prices. When it flies A-B-C, the mechanical device used to deliver those two services happens to be providing both at the same time, but from a service-pricing standpoint that's irrelevant. The A-to-B price may be higher than A-to-C. But that is a function of local competition, supply and demand for the A-to-B service. Buying A-to-C and availing oneself of A-to-B is essentially theft of service.
#762
Join Date: Nov 2010
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It's a bit of a moving target, and I think might depend on local legislation. In my understanding of Canadian law, a BOC is a tort if it wasn't due to negligence, but that could be a outdated.
Any lawyers in the readership here that could shed some light? Just out of interest.
Any lawyers in the readership here that could shed some light? Just out of interest.
A key distinction between BOC and a tort is that BOC does not, absent an independent cause of action, bring about non-pecuniary damages, where tort actions can.
#763
Join Date: Mar 2011
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a non-stop to connection regardless of time you can get a refund, if it is a connection then you usually have to have the flights arrival time moved back by 2 hours before you can get a refund.
#764
Join Date: Jan 2008
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But that's the point. Neither does the airline. How do we know the passenger didn't have a fixed budget and A-B was outside of that, so they never would have flown at all ?
"How much we might have made" doesn't pay the bills.
Let's not get stuck on the semantics of 'loss'.
If they really think they're losing money, they'll be claiming it as a loss in their accounts. Do you think they are ?
It's like record companies claiming music piracy costs them money. It's not semantics, it's flat-out wrong (not to mention dishonest).
#765
Join Date: Jan 2008
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Posts: 379
Airlines are allowed to get away with these sort of shennanigans all the time. Cancelling an entire ticket if someone missed the first (or any other) segment is another example of the difference between what should happen and what does.