I use my Ipod with my bose quiet comfort II headset. A great combo. I really like them both

The HD ipods are okay although I don't really care from them given the price, battery life, factory replaced battery and the fact I am not crazy about HD players. I really don't get all the hype surrounding the thing but you have to chalk that up to the Apple cult and word of mouth marketing. My father has one and he enjoys it, alrthough he had to ship it back to Apple to replace the battery. I bought a Creative Zen micro which I recently sold and I liked that a lot better feature and sound wise.

The Ipod shuffle is a complete rip off. Way to overpriced for it's functionality. There are too many full featured flash players that sell at comparable prices. One really has to question the research skills, decision making abilites and value consciousness of those that buy an Ipod shuffle, considering that every flash player has a "shuffle" mode and they are all small or can be worn around the neck or placed in an armband. Chalk that up to the marketing prowess of Apple and the hype.

I currently own a flash player manufactured by iudio/jetaudio called the G3 and it is probably the best flash player on the market. CNET had to revise their rating upwards on the player 2x from a 7 to an 8.3 because even they did not understand the full set of features the DAP offered. Iaudio now has the I5 on the market which I may buy for the girlfriend, the features are very similar to the G# but it has color screen options and a larger display.

http://www.jetaudio.com/index.asp

The G3 player destroys the Shuffle in every category. You get more than 30hrs on 1 AA battery, FM tuner with inline recording, direct MP3 encoding, voice recorder, multi band and programmable equalizer, WAV,ASF, WMA,MP3,OGG support, etc, etc, etc. Too many features to list. I paid $175 for my 1gb G3 which is priced at $25 more than the 1gb shuffle. I cringe at the thought of someone paying $149 for nothing more than a USB flash drive with no feature set.

Unfortunately even flash has limited storage capabilities. What I am really waiting for is a full featured SD or CF player that uses alkaline batteries.

The best thing the Ipod shuffle accomplished was it forced the prices of flash DAP to drop dramatically.

I adore my ipod shuffle. I'm a huge mac fan but more importantly, I love TINY electronics. It must be a chick geek thing, we need to fit everything into our small purses. ;)
I have the 1 GB, and it's literally so light that I can tuck it into my pocket and forget that it's there. Beautiful. Now if only they could squeeze a cellphone into it, I'd be in heaven.

I think you are really overestimating the Apple cult factor. I mean it isnt like they are a huge computer seller. I think you are also underestimating the ease of use factor. I have used several other players, and the Ipod is just easier to use in my opinion. I know of others who feel the same way, getting rid of things like iRivers to get an Ipod because of ease of use. Although certainly the "cool" factor is an issue as well. But I would point out that it isnt just the Ipod that generates this among consumer electronic products. Look back at things like the PalmV or the Sony Ericsson T68 phone. Heck, I would say most recent SE phone or things like the Moto V3 phone. Cool is part of the package.

Eh, all a matter of preference. I looked at the jetAudio site and made the following notes: each player available on their online store costs $40-50 more than same capacity iPod shuffle. Yes, you get a screen in each case. You also get in each case a player that is twice as thick as an iPod shuffle. In the case of the iAudio 5 it's also half again as wide as the shuffle. In the case of the G3 it's much larger. The little U2 matches the width but is still over twice as thick. Shuffle is slightly longer than all of them.

So, you see, it's tradeoffs. (Big surprise there.) For $50 more you get a screen and maybe more features. But you also get more bulk. Who is to say which is "better"? There's no such thing. For every person who would rather pay a few more bucks and have more features at the expense of size there's someone who would rather pay less and have thin and straightforward operation.

No, I'm not discounting Apple's marketing hype. Doesn't work much on their computers, but it sure does right now with anything called iPod. But that's not the only reason people choose an iPod shuffle over its competitors. What Apple has done here compared to something like the jetAudio products is realize that many many people are playing their music in shuffle mode all the time, even on a bigger iPod. So projecting this thought to a smaller size iPod they say oh, with only 120 songs (or 240) in shuffle mode, who cares if it has a screen? They apply their trademark clean, streamlined design to a flash-player at a price that actually undercut many if not most players of the same size. At least that was true at intro time. Now many may have lowered prices to match. The remainder are like the jetAudio stuff, packed with a screen and more features but still costing more and larger.

Each type of product will find its audience, I suspect. I think the iPod shuffle is the more mainstream, though. It appeals to those who want simple, and, yes, perhaps unfortunately, trendy as well. iPods certainly are trendy these days....

I doubt if I am underestimating the cult thing. Almost everyone I speak that owns an ipod invariably 1 of the top 3 reasons that they named for purchasing the Ipod was either/and/or "it looks cool" or "everyone else has one so I figured it must be good". None of them spent hours on any significant research of DAP's. My father did the same thing, he got an Ipod because he noticed everyone around him with one and they gushed about how great it was and he also saw a picture with President Bush wearing one.

Ask an average ipod user about the specs of the player and they will have no clue. Monkey see and Monkey do!

Like I mentioned before I don't have any problems with the Ipod HD's aside from the premium price, rechargeable battery and replacement battery issue. I also have no desire to own a HD player again.

My issue is the the crappy Ipod shuffle which is ridiculously overpriced for a featureless player. The sHuffle is pure hype.

Don't even get me started about the crappy Itunes product that people are being ripped off $1 a song for. The average concumer is very gullible and has no desire to educate themselves.

Who buys direct from the manufactureres site? You can get the player anyplace else and only pay $20 more than the 1Gb ishuffle. Ever hear of the term "shop around"?


Dude that is pure nitpicking. We are talking about DAP players that fit in the palm of your hand, you can wear around your neck or place in an armband; not BRICKS.




Actually for $20 the tradeoffs are HUGE, you focus on comparing the millimeters of the dimensions; I speak of significant technological features. There is no comparison. A full featured iaudio 1gb flash player with significantly better battery life will cost you $20 more than a 1gb ipod shuffle with no significant features. I will take a few millimeters in size for that.

And if I forgot to mention the iaudio "SHUFFLES" too.

ask an average computer user about the specs of their computer, and they won't have a clue either. not everyone is a technogeek. the ipod is a mass market product targetted at the average consumer and they hit that dead on.

and what is the alternative? illegally snagging songs off of limewire? or napster's subscription plan, where all your songs cease to be playable when you cancel (and cost extra if you want to burn them to cd while subscribed)?

the shuffle is rated for 12 hours battery life and most users are getting 15-20 hours on it. the new ipod mini is rated at 18 hours and early reviews are finding it lasts over 26 hours. just how long do you need to go without being near something with a usb port to recharge it?

the additional features are not really important to many users. for instance, the reason i want an mp3 player is because i don't want to listen to the radio. thus, paying for a radio is a waste (and it only does fm, not am, which is what i really want for news and traffic reports).

and then there is the feature called 'usability.' david pogue talked about that in an article for the new york times last december,
http://tech2.nytimes.com/mem/technol...51C1A9629C8B63

Boy you Ipod people sure do hate it when someone criticizes the product you love!!




That is a poor excuse. You don't have to be a technogeek to do a little research on an DAP. A couple of quick web searches and reading a few reviews would do the trick.
Also most computer buyers either buy on price or features, so they do a little research either way before they purchase. My 80 year old non-tech geek grandmother recently bought a Toshiba laptop from Bestbuy, she went into the store and looked at the comparable models and felt that she was getting the best bang for her dollar with the Toshiba.


Do a quick google search and you will find that there is a way to keep the napster songs, the same way there is a work around with the Itunes DRM. There are also plenty of alternative means and sites to obtain music.
Ahem. . .as I mentioned "research".


Personally I don't like rechargeable batteries. You ever fly JFK to Asia? Travel time can be anywhere from 17-32 hrs. I travel with my player on at all times, even when I sleep on the plane. guess what? During that period of time i don't listen to my music in "shuffle" mode. Sometimes I want to select my music and VISUALLY select it?

Once again you keep including the Ipod HD's info with the ishuffle. My criticism is ainly focused on the ishuffle and I maintain that it is an overpriced piece of crap. Listen to 1gb of music in shuffle mode? That is nuts!


if the 1gb ishuffle was retailed for $75 then you would have a credible argument. Paying $149 is a "waste" .

[/quote]

Then there are something called 'options', 'features', 'value' and 'hype'.

The ishuffle is pure HYPE.

I understand when a person who bought something goes out of his way to defend his purchase. But I can't figure out when a person who didn't buy something goes out of his way to defend his non-purchase. ;)

Yeah, ain't it funny how we get so attached to "loving" OR "hating" a device a company, etc. My goodness some people even wear hats and clothing and have decals with company logos as a part of their identity. Soooo many people love to hate Bill Gates or Apple or whatever. Whereas I know that the only commercial organizatin woth hating is the L.A. Dodgers!!!

As for the iPod - I bought one. Am happy with it. It's good enough and I didn't feel like and extensive comparative shopping campaign at the time. It is the best gadget I have and I fully realize that the compettion may even have produced something better. But when I am far from home and listening to one of the 280+ of my own "albums" which suits my mood, I'm happy!

Best wishes,

Teacher49

Lots of average people do. Not me, not you, but the general public. You are obviously not the target market for Apple's products. We've established that. Even at $20 more, though, it's $20 more and larger. I think you underestimate the value of size even when we're talking tiny here.

Again, I don't agree. Well, yeah, I agree we're not talking about bricks, but having held and used the iPod shuffle, I certainly wouldn't be nearly as impressed if the thing were twice as thick. That seems to be the tradeoff for having what does admittedly appear to be a usable screen. Either design is a legitimate compromise, but I don't agree that the size differences aren't important.

And so will some others. But why can't you let go of the idea that you win, end of story? I didn't say your choice player was a bad choice. I said the iPod shuffle was an equally legitimate choice, something that seems to bother you for some reason. The iAudios have record features. Who cares? They have FM tuners. Who cares? Personally, I can't think of any time I wished I could record from a little portable device. And I can't think of any wearable FM tuner I've used that's worth a damn. Plus a big use of portable devices is in the car; why would you need an FM tuner there? In your words, "Dude, that is pure nitpicking."

But that wasn't what I was doing anyway. I was pointing out some differences in the products. I don't consider that nitpicking, and I don't actually consider your comments nitpicking either inasmuch as you simply compare the products. What I was suggesting is that your way of looking at the situation is one way, but it's not the ONLY way. The iPod shuffle has its place for those who don't care about those features and like a simple, streamlined design at a good price. And contrary to your statements, it is a good price. When introduced, the iPod shuffle was at or near the low end of the price range for players of its size, especially looking at the major competitors. That may have changed a bit in the last couple months, but the power of the 100-buck level is a big draw. And yes, the trendy factor figures in here too, no denying it.

Haha. And the iPod shuffle plays in straight order if you want it to.

Buy the player you like, for the reason that makes sense to you. But don't expect everyone to agree with your reasoning. I don't expect everyone to agree with my reasoning above. I only write it because of the tone of the previous remarks suggesting there's only one way to see this comparison.

jwalkabout, you are absolutely and totally missing the point. The point is that different things are important to different people. You dont care if it is half the size. You care if it is more expensive or has a shorter battery life. Or perhaps to put it more precisely you care less that is is half the size and more that is has a better battery life. That is fine, that is your choice and it is why there is more than one product on the market for most devices.

I on the other hand, and others here care less about some of the things you care more about. For you to say that the customers arent aware of the specs is quite simply wrong and insulting. I am quite capable of understanding the specs thank you. I can understand them as well or better than you I suspect. But I evaluate their importance differently than you. You do not have the "right answer", nor do I, since there is no "right answer" to such a question.

When I bought my Ipod mini I assure you I was well aware of its specs and how much I was paying. I was aware that I was paying, on a per megabyte basis a premium. But I did it because 1) I thought it looked really cool and 2) I read it was really convenient to use. I was especially aware of the specs because I had just bought a Dell 30 MB player for not much more about 3 months before. But I will tell you this, I have not used the Dell, which by the way has twice the battery life as well as 7 times the storage of the mini, since I got the mini. The reason? The combination of Itunes and the Ipod is just so much more convenient. I know other people who have had other players and come to the same conclusions. Im willing to sacrifice those other things for the smaller size, cooler look and greater ease of use. As far as the itunes store Im really not sure what you are talking about either as far as other options and frankly dont care. Im pretty happy with the itunes store although I wish they had more choices in opera. Ill have to live with that.

In a similar vein, what kind of watch should one buy? Should we all buy the most accurate watch with the best battery life? Then everyone should get a radio activated quartz watch with solar power. Have one of those? Thats nice, I see their attraction. But they arent for me. I prefer mechanical watches. They are less accurate and more expensive than quartz. But I like the design, precision and craftsmanship required to make them. And I have done a lot of research in deciding, for instance, which one to purchase when I bought one in December. I looked into lots of things about different brands and feel I got a lot of the things I was looking for at a price that represented good value for a Swiss automatic watch. And I shopped at lots of stores and was able to negotiate a price of 28% off list from an authorized dealer. But is it as accurate as the Timex quartz triathelete that I wear to the gym? Not a chance, and it costs a lot more. And we arent talking the 25% differences you are talking about with the ipods versus other players, we are talking many, many, many times as much.

Does this mean Im wasteful or stupid that I make these choices? You may think so but to be perfectly honest I could care less. People think I am both wasteful and stupid for flying to London this weekend for a mileage run/mini-trip. I dont really care about their opinions either.

i have no probelms with criticizing the product - it certainly is not without flaws. but you seem to be offended that someone would willingly choose the ipod over something else, when the ipod might better suit their needs or desires.

and people do that exactly that with the ipod. a substantial number of people deem it to be the best value. however, it is not suitable for everyone, and other products exist to fill those needs.

so the itunes music store is a ripoff and your alternate methods have questionable legality. thanks for clarifying your stance on that.

the ipod shuffle is hardly the most appropriate unit for a flight overseas - an hd based device is much more suitable. the shuffle is designed for someone who wants something with no moving parts, perhaps while jogging or at the gym, or someone who wants a low cost or very small and lightweight player. or maybe they were planning to get a usb keychain and for a little more money, they get one which can play music.

no matter what the battery life of any device is, there are going to be situations where it won't be enough. however, for the sheer majority of users, battery life of an ipod is more than adequate - they use it during the day and charge it overnight. and for the times it isn't, auxillary battery packs (including solar powered ones) as well as automobile/airplane adapters are available.

why is it nuts? load it up with the music of your choosing (or let the computer randomly pick stuff), and then listen to it in sequential or shuffle mode. when you want to listen to something else, reload it. the ipod shuffle is not designed to hold your entire music library.

the jetaudio unit you mentioned earlier sells for $199. are the additional features it has (fm radio & voice recorder) worth the $124 premium (not including the cost of batteries) over your proposed ipod shuffle pricing?

1 gig flash drives with no music capabilities whatsoever are about $100 (from a quick look at a few major retailers). so the ipod shuffle costs a little more than a generic flash drive and a little less than a player with more features. that doesn't sound like a waste to me - it sounds like it is a fair price.

do you really expect a 1 gig flash mp3 player to sell for less than a 1 gig flash drive that doesn't play mp3???

gotta say
 

I have both, shuffle and ipod. Had an iRiver H10, the newest greatest mp3 player and it quickly went away. Poor sound reproduction and poor user interface. Have had a rio, and creative muvo, sort of like the small muvo,

As for shuffle, I bought it for some of the reasons posted here, small, very light, holds 512MB, (should have bought the gig) works as a USB thumb drive, which I do use it for.

I use it mainly for rides, working out at the gym, running, etc., where, for the most part, I ONLY use 1 or 2 playlists, and listen to about the same songs. Energy and motivation is what those songs are for. I never select songs on my ipod at the gym, ALWAYS play from a playlist and most people I know are exactly the same. Watch them, are they EVER fooling around with the ipod?

Shuffle is going to do very well IMHO

good thing I bought the stock at 20$