Noise-canceling Headphones Recommendation Request
Feb 16, 2018, 1:56 pm
#16
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 208
I have a medical issue that requires me to avoid loud/sustained noise, and I fly a lot so this issue is important to me.
I've tried many solutions, although I am limited because I'm one of those people who have 'unusual' ears and I can't use earbuds or any off-the-shelf earphones that just hang in the ear. They just fall out immediately!
I've tried:
- Shure EC series earphones in a custom sleeve made by an audiologist
- Westone 230 earphones in a custom sleeve made by an audiologist
- Bose QA35 2 that I borrowed from my partner a few times
My general feeling is:
For noise-cancelling, yes the Bose are fantastic. They work well and are comfortable. The problem for me is:
1) they are not huge, but not that small either and I really like to travel light. When packed in my carryon, these seem big to me.
2) Noise-cancellation just isn't the same as isolation, and when you have a neurological issue that demands noise avoidance (rather than just perceived noise avoidance) it's not quite as good. I get a headache after 8 hours without some noise reduction. The noise cancelling system certainly solves this, but not perfectly. The noise cancelling will introduce new noise to cancel out the airplane noise which results in a sort or artifact that many people feel us pressure, a hum, or some other detectable effect. It's not much and most people don't care, but for me it leads me to try something else.
Meanwhile, the in-ears are fantastic, and I have come to really prefer noise isolation as opposed to cancelling. I know this seems picky to most, but I see it this way:
- my custom earphones are incredibly comfortable, I don't feel them at all
- they are about the same price or a hair more, all-in ($100 to the audiologist)
- the isolation is so good, when they are professionally fitted, that I am able to use much lower volume that I can with the Bose. In other words, if I'm plugged into the airplane entertainment system, I notice that if I use the Bose it sounds terrific but I need it to be a bit louder to really 'hear' it nicely. With the isolation of the earphones and no sound artifacts in the mix, I can keep it much quieter and hear just as clearly. I have had both on a long-haul and tested them - there is simply less noise in the earphones so both the background/plane noise and the media I'm listening to are quiter.
- they are tiny. a little case smaller than a pack of cigarettes
One thing I like about the Bose is the wireless, and also the google assistant, and ability to use bluetooth with other devices. But, i am just trying to keep it quiet on an airplane, so I will stick with the in-ears for now.
I've tried many solutions, although I am limited because I'm one of those people who have 'unusual' ears and I can't use earbuds or any off-the-shelf earphones that just hang in the ear. They just fall out immediately!
I've tried:
- Shure EC series earphones in a custom sleeve made by an audiologist
- Westone 230 earphones in a custom sleeve made by an audiologist
- Bose QA35 2 that I borrowed from my partner a few times
My general feeling is:
For noise-cancelling, yes the Bose are fantastic. They work well and are comfortable. The problem for me is:
1) they are not huge, but not that small either and I really like to travel light. When packed in my carryon, these seem big to me.
2) Noise-cancellation just isn't the same as isolation, and when you have a neurological issue that demands noise avoidance (rather than just perceived noise avoidance) it's not quite as good. I get a headache after 8 hours without some noise reduction. The noise cancelling system certainly solves this, but not perfectly. The noise cancelling will introduce new noise to cancel out the airplane noise which results in a sort or artifact that many people feel us pressure, a hum, or some other detectable effect. It's not much and most people don't care, but for me it leads me to try something else.
Meanwhile, the in-ears are fantastic, and I have come to really prefer noise isolation as opposed to cancelling. I know this seems picky to most, but I see it this way:
- my custom earphones are incredibly comfortable, I don't feel them at all
- they are about the same price or a hair more, all-in ($100 to the audiologist)
- the isolation is so good, when they are professionally fitted, that I am able to use much lower volume that I can with the Bose. In other words, if I'm plugged into the airplane entertainment system, I notice that if I use the Bose it sounds terrific but I need it to be a bit louder to really 'hear' it nicely. With the isolation of the earphones and no sound artifacts in the mix, I can keep it much quieter and hear just as clearly. I have had both on a long-haul and tested them - there is simply less noise in the earphones so both the background/plane noise and the media I'm listening to are quiter.
- they are tiny. a little case smaller than a pack of cigarettes
One thing I like about the Bose is the wireless, and also the google assistant, and ability to use bluetooth with other devices. But, i am just trying to keep it quiet on an airplane, so I will stick with the in-ears for now.
Feb 18, 2018, 12:37 pm
#17
Join Date: Apr 2017
Programs: AA, DL, Avis, Enterprise, National, IHG, HH, SPG/MR
Posts: 1,852
I used to use the Bose set, but recently switched to the Sony set. The latter is without a doubt better than Bose IMO. I think reviews undersell the ANC performance difference, it is very much noticeable. And the barometric calibration is not just a gimmick, it really does work.
Feb 22, 2018, 2:57 pm
#18
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Somewhere in Florida
Posts: 2,613
I'm with PaxALotl. To me, sound isolation > noise cancelling. My ears/brain don't get along well with noise cancellation. Perhaps it can fool many people, but it just increases my dizziness. I find the newer Bose headphones to be very bad about this.
My trusty Sony MD7506 (a.k.a. MDRV6) studio cans have been in my laptop bag for 10+ years now. I've been using this model for over 20 years. Not my favorite headphone for listening to music, BUT easily the most durable, repairable, and best bang-for-the-buck pair of headphones I own. My Sennheiser HD650s sound great but are too fragile for road life. For air travel, the Sonys have a nice curly cord which stays out of the way and they block out a good portion of the background noise. I find they knock down the sound of a wailing baby better than the Bose headphones do. Noise cancelling tends to focus on lower frequencies, leaving voices untouched.
If you want the ultimate, a friend puts in soft silicone earbuds then puts on regular hearing protection earmuffs over them. The earmuffs are all black and quite slim, so they look like regular headphones to everyone. I haven't come across anything which works as well as this solution... I haven't found a pair of earbuds which feels comfortable in my ears for more than a few minutes, otherwise this would be my #1 choice.
My trusty Sony MD7506 (a.k.a. MDRV6) studio cans have been in my laptop bag for 10+ years now. I've been using this model for over 20 years. Not my favorite headphone for listening to music, BUT easily the most durable, repairable, and best bang-for-the-buck pair of headphones I own. My Sennheiser HD650s sound great but are too fragile for road life. For air travel, the Sonys have a nice curly cord which stays out of the way and they block out a good portion of the background noise. I find they knock down the sound of a wailing baby better than the Bose headphones do. Noise cancelling tends to focus on lower frequencies, leaving voices untouched.
If you want the ultimate, a friend puts in soft silicone earbuds then puts on regular hearing protection earmuffs over them. The earmuffs are all black and quite slim, so they look like regular headphones to everyone. I haven't come across anything which works as well as this solution... I haven't found a pair of earbuds which feels comfortable in my ears for more than a few minutes, otherwise this would be my #1 choice.
Feb 22, 2018, 3:38 pm
#19
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: gggrrrovvveee (ORD)
Programs: UA Pt, Marriott Ti, Hertz PC
Posts: 6,091
If you want the ultimate, a friend puts in soft silicone earbuds then puts on regular hearing protection earmuffs over them. The earmuffs are all black and quite slim, so they look like regular headphones to everyone. I haven't come across anything which works as well as this solution... I haven't found a pair of earbuds which feels comfortable in my ears for more than a few minutes, otherwise this would be my #1 choice.
What I will do on redeye flights when I want to get some sleep is insert foam ear plugs, then put on my Bose headphones + eye mask. That combination basically serves as an isolation chamber.
I do agree that the pressure from the Bose (and I think the Sony's, from what I've heard) is something that takes getting used to. My wife hates it.
Feb 23, 2018, 3:38 am
#20
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 208
This gets into the convoluted discussion of 'perceived sound reduction' vs. actual sound reduction. Does active noise cancellation actually reduce sound overall? Yes, but not exactly as advertised. By creating the disruptive wave, i.e. amplitude opposite the original sound, the sound is theoretically eliminated. In practice, there are a lot of factors including the shape of the area between the headphones and your ear, the frequency of the sound, the latency of the cancelling system, and all of the artifacts from inaccuracies in the microphones in the headphones and sound that slips through through the space around your ears or even your head.
Take the frequency for example - so many people turn on the active noise cancelling (ACN) and are thrilled to hear a wonderful, obvious, dramatic reduction in the low, droning rumble we experience on a flight. It's impressive, and many a passenger tries it and buys them right there at the kiosk. But there is a difference between 'it sounds much quieter' and 'i am less affected by the noise'. Much of the high frequency sounds will still get through, because the ACN is so much less effective at dealing with high frequency sound. Now, which would you rather subject yourself to, a constant low rumble that sounds loud to your ears, or a constant high pitch whine that is slightly less noticeable? For many people, such as migraine sufferers, the higher pitch sound can be much harder to deal with and more likely to produce a headache.
These are generalizations and because most people want reduced sound simply because it's more pleasant when things don't seem so loud, the Bose QC's are wonderful. But, for people who are a bit more sensitive to the sound (not just annoyed by it) it's not always a solution.
Personally, I have never understood why noise cancellation is so desirable as compared to isolation. If you can reduce noise from a wide range of frequencies by 38db using a smaller, non-powered device, isn't that better than removing 25db's of noise from a very uneven frequency range using batteries and a larger device?
Also the in-ears, when done right, are pretty incredibly comfortable. The only annoyance is that when a flight attendant speaks to me, I need to crack one of the in-ears a bit so I can hear what they are saying. That says a lot right there. Long live custom earphones!
Take the frequency for example - so many people turn on the active noise cancelling (ACN) and are thrilled to hear a wonderful, obvious, dramatic reduction in the low, droning rumble we experience on a flight. It's impressive, and many a passenger tries it and buys them right there at the kiosk. But there is a difference between 'it sounds much quieter' and 'i am less affected by the noise'. Much of the high frequency sounds will still get through, because the ACN is so much less effective at dealing with high frequency sound. Now, which would you rather subject yourself to, a constant low rumble that sounds loud to your ears, or a constant high pitch whine that is slightly less noticeable? For many people, such as migraine sufferers, the higher pitch sound can be much harder to deal with and more likely to produce a headache.
These are generalizations and because most people want reduced sound simply because it's more pleasant when things don't seem so loud, the Bose QC's are wonderful. But, for people who are a bit more sensitive to the sound (not just annoyed by it) it's not always a solution.
Personally, I have never understood why noise cancellation is so desirable as compared to isolation. If you can reduce noise from a wide range of frequencies by 38db using a smaller, non-powered device, isn't that better than removing 25db's of noise from a very uneven frequency range using batteries and a larger device?
Also the in-ears, when done right, are pretty incredibly comfortable. The only annoyance is that when a flight attendant speaks to me, I need to crack one of the in-ears a bit so I can hear what they are saying. That says a lot right there. Long live custom earphones!
Feb 23, 2018, 7:32 am
#21
Moderator: American AAdvantage, Travel Safety/Security & Texas, FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: AUS / GRK
Programs: AA, HHonors, Hertz
Posts: 13,484
I actually have 3 different earphones/headphones that I travel with. On long flights I'll often rotate among them:
* Bose QC25
* Bose SoundSport (intended for working out)
* Apple AirPods
As someone else noted, the QC's will sometimes make my ears warm, and if worn really long make them hurt. So I'll do an hour or 2 with them, then 30 min or so with one of the others (usually combined with a break to get up, stretch, and visit the restroom). I often keep my AirPods in a pocket, and the SoundSport clipped to my belt when I travel (although I often change into track pants for flights over about 6 hours).
* Bose QC25
* Bose SoundSport (intended for working out)
* Apple AirPods
As someone else noted, the QC's will sometimes make my ears warm, and if worn really long make them hurt. So I'll do an hour or 2 with them, then 30 min or so with one of the others (usually combined with a break to get up, stretch, and visit the restroom). I often keep my AirPods in a pocket, and the SoundSport clipped to my belt when I travel (although I often change into track pants for flights over about 6 hours).
Feb 25, 2018, 8:07 am
#22
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,368
Personally, I have never understood why noise cancellation is so desirable as compared to isolation. If you can reduce noise from a wide range of frequencies by 38db using a smaller, non-powered device, isn't that better than removing 25db's of noise from a very uneven frequency range using batteries and a larger device?
Also the in-ears, when done right, are pretty incredibly comfortable. The only annoyance is that when a flight attendant speaks to me, I need to crack one of the in-ears a bit so I can hear what they are saying. That says a lot right there. Long live custom earphones!
Also the in-ears, when done right, are pretty incredibly comfortable. The only annoyance is that when a flight attendant speaks to me, I need to crack one of the in-ears a bit so I can hear what they are saying. That says a lot right there. Long live custom earphones!
off the subway or walking on the street, i use monitor mode (Which allows you to hear the surrounding). your custom in-ear doesn't allow that without breaking the seal
have you actually tried the qc20? there's barely any seal/pressure - the tip just rests in my ear, and it doesn't get disturbed even if I roll my ear on a pillow
I used to use these, which require a proper seal. Slight movement = seal broken = NC doesn't work.
for your custom sleeve, how much pressure/picky is the seal?
(or at least stop by a bose retail store and try them out)
(look at the Comfort/Breathability section)
https://www.rtings.com/headphones/re...elling-earbuds
https://www.rtings.com/headphones/re...uietcomfort-25
Last edited by paperwastage; Feb 25, 2018 at 8:13 am
Feb 25, 2018, 9:39 am
#23
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 208
I've tried the QC20 at an airport kiosk, but because my ears are wierdly shaped, they won't stay in so I can't really have an opinion on them.
If you neednto be able to talt to people lle or hear your surroundings the customs arent ideal. The seal is not tight but you cant hear anything unless you crack the seal by pushing the earphone out of alignmenta That gets a little comfortable after a few seconds because the inside wall of the ear canal isn't used to having any pressure.
For me, these just for long flying so I like the setup.
If you neednto be able to talt to people lle or hear your surroundings the customs arent ideal. The seal is not tight but you cant hear anything unless you crack the seal by pushing the earphone out of alignmenta That gets a little comfortable after a few seconds because the inside wall of the ear canal isn't used to having any pressure.
For me, these just for long flying so I like the setup.
Feb 25, 2018, 10:38 am
#24
Moderator: American AAdvantage, Travel Safety/Security & Texas, FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: AUS / GRK
Programs: AA, HHonors, Hertz
Posts: 13,484
Just means I need to do another mileage run to Shanghai
Feb 26, 2018, 11:53 am
#25
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 525
I used to have the QC15s then upgraded to the QC20s. I will probably never go back to over ear headphones. I find the noise cancellation on the QC15s fine but the QC20s are superior IMO.
Over ear headphones are hard to sleep in, and the QC15s (at QC25s) will die when the battery runs out. I found my ears got warm and at times my head would hurt from having the headphones on.
The in-ear earphones seem to address all of these issues. There are 3 silicone sizes so you should find the right insert for your ear but they're also incredibly comfortable. I can lean against the wall when I sleep in Y and my ears don't get warm. There's even a button on the side to turn on the microphone so you can hear when someone is talking to you without taking off your headphones.
Now if only they are able to do a wireless without the neck apparatus, Bose would get me to buy into the next generation pretty fast.
Over ear headphones are hard to sleep in, and the QC15s (at QC25s) will die when the battery runs out. I found my ears got warm and at times my head would hurt from having the headphones on.
The in-ear earphones seem to address all of these issues. There are 3 silicone sizes so you should find the right insert for your ear but they're also incredibly comfortable. I can lean against the wall when I sleep in Y and my ears don't get warm. There's even a button on the side to turn on the microphone so you can hear when someone is talking to you without taking off your headphones.
Now if only they are able to do a wireless without the neck apparatus, Bose would get me to buy into the next generation pretty fast.
Feb 26, 2018, 1:13 pm
#26
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,368
No need for battery, hopefully they can fit all the necessary electronics in a smaller package (so you don't have a big dongle). Only need to charge phone (though you have the same issue about not able to charge +listen at same time)
If apple moved over to usb type c, I can see Bose doing it.. right now, it's probably too much effort (compared to what they did for separate qc20i and qc20 Android version)
Last edited by paperwastage; Feb 26, 2018 at 1:24 pm
Feb 26, 2018, 4:56 pm
#27
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 525
im actually happier if they did a USB type c (and lightning ) versions
No need for battery, hopefully they can fit all the necessary electronics in a smaller package (so you don't have a big dongle). Only need to charge phone (though you have the same issue about not able to charge +listen at same time)
If apple moved over to usb type c, I can see Bose doing it.. right now, it's probably too much effort (compared to what they did for separate qc20i and qc20 Android version)
No need for battery, hopefully they can fit all the necessary electronics in a smaller package (so you don't have a big dongle). Only need to charge phone (though you have the same issue about not able to charge +listen at same time)
If apple moved over to usb type c, I can see Bose doing it.. right now, it's probably too much effort (compared to what they did for separate qc20i and qc20 Android version)
Mar 5, 2018, 9:35 am
#28
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: RDU
Programs: Marriott Platinum. AA and UA as well, but I don't care about them anymore.
Posts: 308
I'm another fan of the Bose QC-20. I had QC-15s for a number of years and loved them (except for the fact that they get hot, and they're hard to sleep in). So when the QC-20 came out, I jumped on them as an upgrade and haven't looked back.
These days, I do need wireless, but while I'd like the QC-30, I don't like that the batter life is, at best, 10 hours. That won't work well on a 14 - 16 hour long haul (which is about the max amount of battery life I get on the QC-20 on a single charge). So I've ultimately paired my QC-20s with a cheap Bluetooth receiver and they now wirelessly connect to my iPhone or iPad.
I'm also not sure about sleeping with that thing around my neck for the QC-30, so when these finally start giving up, I may try to find another pair of QC-20s instead, unless Bose has updated them with better battery life.
but that said, I spend at least $600 on various ANC headphones before finally buying that first pair of Bose for another $300. I'd have been better off just buying the Bose initially...
These days, I do need wireless, but while I'd like the QC-30, I don't like that the batter life is, at best, 10 hours. That won't work well on a 14 - 16 hour long haul (which is about the max amount of battery life I get on the QC-20 on a single charge). So I've ultimately paired my QC-20s with a cheap Bluetooth receiver and they now wirelessly connect to my iPhone or iPad.
I'm also not sure about sleeping with that thing around my neck for the QC-30, so when these finally start giving up, I may try to find another pair of QC-20s instead, unless Bose has updated them with better battery life.
but that said, I spend at least $600 on various ANC headphones before finally buying that first pair of Bose for another $300. I'd have been better off just buying the Bose initially...
