If buying Android, I would only recommend one of the Nexus devices for the ongoing software support.

Kindle Fire will work in all those capacities except for "logging into my bank account". No problem if you use the web interface. You might find difficulties in obtaining bank-provided apps. Kindle Fire only uses Amazon's app store, and not the de facto Google Play app store. Most companies only release their apps on Google Play and forget about the existence of third party app stores. While it is possible to install Google Play on a Kindle Fire (HD), it is a huge undertaking and only for technically inclined power users.

I'm looking at the Asus Nexus 7 which is Android 4.1 OS and has a quad-core processor and 32gb memory.
Right now they're going for about $250.
However, the new/updated model is due out in July so prices on the current one will likely drop significantly.

True, I debated on holding off & waiting for the newer model/better specs - but, you would be playing the chase game again & again. Meanwhile, I'm very happy with my WiFi only - N7 32 GB model. Resale value on eBay has been holding up nicely thus far.

It's easy to root but there is no need to run any custom rom, latest stock Rom 4.2.2 is as perfect as Google can get it to become, ditto for a custom kernel for gamers looking for speed or those looking for even longer battery life. It's easy to slip into a jacket, vest and corner of a briefcase, or just carry it in one hand to go & use anywhere and everywhere.

Bonus for VZW Fios and wireless users are its extra Big Red apps like remote feature, media manager, voice mail & call logs, and read SMS/reply from the tablet. NFC chip/Google Wallets, the latest Google Apps w/o bloatware and "Now" plus off-line reading of downloaded contents as 32GB is very usable. Watch CNN Live right on it when I'm doing work at the home office den - and, over WiFi - link with Drive/Sky Drive & Dropbox to store/retrieve items in Cloud storage. Finance accounts and banking app right on it - the only negative that I wish it has is a rear HD camera, but otherwise, it's good to Skype others or brag about Hangouts, the newest. It's a capable GPS unit with offline maps and POI data loaded and easy to set it stationary inside the car to watch a few Youtube videos while waiting tethered to a faster Wifi connection (AirBuds for airtravel as a compact package ...)

There are times that I do like to play with Mrs. L's iPad if we are at home as the screen is bigger. The Nexus 7 can be completed by spending no more than $400 including a good protective case, OTG cable for external storage/access, and a compatible BT Keyboard (Logitech has gotten very good reviews) Otherwise, take a closeup look at the iPad Mini - especially if you are on the road a lot, and make sure your own IT dept and support/help desk has what it need to run your specific apps.

I know this forum has a very strong anti-Apple bias but try to stay on topic and not make the discussion about me. Did you have anything to actually contribute to the discussion, or are you just looking to lash out?

If I were to lash out, it would be only to knock that huge chip off your shoulder :)

The thread is about tablets. Please try to stay on topic, or bother some other thread.

And, there you go again.

And, again. Snarky comments which have nothing to do with the topic are not helpful to the OP. Do you have anything relevant & on-topic to add?

I'd say that the OP has gotten some helpful advice by now and probably should get out into the stores to play with the devices to get a "feel" for which one best suits their purpose.

In the US, the XPS 10 has been near-constantly on sale on the Dell Outlet, so those who don't mind refurbs might want to check there.

One of my coworkers got a Latitude 10 (full Win8, not RT) and loves it, and while it's a bit pokey compared to the Surface Pro (Atom vs. i5) it is in most other ways a much nicer experience having played with both.

I'm not sure it matters as much as it used to; Samsung has gotten much better about updates, and frankly, so far there is not much that has changed since ICS that most folks would care about except Google Now (and many of us find that annoying and creepy, rather than helpful.)

--

Personally, if I wanted to buy a tablet right now but didn't HAVE to do so immediately I'd be waiting to see what the pricing was on the GT 3 7.0 and what the next version of the Nexus 7 were like.

If I had to buy a tablet right now, I'd bite the bullet and buy a Note 8; it offers more than I need at a higher price than I want to pay, but the screen and CPU on the GT2 7.0 are limiting, as is the lack of an SD card slot on the Nexus 7.

Lenovo 27" Horizon - perfect for your meal tray in coach.

Or the Sony Vaio Tap 20" if you want something a bit more compact.

This is a parody, right? Your 20" thread (which you bumped) pointed out that that one is going to be too wide for many coach seats. The 27" one won't be usable in landscape in most domestic US first seats. In portrait, either one will be so tall that if the seat in front reclines at all, it will be tilted forward towards you unless the base is in your lap.

Add in the disappointing resolution on the tap, and a battery life that will barely make it from NYC to Chicago...

You're an angry man. Or woman, I didn't bother looking, sorry.

There's nothing wrong with using 20" in F. I've since tried it if you care to read my thread correctly, to which by the way, I added a link to an article showing how big (small) the Tap 20 is in the London Underground.

NYC to Chicago in F? I try to fly with a carrier that provides power, but generally tend to fly further afar at any one time.

What exactly is your problem with any of this?

You confuse critical with angry. When you're OMNI qualified, I can refer you to some actual examples of "angry" on OMNI/PR.

As for man, or woman, or AI, I refer you to the following cartoon:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...ternet_dog.jpg

20", probably not (although a few of the tighter-pitched domestic F might be a challenge, due to the recline of the seat in front.)

27", you're pushing both width, and on regular recliner seats, height as well. Or you're going to be very hunched over... (and quite possibly running out of pitch, in some of the less generous domestic seats.)

Tried it in Y, or J/F?

Saw it. The humor of the latter seems to have gone right over your head.

The 27" model (I misread, and thought it was the 20" I was looking at) quotes a battery life of two hours. The 20" quotes a battery life, only marginally better, of 2:45. Very limited by laptop standards, and utterly pathetic by tablet standards.

The example of NYC to Chicago was just an example of a roughly-two-hour flight.

As for power, it's nice if you can get it. Quite a few airlines don't provide it at all in Y (not that either of those are likely to fit any better than a full-size 14" or 15" laptop) or in very limited numbers of seats (as on AA.) Even where you're supposed to have it, my experience has been that while it usually works as advertised it's hardly 100% reliable (ignoring things like AA taking it down on entire aircraft types, which is unusual.)

Two threads on the same thing months ago, bumped the antique thread, and pushing a niche use case that very few others would be interested in.

That's a lot of work for a leg pull, and at the same time, I can't imagine what your interest is in boosting such an odd niche product.

So basically by discussing this, and a case that might be used to carry it (what niche case are you referring to? A Pelican? Rimowa? The Sony Tap 20 Case they sell? - none of these are exactly niche cases any more than an iPad cover is 'niche') somehow this gets you angry or paranoid when in fact what I am discussing is something you wouldn't understand - there's a bunch of people in the creative arts (like me, for example) who fly and need the largest screen they can fly with. Read my posts carefully about the history of it all, with the 21" and 27" iMacs people used to - and still do - lug around.

The article linked was useful and not humor at all. There are plenty of people I know using 20" laptops in cafes going back 5+ years now. I've seen them.

If you'd care to contribute to the thread without attacking people based on your paranoid views of people 'pushing' 'odd niche product[s]' then go ahead, but please take your medicine first.

By the way, did you hear about the iPad? It was a niche product too at one time, probably according to you. Do I have your permission to post something about that one?

Or they're just Apple fanbois.

Some interesting recommendations. For what you actually describe you might want to have a look at the 8.9 inch Kindle Fire HD. There's the wifi version for ~$270 and the LTE connected version for ~$400 (plus carrier data charges). I don't own one, but I've used one a wee bit over the last few months and it's nice. Nothing spectacular except that it just works.

HTC, MSI, and Sony all do nice tablets that would probably fit the bill, although the HTC crews through battery. Much as I hate to say it, the MS Surface Pro would also fit the bill for what you describe.

Those reasons would primarily be that marketing works, and Apple certainly does have a spectacularly good marketing dept.

apple could make a tablet that runs OSX (id buy one, OP could use one) but they wont

im not a fan of apple gadgets nor the gadgets that copied them

actually, they did. both ios and mac os x are based on os x.

you're thinking of a tablet running mac os x, which makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. mac os x is not a touch-based operating system. it would be a dismal failure. there have been windows tablets for the past decade. how many of those do you see in use?

what apple did was take their desktop os (mac os x) and redesign it for touch (ios). that's why it's as successful as it is.

they're not gadgets.

:rolleyes:

all ios does is sell "apps" just like subsequent android/etc

I've switched over to a Microsoft Surface RT from an iPad + Sony laptop.

For tablet duties like apps and web browsing I still think the iPad was a bit better/smoother, but the Surface does enough "real computer" duties that it lets me leave the laptop at home when I travel. I used to have to lug the laptop for presentations, editing powerpoint/word/excel documents and so forth, and I'd use the iPad for "fun". The Surface is a bit of a jack of all trades, master of none, but it's awesome for travelling. The touch keyboard is pretty cool.

On my last trip I ran out of space on my digital camera, but I could plug the camera into the USB port on my Surface, upload the files to Flickr, and clear off the camera to make more space. And after checking in with the airline, I could plug it into the printer at the hotel and print off my boarding pass. Try that with an iPad or Galaxy tablet!

Typical Microsoft though, it does feel a bit like a beta product. I think when they get this thing right it's going to really catch on.

RT pro only runs full operating system in desktop mode correct?

im wondering if vaio and lenovo mentioned in Ory's thread run full operating system as tablet
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/trave...e-desktop.html

Marketing does not create repeat purchases, and Apple iPad owners have a much higher retention rate than Android owners. The same is true for the iPhone. It is the USER EXPERIENCE that sells, and retains Apple products.

iOS is not OS X in the sense most people mean in; the fact that there is a second sense of OS X (the Darwin kernel, etc) which runs behind OS X is an irrelevance, and is rather like saying "Android is Linux" -- well, if you're an embedded Linux developer looking to modify the Android OS, that's a useful truth... for pretty much anyone else, it's a factoid that happens to be true, but not in anyway useful.

To most people, what OS something runs is the combination of the UI (almost completely different in both cases, even if it's something that runs on TOP of the underlying OS kernel and libraries, which might or might not be hte same) and even more importantly, the software it can run. And in that case, Android, iOS, OS X, and Linux are all almost entirely unrelated.

"Gadget" is in the eye of the beholder. ::rolleyes:

The opposite: while RT still has a desktop mode, you pretty much can't get software for it. RT only takes software compiled specifically for RT, which is only available via Microsoft's store, which only accepts "modern UI" software (at this point, at least.)

They're both full x86 PCs (and could be reformatted with Win 7, Linux, whatever you want, although they'd be pretty awkward with anything but Windows 8 or maybe the touch flavors of Ububtu.)

Don't discount ecosystem lock-in.

I have no prejudice against Apple, but am getting on very well with my Nexus 7 since getting it in December 12..

I use a small adaptor (£1.69) to allow use of USB peripherals such as pen drives and bigger portable drives.

I've used it at a number of trade shows and meetings to show installation videos of our equipment while talking to customers - the speed and quality is outstanding.
(of course you could use a larger tablet for this too but the 7" suits me better)

I use Evernote on it to take notes in meetings (now that I've mastered "swiping" words on the keyboard)


I even got one for my technophobic wife, which she gets on fine with too (she only uses it for Skyping the kids, checking out wedding photos and local properties for sale and catching up on Coronation St)

Marketing /= advertising, which is what I think you mistook me for saying.

And I'd disagree on the point you make: overall, marketing does create repeat business, along with, as someone else pointed out, lock in. That's why it (marketing, and the subsection of it, advertising) exists.

i don't know about a galaxy tablet but i've done it with an ipad on more than one occasion, although the upload was not to flickr.

why do you think it can't be done?

mobile boarding pass.

an ipad is a tablet computer. it is not a gadget any more than an ultrabook laptop is a gadget.

ah, used wrong wording in last post.

"surface pro"

unbelievable that microsoft beat apple to market

huh? microsoft is playing catchup to apple in the tablet space. the surface tablets (and windows 8 for that matter) aren't exactly a runaway success either.

To plenty of people ANY computer is a gadget.

again, i like OSX, and only use it at the moment, but will never buy an apple product that does not run OSX

why? that's just silly.

tablets are not a replacement for a laptop or a desktop, whether it's an ipad or an android tablet, and running the same desktop apps on a tablet makes very little sense. they need to be redesigned for touch.

tablets are a new form factor with apps that could never exist on a traditional computer.

RT and Pro are different. Pro is like a full fledged laptop, RT is closer to an iPad. It has a desktop, but it's only good for File Explorer, Office, and other system stuff - can't install desktop apps.

How did you do that? My iPad doesn't have an SD card slot (Surface does) or a USB port (Surface does). My iPad could print to special airplay printers, but I didn't have one, nor did my office, my local bestbuy or any hotel I've ever been to. My iPad also doesn't have a file browser or decent office apps.

Basically any PC USB accessories work with the Surface which is just awesome. I plug in a mouse when I need to really work on a powerpoint deck (touch just doesn't do it for that), I can plug in my clicker for when I'm on the road doing presentations.. the flexibility of a real USB port is just great. Printers, USB keys, mice, keyboards, you name it they just work.

It's a bit slow and clunky at times compared to the ipad, but it's so functional. I can't wait for a faster one to come out.

If I were a consumer that only needed a tablet for web browsing and playing with apps I'd probably still go iPad though. But if you find yourself carrying a work laptop AND an iPad like I did, the Surface is a good option.

get the camera connection kit. pop an sd card in or connect directly to the camera via usb. works great.

another side benefit of the camera connection kit is that it works with some usb peripherals, such as usb keyboards and microphones. however, i find a bluetooth keyboard is far more convenient for the rare times i need a keyboard.

many printers these days support airprint and they are definitely available at best buy and other stores. walmart lists 36 different ones, starting at under $60, while best buy has 6.

another option is run an app on your computer (mac or windows) that supports airprint, making any printer connected to that computer (direct or network) airprint capable. that might not work so well in a hotel unless you can install it on one of their machines, but as i said, mobile boarding pass.

it doesn't need the former and apple's keynote, numbers and pages are quite good. microsoft is working on office for the ipad but supposedly they're delaying it so to not cannibalize surface.

Well, I already have a surface now and honestly I'm not looking back.

Keynote, numbers, and pages are *terrible* if you need them for work. They did the absolute basics but that's about it. They couldn't use half the documents I needed to open. I can't project from an iPad, and none of our global offices have airprint printers so the fact that you can technically go buy airprint printers doesn't help me.

And the touch cover is just awesome.

If Office was out for iPad back when I still had one that might've swayed me, but I'm really happy that I switched for my usage. I wouldn't tell my mom to go get a Surface because for her an iPad is better, but for my needs the Surface is way better.

Even with Office on an iPad I still couldn't project, open files, go to file shares, connect to office printers, use USB keys, etc. I'd still have to carry a laptop AND the iPad.

Like I said, jack of all trades, master of none. iPad is definitely better at lots of things, but it can't replace my laptop.

yes you can. get an ipad-vga or ipad-hdmi adapter. works quite well. there are lightning port versions available too.

install airprint software (i dont remember what it's called) on a machine in the office somewhere.

yes, it is, and there are now similar keyboard covers for the ipad too.

an ipad is not intended to be a laptop replacement. if you spend your days using microsoft office, then you want a laptop, but for other tasks, an ipad can be more suitable. there's no one system that does everything well.

how do you know what microsoft office on an ipad can or can't do, when it hasn't been released yet? also, your list is rather amusing. what good would an office app be if it could not open files? of course it's going to open files.

it's not supposed to replace a laptop, but surprisingly, for many people it does.

I think you're missing the point of what I'm saying. The surface CAN replace my laptop for my travelling duties.

I'm sure I could cobble together what I need from an iPad if I was willing to install servers in all of our global offices to support airprint, carry an SD card reader, another adapter for video output, and just deal with it when I can't browse a file share (sure, probably there's some app somewhere that can do this). At that point I might as well just carry a laptop as well, which is what I was trying to avoid.

Why go through all that effort? There's another box at the store that can do what I need without all sorts of crazy workarounds and gadgets dangling off the side of it.

I'm not saying Office on iPad (that as far as we know doesn't exist) couldn't open files, I'm saying there's no file browser on the iPad. There's probably an app somewhere that can do it, but it's annoying that I can't just click a link in an email to open an intranet file share, find the file I'm looking for, double click and open it. This works on my Surface.

I don't know why you're arguing so vehemently that iPad can do all of this stuff. You *can* change the oil on your car with nothing but a pan and a rag, but it's a lot easier with the right wrench. For what I use a tablet for in particular, the surface is the easiest tool for the job. I used to have an iPad, but I sold it on craigslist after picking up a Surface RT. Surely for others the iPad will be better and for others an Android would be better. YMMV.

Fanboyism doesn't do anyone any good. When iPad is better (again) I'll buy an iPad (again). Right now Surface makes my job easier than the iPad does.

At this point I think this conversation has run its course. Thanks for the dialog, I am out.

...or not. The beauty of a convertible as that you get both. Even Apple, while their own design of a keyboard dock stunk, recognized that. Third party keyboard docks and cases have been much better.

Such as?

I've yet to see anything that works better with touch than with a mouse, keyboard, or both (or a graphics tablet) -- not saying they don't exist, but I've yet to see them.

Now mobility is another issue, although in general phones and the smaller 7" tablets do much better for that than the 10"-12" tablets which are not that much better than the smallest notebooks (whether one calls them ultrabooks/netbooks.)

And if you jailbreak, it can do anything you want with the cards, just like an Android device.

Can't use it on an airplane, or at least aren't supposed to.

"It doesn't need a file browser" is a matter of taste, not fact; some people like Apple's app-centric model hiding file management from the user. It's very limiting for some power users, and even some non-power-users who are used to the standard way of handling files.

Fortunately, this is readily fixed if you jailbreak.

Not that similar; the keyboards for the Surface (either one) or the Asus Transformer series (and a few other models) are solid, conforming, and in many cases have an extended battery.

The ones available for iPad and Samsung tablets add more bulk, as they require a backing to the tablet to hold it, and require either bluetooth or a loose cable. Beats no keyboard, but in the end they're not as good.

Also, in the case of the Surface Pro (and Dell Latitude 10, and some other models) they really do convert between what is in essence an ultrabook and a tablet.

it's a hybrid. it's also not selling that well.

you're not the typical use case for an ipad. as i said before, no one device can do everything. pick the best tool for the job. there are things surface can't do that an ipad can't. some people might have both.

ipads are not file centric. they are document centric. there is no need for a file browser. it doesn't make any sense.

you can click on a link in an email and open an attachment.

i'm not arguing at all. you said an ipad can't do a number of things which it can easily do, including offloading photos from a camera and uploading them to flickr, finding airprint printers in best buy or using a non-airprint printer and using a projector with a presenatation. an ipad can easily do all of that.

nothing wrong with that. i never said an ipad is for everyone.

a convertible has tradeoffs. everything has tradeoffs.

apps that can't exist on a laptop include ones that use the built in gps, gyroscope, accelerometer, compass, always-on internet, rear-facing camera (laptops are front facing). also, tablet apps are more immersive, making for a better user experience.

some examples include astronomy apps where you just hold the tablet (or smartphone) up to the sky and it shows you what stars are there, and as you turn, the display moves with you, always showing you what stars are in your view. find something interesting? tap it and it details what it is. try that with a laptop.

because this is flyertalk, point the device at a plane in the sky and it tells you what flight it is. another example is flying a quad-copter just by tilting the device.

can you do those on a laptop? somewhat, but nowhere near as easily and with not as good of a user experience. you'll also need to add on a gps, joystick, another camera or other accessory, depending on the app.

that's another benefit.

true but i'm not talking about jailbreaking.

android also has restrictions, such as backup apps that require rooting to be able to access user data.

so? most of the time i'm on the ground. when i'm on a plane i usually watch a movie.

file system access is going away and it's not just apple. nobody wants to fuss with files and folders. that's something the computer is much better at.

with apps such as adobe lightroom (which predates the ipad and runs on both mac & windows), you query for photos based on content and the computer figures out where the acutal file is.

there's nothing to fix. the computer does a better job of managing files than people do.

they look and function the same. the fact that one is bluetooth and the other is direct doesn't matter.

as for the extended battery, they need it. surface pro battery life is not particularly good.

and don't do a very good job of either one. just look at sales.

Indeed. It's why the Bugatti Veyron is clearly such a poor sports car compared to the Ford Mustang. After all, sales numbers are the only measure. :rolleyes: