Wasn’t voice roaming eliminated with voice over LTE? All major US carriers require voice over LTE capable phones.


My personal iPhone 12 on AT&T does not have the option to turn off voice roaming. My work Samsung S21 on Verizon does not have the option.

Sorry, I'm a little out of the loop. What are you referring to? In general, most providers won't charge you voice time if you don't use it. Unfortunately there is always data being used, even if it's a trickle bit. You're pinging cell towers and the access point, your weather app is often trying to get an update (and often triggers when the cell radio says "Hey! I have contact!") Your other apps will try to phone home... your app store (Apple or Google) will check for updates...

But if all you have is voice, you're not charged anything until you call or are called and pick up.

Actually you are charged for incoming calls once they get to your phone whether you pick up or not. If your phone rings, you have used the roaming carrier at that point. T-Mobile gets billed, so they pass it on to the customer. This is painfully obvious on cruise ships due to the fact that they charge $6 a minute! I have had a few people on my account leave their phones on and get charges without answering calls. The same thing occurs elsewhere around the world, so either set up an alternate system like IMS, or go strictly WiFi wlth cellular off. Or at least assign your US line to a non roaming carrier.

It's worse when somebody leaves you a voicemail (which you probably have no interest in)... you get charged for receiving, and charged for listening.

You mean about your car warranty expiring? LOL

Yeah, there are lots of little hooks like that while roaming. Like you can call home for free on WiFi from Sydney, but are charged to order a pizza from across the street on WiFi. That's why I am such an advocate of using IMS while traveling. (Not For Pizza, However) Your second line does all the heavy lifting while keeping your regular voice line available and active. It is such a simple system also. I am currently wondering if my Apple Watch "Walkie Talkie" feature will also work while IMS is active. It seems to me like it should, but needs to be confirmed internationally. I just got my wife an Apple Watch, so we are trying to use that feature where it might be appropriate.

That's interesting. I've never been charged for calls I never picked up while roaming (based on the three biggies here in Canada). I've also never been charged for the initial SMSs on two of those providers when you land and connect (I get an SMS saying I'm roaming from my provider when I first power on my phone and then a second or two later I get an SMS from the partner provider saying welcome to X from provider). I've never tried sending or asking a friend to send a message to me to see if there is a charge. While in the US, I have a feature that charges me a daily charge to use my regular pool of time (not sure if it still exists as I haven't gotten on a plane since the start of the pandemic)... when I go to Asia, I usually switch to a local provider asap.

This has been my preference too, hence why I've always preferred GSM over CDMA carriers. The appeal of T-Mobile is that unlike any (?) other US carrier, international roaming charges aren't assessed, and although at greatly reduced speeds, it suffices to check email, texting and simple searches. The exception is that if you receive a voicemail, they will charge the int'l roaming per minute accordingly.

Of course, to keep that from happening, one could call T-Mobile and disable voicemail for the duration of the trip.

I can't speak for Canadian carriers but I do know that on US T-Mobile plans they will ding you $.25 per incoming call that reaches your phone while roaming internationally. I guess the logic is that they have been billed for the call even if you choose to ignore it. It still was processed by the roaming carrier as an incoming call. Here is a cut & paste from the TM website:


"Great news, there's no extra charge for people leaving a voicemail in your inbox when you are roaming internationally. However, you will be charged for the following:

• If your phone is on when you get an incoming call, even if you don't answer it and it goes to voicemail, the call is charged one minute for the call coming in to the phone. (There are no charges at all if your phone is turned off.)
• If you call your voicemail from your mobile phone to listen to messages, that call will be charged at the international roaming rate of the country you're in."

This seems to imply that it has to go to voicemail, however that has not been my experience from travel companions on my account. I do not know at what point they consider it going to voicemail. That may just be an automatic "Feature" they include whether you decline the call or just let it ring out.

In the "much before times" I'd carry two phones (As I had CDMA before they phased it out here).... my Canadian phone would only be online for a short time when I arrived at my destination to let my family know I'd arrived safely... and I'd pick up a sim card (based on destination) and then email them the contact details for my local phone. Then once we got moved over to 4G, single phone. I currently have two phones now but only to support two scenarios... One phone is for trusted locations (eg, Singapore and Japan). One phone I use for less trusted places where my phone might get compromised (eg China... now HK as well). Unfortunately my experiences in China made me paranoid (my gear would start alerting me to unexpected DNS redirect attempts and port probes). I don't know if it still happens or not, but I keep a separate set of phone/laptop specifically for places I don't trust and can re-image when I return.

Yesh. We don't have that (at least I haven't seen this and I do check my bills when I get back for unusual charges). Come to think of it, I don't know if I get charged as (as mentioned above) I usually change to a local sim card asap... If I have to call back from overseas, I usually use skype...

Agreed. Standard practice for the PRC, and now I'd include HK too. We use separate "clean" phones and laptops whenever anywhere in PRC controlled territory, and conduct a full low level format once we've returned Stateside. I even assume every stay in my hotel is bugged 24/7, and conduct business and any phones convos/emails with that in mind.

I don't think I'd go that far, but I'm not doing business there. (at least not in the current climate) It's interesting to see the game of cat and mouse being played. You hear about all these espionage tools and tactics...

Curiously, I'm wondering how susceptible non-jailbroken iphones are to being subverted (eg, if you go to China with a regular iphone and don't install any apps or turn on any auto updates). I've never owned an iphone and I've never taken an Apple product into China before. Maybe I should research the best practices for this. :)

I'm utterly paranoid, and always err on the side of caution. I came of age during the Cold War, and I've learned to be very careful, especially when abroad.

Ah, I've generally only used iPhones or Macbooks when traveling abroad. While I have no need to jailbreak my phones, far as I know, when an iPhone is locked, it's not easy to break into. Moreover, the "Find my iPhone" feature allows the user to easily locate or erase the contents remotely. Aside from my preference for Apple's ecosystem, I really don't have strong feelings for iOS vs Adroid, one way or the other.

The problem is, there is always stuff that can be done, but I'll just chalk it up to "you can only do so much". Case in point, I could always spend a half hour inspecting my room for surveillance... put a radio against a window... snake a cam in any vents, constantly play music in a room, etc. but how far do I go?

Don't talk out loud about any sensitive information (eg, don't repeat your bank account number out loud while typing it in), make sure you have a VPN enabled (preferably one you can control) and don't install unknown apps (or use "burner" phones which you can wipe when you get home... Put an alarm on your hotel room door and that's about it. Any sensitive info on my laptop would be encrypted, but there's not much else I can do.

Well, Pegasus used a flaw in how messages worked... but it wasn't persistent... a reboot would resolve the issue... but you've got to wonder what else is out there... I think Apple is also suing the company which makes Pegasus... would be interesting to see. Samsung also has a feature to wipe a phone, but that's assuming you can get to a browser to do it (and whoever has it doesn't have a deadzone/faraday cage to prevent contact)

I might pick up an older iphone to see how this works... Unfortunately I can't justify the price...

The only workaround I know is to setup unconditional call forward on your T-Mobile line. That's the only way I know to avoid the $.25 charge.

Not exactly my area, but what's the price difference between a similar iPhone and Android? At most, about $100?