Thoughts about my free iphone app - WhatsApp
May 3, 2018, 11:27 am
#301
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Manchester, United Kingdom
Programs: Hilton Gold, Priority Club Blue, SPG Gold, Sofitel Gold, FB Ivory, BA Blue
Posts: 8,478
.I have a hard time begrudging them the success (but Darth Hoodie)!
May 3, 2018, 11:31 am
#302
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Between AUS, EWR, and YTO In a little twisty maze of airline seats, all alike.. but I wanna go home with the armadillo
Programs: CO, NW, & UA forum moderator emeritus
Posts: 35,400
ld!!!" by the time the first billion was offered.
May 3, 2018, 12:53 pm
#303
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 960
hi there,
i hate shameless self promotion, but i couldn't resist posting here because i wrote this app with people like us in mind (those who travel a lot)
ever since i semi-retired a little over a year ago, i been traveling A LOT and i hated it when people tried to reach me when i am on the plane or out of the country. so i asked myself -- wouldn't it be cool if i just set a status for my iPhone, similar to how you can set a status on yahoo messenger or skype.
problem found - problem solved. so i spent a couple of months and developed a little tool called WhatsApp - it can let you set a status like "On the flight to munich, send email instead of calling me" or "In Japan for two weeks, my cell there is +81 829 282718"
our site with screenshots and faq is: http://www.whatsapp.com and direct itunes link is: Connecting to the iTunes Store.
i would like to hear your feedback and suggestions on the idea. hit or miss?
(of course app is useless 'til your contacts begin to use it also)
P.S. - i know a lot of you are BlackBerry users, and we are working on a BlackBerry version already (wish there was more hours in the day)
i hate shameless self promotion, but i couldn't resist posting here because i wrote this app with people like us in mind (those who travel a lot)
ever since i semi-retired a little over a year ago, i been traveling A LOT and i hated it when people tried to reach me when i am on the plane or out of the country. so i asked myself -- wouldn't it be cool if i just set a status for my iPhone, similar to how you can set a status on yahoo messenger or skype.
problem found - problem solved. so i spent a couple of months and developed a little tool called WhatsApp - it can let you set a status like "On the flight to munich, send email instead of calling me" or "In Japan for two weeks, my cell there is +81 829 282718"
our site with screenshots and faq is: http://www.whatsapp.com and direct itunes link is: Connecting to the iTunes Store.
i would like to hear your feedback and suggestions on the idea. hit or miss?
(of course app is useless 'til your contacts begin to use it also)
P.S. - i know a lot of you are BlackBerry users, and we are working on a BlackBerry version already (wish there was more hours in the day)
Jun 10, 2018, 1:36 pm
#304
Suspended
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Bay Area
Programs: DL SM, UA MP.
Posts: 12,729
There was a big story in the WSJ about the falling out between Facebook and the WhatsApp founders. That article is behind a paywall but this article goes over some of the points:
https://slate.com/business/2018/06/f...e-trusted.html
Koum the founder proudly said over and mover they didn't want to advertise and they made the deal based on promises from Zuckerberg. But really the only way they had of enforcing those promises is that if FB broke them, their FB stock vested immediately. OK, so that's great for WhatsApp people who got a lot of FB stock in the deal but how does that prevent FB from turning WhatsApp into the same kind of advertising cesspool that FB is?
OK they apparently gave up a lot of money to leave FB as soon as they could, but that money pales in comparison to the money they already got from FB. They left hundreds of millions on the table but they still walk away with billions.
Apparently Sandberg "leaned into" Zuckerberg and made him assimilate WhatsApp into the FB collective. How's that for girl power!
I bet there are tens of millions, if not more WhatsApp users who don't care. I'm going to Bali and notice a lot of the private drivers who cater to tourists all want to be contacted by WhatsApp. I have the app. downloaded and may even have registered my phone number, when I went on another trip to Vietnam, and found it was widely used there too. But I never ended up using it.
I don't know if Viber is any better, though I've used that to make some international long distance calls.
However, maybe the thing is to use something like Signal, unless they get big enough and get scarfed up by the likes of FB or Google. More and more, privacy is harder to preserve. I think FaceTime and iMessage are reasonably private but those won't be too popular in developing countries like Indonesia or Vietnam since Apple devices are too costly.
Skype was once the choice but that got assimilated by the Redmond Borg.
https://slate.com/business/2018/06/f...e-trusted.html
Koum the founder proudly said over and mover they didn't want to advertise and they made the deal based on promises from Zuckerberg. But really the only way they had of enforcing those promises is that if FB broke them, their FB stock vested immediately. OK, so that's great for WhatsApp people who got a lot of FB stock in the deal but how does that prevent FB from turning WhatsApp into the same kind of advertising cesspool that FB is?
And so in order to acquire WhatsApp, Zuckerberg not only had to pay a lot of money and give up a board seat to Koum; he also had to make a lot of promises. Some of those promises were even enshrined in the acquisition agreement: If Facebook imposed “monetization initiatives” like advertising onto WhatsApp, its founders’ shares would vest immediately, and they could leave without suffering any kind of financial penalty.
Thus did WhatsApp retain exactly the independence that it had been promised—until it didn’t.
Today, it seems inevitable not only that advertising will make it onto WhatsApp, but also that the advertising in question will be targeted—which is to say that when you use the app, Facebook will know exactly who you are, where you live, and what kind of products you might be interested in buying. It’s a complete repudiation of WhatsApp’s founding principles, and makes a mockery of its end-to-end encryption.
What’s more, WhatsApp’s two founders both left hundreds of millions of dollars on the table, so keen were they to leave Facebook’s ad-friendly walls. (It turns out that their contractual right to being paid out in full would require them to sue for the money, and, according to the Journal, neither of them had the appetite for that.) Brian Acton resigned in September; Koum stayed on until the end of April. In leaving before November of this year, Acton gave up some $900 million; Koum gave up about $400 million. You need to be really unhappy at work if you’re willing to quit a job that’s effectively paying you some $60 million per month, and from which you basically can’t be fired.
Thus did WhatsApp retain exactly the independence that it had been promised—until it didn’t.
Today, it seems inevitable not only that advertising will make it onto WhatsApp, but also that the advertising in question will be targeted—which is to say that when you use the app, Facebook will know exactly who you are, where you live, and what kind of products you might be interested in buying. It’s a complete repudiation of WhatsApp’s founding principles, and makes a mockery of its end-to-end encryption.
What’s more, WhatsApp’s two founders both left hundreds of millions of dollars on the table, so keen were they to leave Facebook’s ad-friendly walls. (It turns out that their contractual right to being paid out in full would require them to sue for the money, and, according to the Journal, neither of them had the appetite for that.) Brian Acton resigned in September; Koum stayed on until the end of April. In leaving before November of this year, Acton gave up some $900 million; Koum gave up about $400 million. You need to be really unhappy at work if you’re willing to quit a job that’s effectively paying you some $60 million per month, and from which you basically can’t be fired.
Apparently Sandberg "leaned into" Zuckerberg and made him assimilate WhatsApp into the FB collective. How's that for girl power!
I bet there are tens of millions, if not more WhatsApp users who don't care. I'm going to Bali and notice a lot of the private drivers who cater to tourists all want to be contacted by WhatsApp. I have the app. downloaded and may even have registered my phone number, when I went on another trip to Vietnam, and found it was widely used there too. But I never ended up using it.
I don't know if Viber is any better, though I've used that to make some international long distance calls.
However, maybe the thing is to use something like Signal, unless they get big enough and get scarfed up by the likes of FB or Google. More and more, privacy is harder to preserve. I think FaceTime and iMessage are reasonably private but those won't be too popular in developing countries like Indonesia or Vietnam since Apple devices are too costly.
Skype was once the choice but that got assimilated by the Redmond Borg.
Jun 10, 2018, 5:48 pm
#305
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Upcountry Maui, HI
Posts: 13,305
drivers etc use whatsapp to avoid paying fees to contact you by SMS to your non-local number. Also the reason it's been popular overseas (in addition to the pre-FB policies.)
Zuckerberg continues to lie about everything. His primary goal is not to make FB a safe place. It's to make money, and to do that he has to sell your information to advertisers, etc.
Frankly, it's a little difficult to believe somebody will pay you several billions for your business and then agree to never try to monetize their investment and actually mean it.
-David
Zuckerberg continues to lie about everything. His primary goal is not to make FB a safe place. It's to make money, and to do that he has to sell your information to advertisers, etc.
Frankly, it's a little difficult to believe somebody will pay you several billions for your business and then agree to never try to monetize their investment and actually mean it.
-David
Last edited by LIH Prem; Jun 10, 2018 at 5:58 pm
Jun 11, 2018, 1:25 am
#306
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 1999
Location: Seat 1A, Juice pretty much everywhere, Mucci des Coins Exotiques
Posts: 34,339
I will happily continue to use Whatsapp as long as it remains popular and usable (i.e. no pop up ads interrupting communication). I have never used Facebook so there's no issue with personal information. And I travel all over the world so I have no problem with FB having my location information as it will become stale every week or so. Actually I wouldn't care even if I didn't travel. You know your phone company knows where you are all the time anyways.
Jun 11, 2018, 9:30 am
#307
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: San Diego, CA
Programs: GE, Marriott Platinum
Posts: 15,507
I was first introduced to WhatsApp last year while I was in the UK. It's a pretty nice app IMO (and is apparently popular enough such that Mexican carriers offer an entire separate data bucket for it, so I'm not sure the FB stuff will have much of an impact in the short to medium term).
The only thing I'd change thus far is to make it easier to switch platforms; moving my messages from iOS to Android recently was a huge pain and ultimately required me to buy a third party app from the Play Store. Though to be fair, this is likely not a common occurrence.
The only thing I'd change thus far is to make it easier to switch platforms; moving my messages from iOS to Android recently was a huge pain and ultimately required me to buy a third party app from the Play Store. Though to be fair, this is likely not a common occurrence.
Sep 26, 2018, 8:29 am
#310
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: ATL Lost Luggage
Programs: Kettle with Kryptonium Medallion Tags
Posts: 10,296
WhatsApp Cofounder Gives Inside Story On #DeleteFacebook & Why He Left $850 Million
From a new article in Forbes:
Facebook, [Brian Acton, a founder of WhatsApp] says, had decided to pursue two ways of making money from WhatsApp. First, by showing targeted ads in WhatsApp’s new Status feature, which Acton felt broke a social compact with its users. “Targeted advertising is what makes me unhappy,” he says. His motto at WhatsApp had been “No ads, no games, no gimmicks”—a direct contrast with a parent company that derived 98% of its revenue from advertising. Another motto had been “Take the time to get it right,” a stark contrast to “Move fast and break things.”
Facebook also wanted to sell businesses tools to chat with WhatsApp users. Once businesses were on board, Facebook hoped to sell them analytics tools, too. The challenge was WhatsApp’s watertight end-to-end encryption, which stopped both WhatsApp and Facebook from reading messages. While Facebook didn’t plan to break the encryption, Acton says, its managers did question and “probe” ways to offer businesses analytical insights on WhatsApp users in an encrypted environment.
Facebook’s plans remain unclear. When Sandberg, Facebook’s COO, was asked by U.S. lawmakers in early September if WhatsApp still used end-to-end encryption, she avoided a straight yes or no, saying, “We are strong believers in encryption.” A WhatsApp spokesperson confirmed that WhatsApp would begin placing ads in its Status feature next year, but added that even as more businesses start chatting to people on the platform, “messages will remain end-to-end encrypted. There are no plans to change that.”
For his part, Acton had proposed monetizing WhatsApp through a metered-user model, charging, say, a tenth of a penny after a certain large number of free messages were used up. “You build it once, it runs everywhere in every country,” Acton says. “You don’t need a sophisticated sales force. It’s a very simple business.”
Acton’s plan was shot down by Sandberg. “Her words were ‘It won’t scale.’ ”I called her out one time,” says Acton, who sensed there might be greed at play. “I was like, ‘No, you don’t mean that it won’t scale. You mean it won’t make as much money as . . . ,’ and she kind of hemmed and hawed a little. And we moved on. I think I made my point. . . . They are businesspeople, they are good businesspeople. They just represent a set of business practices, principles and ethics, and policies that I don’t necessarily agree with.”
Facebook also wanted to sell businesses tools to chat with WhatsApp users. Once businesses were on board, Facebook hoped to sell them analytics tools, too. The challenge was WhatsApp’s watertight end-to-end encryption, which stopped both WhatsApp and Facebook from reading messages. While Facebook didn’t plan to break the encryption, Acton says, its managers did question and “probe” ways to offer businesses analytical insights on WhatsApp users in an encrypted environment.
Facebook’s plans remain unclear. When Sandberg, Facebook’s COO, was asked by U.S. lawmakers in early September if WhatsApp still used end-to-end encryption, she avoided a straight yes or no, saying, “We are strong believers in encryption.” A WhatsApp spokesperson confirmed that WhatsApp would begin placing ads in its Status feature next year, but added that even as more businesses start chatting to people on the platform, “messages will remain end-to-end encrypted. There are no plans to change that.”
For his part, Acton had proposed monetizing WhatsApp through a metered-user model, charging, say, a tenth of a penny after a certain large number of free messages were used up. “You build it once, it runs everywhere in every country,” Acton says. “You don’t need a sophisticated sales force. It’s a very simple business.”
Acton’s plan was shot down by Sandberg. “Her words were ‘It won’t scale.’ ”I called her out one time,” says Acton, who sensed there might be greed at play. “I was like, ‘No, you don’t mean that it won’t scale. You mean it won’t make as much money as . . . ,’ and she kind of hemmed and hawed a little. And we moved on. I think I made my point. . . . They are businesspeople, they are good businesspeople. They just represent a set of business practices, principles and ethics, and policies that I don’t necessarily agree with.”
Sep 26, 2018, 2:59 pm
#311
Suspended
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Bay Area
Programs: DL SM, UA MP.
Posts: 12,729
Sure he could walk away with $19 billion and was his hands of it.
once he agreed to take that money, he could no longer keep his promises, even if he wanted to.
Did he really believe FB wouldn’t try to maximize returns on its investment?
He could donate some money to worthy causes if it would help him feel better.
anyways it’s a “free” service so he doesn’t owe anybody anything. They could switch to another app. Like Viber if it’s not as intrusive.
once he agreed to take that money, he could no longer keep his promises, even if he wanted to.
Did he really believe FB wouldn’t try to maximize returns on its investment?
He could donate some money to worthy causes if it would help him feel better.
anyways it’s a “free” service so he doesn’t owe anybody anything. They could switch to another app. Like Viber if it’s not as intrusive.
May 9, 2019, 12:57 pm
#313
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: MEX
Posts: 1,014
hi there,
i hate shameless self promotion, but i couldn't resist posting here because i wrote this app with people like us in mind (those who travel a lot)
ever since i semi-retired a little over a year ago, i been traveling A LOT and i hated it when people tried to reach me when i am on the plane or out of the country. so i asked myself -- wouldn't it be cool if i just set a status for my iPhone, similar to how you can set a status on yahoo messenger or skype.
problem found - problem solved. so i spent a couple of months and developed a little tool called WhatsApp - it can let you set a status like "On the flight to munich, send email instead of calling me" or "In Japan for two weeks, my cell there is +81 829 282718"
our site with screenshots and faq is: http://www.whatsapp.com and direct itunes link is: Connecting to the iTunes Store.
i would like to hear your feedback and suggestions on the idea. hit or miss?
(of course app is useless 'til your contacts begin to use it also)
P.S. - i know a lot of you are BlackBerry users, and we are working on a BlackBerry version already (wish there was more hours in the day)
i hate shameless self promotion, but i couldn't resist posting here because i wrote this app with people like us in mind (those who travel a lot)
ever since i semi-retired a little over a year ago, i been traveling A LOT and i hated it when people tried to reach me when i am on the plane or out of the country. so i asked myself -- wouldn't it be cool if i just set a status for my iPhone, similar to how you can set a status on yahoo messenger or skype.
problem found - problem solved. so i spent a couple of months and developed a little tool called WhatsApp - it can let you set a status like "On the flight to munich, send email instead of calling me" or "In Japan for two weeks, my cell there is +81 829 282718"
our site with screenshots and faq is: http://www.whatsapp.com and direct itunes link is: Connecting to the iTunes Store.
i would like to hear your feedback and suggestions on the idea. hit or miss?
(of course app is useless 'til your contacts begin to use it also)
P.S. - i know a lot of you are BlackBerry users, and we are working on a BlackBerry version already (wish there was more hours in the day)
10 years today! This should be in the Flyertalk Museum.
May 9, 2019, 1:10 pm
#314
Suspended
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Bay Area
Programs: DL SM, UA MP.
Posts: 12,729
I have to say that in my last few trips, I'm finding more and more people I have to communicate with use WhatsApp.
Very convenient, though I do use Viber Out calls as well.
But I just need to get a prepaid SIM with data, don't care about minutes or having to figure out calling rates in different countries.
My guess is even with T-Mobile One account international data roaming, I could use WhatsApp, for chat if not voice.
Appreciate not seeing ads and who knows how FB is mining the data. But I did have to make one reservation on this trip to Puglia where they didn't have secure online booking and wanted me to email my credit card.
Worked out much better that I could send my credit card number by encrypted chat in WA.
About 10-15 years ago, a lot of smaller lodgings would get Skype accounts for similar purposes, like finalizing booking and using it for secure communications. It wasn't a widespread thing and while people have personal WA numbers, they're not getting them for business-specific numbers.
Very convenient, though I do use Viber Out calls as well.
But I just need to get a prepaid SIM with data, don't care about minutes or having to figure out calling rates in different countries.
My guess is even with T-Mobile One account international data roaming, I could use WhatsApp, for chat if not voice.
Appreciate not seeing ads and who knows how FB is mining the data. But I did have to make one reservation on this trip to Puglia where they didn't have secure online booking and wanted me to email my credit card.
Worked out much better that I could send my credit card number by encrypted chat in WA.
About 10-15 years ago, a lot of smaller lodgings would get Skype accounts for similar purposes, like finalizing booking and using it for secure communications. It wasn't a widespread thing and while people have personal WA numbers, they're not getting them for business-specific numbers.