Go Back  FlyerTalk Forums > Travel&Dining > Travel Photography
Reload this Page >

Camcorder Editing software

Camcorder Editing software

Old Oct 1, 2007, 10:23 am
  #1  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Peterborough, UK
Programs: Mileage Plus - Premier Associate Elite Nomination
Posts: 32
Camcorder Editing software

Hello guys

I've just come back from a great vacation in Vegas, got some good stuff of the water show at the Belliagio etc, though the clip started 1 minute to early before the show, can any of you recommend any software to take out that bit not needed. Will send to you when done

30GB Sony Hard Disc Camcorder

Thanks
Andrew
AndrewHearne is offline  
Old Oct 1, 2007, 11:05 am
  #2  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Newport Beach, California, USA
Posts: 36,062
Originally Posted by AndrewHearne
Hello guys

I've just come back from a great vacation in Vegas, got some good stuff of the water show at the Belliagio etc, though the clip started 1 minute to early before the show, can any of you recommend any software to take out that bit not needed. Will send to you when done

30GB Sony Hard Disc Camcorder

Thanks
Andrew
Hard disk camcorders record in mpeg2 (and, sometimes, a proprietary flavor thereof) or mpeg4. That rules out most entry-level editing packages, which generally work with DV-codec-encoded AVI. You might look at:

VideoReDo: an inexpensive mpeg2 program that, while not a true editor, can trim unwanted sections of mpeg2 files and, usually, is fairly robust with respect to the kind of mpeg2 files that it can handle. I do not believe it will handle mpeg4.

VirtualDub: This is free, open-source software. It will let you trim your clip, but it may not work unless you can find and install the appropriate codec. I'm fairly certain there a number of mpeg4/DIVX codecs around that will work with VirtualDub. It may be harder to find an mpeg2 codec, but it's worth a try. The problem with VirtualDub (sometimes called VDub) is that, though powerful, it is awkward to use and somewhat opaque.

Didn't your camcorder come with any software?
PTravel is offline  
Old Oct 1, 2007, 1:01 pm
  #3  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Peterborough, UK
Programs: Mileage Plus - Premier Associate Elite Nomination
Posts: 32
Hi

Thanks, still a bit jetlag and not had chance to look properly yet lol, but thanks for heads up just incase if I don't have any
AndrewHearne is offline  
Old Oct 1, 2007, 5:00 pm
  #4  
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: BUR
Programs: in C/C++, Python, SQL
Posts: 342
Is this lack of software compatability a reason not to buy a hard drive camcorder? I realize this is taking the thread a bit OT, but I'm trying to decide on a new camcorder, and I'm trying to figure out what storage medium to use. I had been leaning toward a hard drive, but these posts scared me a bit. Or am I just being too alarmist? I.e., there should be software with the camera, and once I get past the editing, all the DVD authoring and such would be the same.
Scott in LA is offline  
Old Oct 1, 2007, 5:38 pm
  #5  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Newport Beach, California, USA
Posts: 36,062
Originally Posted by Scott in LA
Is this lack of software compatability a reason not to buy a hard drive camcorder? I realize this is taking the thread a bit OT, but I'm trying to decide on a new camcorder, and I'm trying to figure out what storage medium to use. I had been leaning toward a hard drive, but these posts scared me a bit. Or am I just being too alarmist? I.e., there should be software with the camera, and once I get past the editing, all the DVD authoring and such would be the same.
The problem isn't one of compatibility -- mpeg2 and mpeg4 are both standards. The problem is one of temporal compression -- temporally-compressed video (at least standard-definition video -- more on that later) is intended as a delivery medium, not an acquisition medium. Temporal compression works by identifying a reference frame and then storing only calculated changes between the reference frame and subsequent frame, as contrasted with non-temporally-compressed video codecs, e.g. DV-25 as used in miniDV, which compresses only within a frame, but not between frames. Temporal compression is very efficient as, unless a camera is panning, many elements within a scene will not change from frame to frame.

The problem, though, is when you want to edit temporally-compressed video. Because most frames are stored as the accumulated delta of the frames before it and the reference frame, it is very difficult to make frame-accurate cuts, i.e. either the cut must be made exactly on a reference frame, or all frames prior to the desired cut have to be uncompressed back to the most recent reference frame. This takes a fair amount of computing horsepower, and is also complex enough that many editing programs don't bother supporting temporal compression (there are, however, some entry-level programs that do).

There is an additional problem when you want to do true editing, e.g. adding titles, transitions, color correction, effects, etc. As with simple cuts, the effected frames have to be uncompressed. The effect or transition is then applied, and then the frames must be recompressed. Mpeg2/4, like many video codecs, is a lossy compression format, meaning information is lost through each transcoding. Editing mpeg in this fashion results introducing an extraneous uncompress/transcode step each time an edit is made, resulting in data loss each time. The net result is degraded video that can only be competently edited on very powerful machines. I edit in Adobe Premiere Pro on my editing computer (3GHz P4). This setup can do anything the studios can do when I'm working with DV-25 material. Premiere Pro can edit mpeg2 with the proper plugins but, when I have, it's dragged performance down to the the pull-out-your-hair level.

There are additional reasons why I recommend against hard-disk camcorders. These machines, at least in the consumer standard-definition lines, use DVD-compliant mpeg2 (or its mpeg4 equivalent) for their "high quality" setting. DVD-compliant mpeg2 is limited to a maximum bandwidth of 10 megabits per second (mbps). Lower quality settings have even lower bandwidth. MiniDV, which uses the DV-25 non-temporal standard, has a bandwidth of 25 mbps. Though mpeg is somewhat more efficient at compression than DV-25, the latter still has 250% more data throughput, resulting in significantly higher-quality video than mpeg. This difference is easily seen when you burn a DVD from a DV-25 video source. I use software transcoders that do multi-pass analysis to very high precision when I prepare DVDs from my DV-25 material. Running on a 3 GHz P4 with 1 gig of RAM, it can take as much as 24 hours to produce 2 hours of transcoded mpeg2 at the highest quality settings. Even then, the difference between the final DVD and the miniDV original is significant and easily seen. Consumer hard-drive (and DVD) camcorders do not do multi-pass analysis -- they're restricted to on-the-fly single-pass transcoding and, of course, are using far less powerful processors. The net result is video of much lower quality than can be obtained from a miniDV machine. This isn't to say that there aren't lousy miniDV machines out there -- video quality is also a function of lens quality, sensor size, electronics, etc. However, all things being equal, miniDV will always produce dramatically better video than hard-disk or DVD camcorders.

All of this changes, however, with respect to HD machines. Consumer HD is all temporally-compressed, so there's no codec-based advantage to one storage format over another. However, which codec is employed, as well as at what bandwidth, is critical. Sony makes consumer and prosumer machines that use the HDV codec, which is an mpeg2-based codec that has a 25 mbps bandwidth, just like DV-25 (though it has to store considerably more data, being HD). However, Sony also makes AVCHD-based machines which use an mpeg4-based codec. Though, theoretically, these machines are more efficient and should produce better video, Sony has arbitrarily limited the bandwidth of AVCHD to between 12 and 17 mbps. This is simply not enough for good HD reproduction, and the AVCHD machines demonstrate severe motion artifacts as a result.

For HD machines, I still prefer those based on miniDV because tape is self-archiving. However, I wouldn't consider an AVCHD machine, and I'd be very selective about HDV machines -- too many have small sensors and abysmal low-light performance.
PTravel is offline  
Old Oct 2, 2007, 1:38 pm
  #6  
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: BUR
Programs: in C/C++, Python, SQL
Posts: 342
Wow...thanks very much for some serious stuff to read over and think about.
Scott in LA is offline  
Old Oct 2, 2007, 2:03 pm
  #7  
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: SFOSJCOAK
Programs: AA-EXP & 1MM+, AS, MR-LTT, HH Gold
Posts: 7,574
Not 100% sure it will solve your issue. You might want to give Windows Movie Maker a try (assume you are using PC XP or Vista). WMM can be downloaded free from Microsoft.com
Within WMM, you import your clip(s). In the monitor (where you watch the clip; also edit), you can pick a spot on the clip to "trim". The operation involves selecting the frame to set "Trim beginning" and then another frame to set "trim end". After that, you are done.
If you are on the Mac, iMovie should take care of that (I don't know much detail about this).
If a heavy duty video editing software is what you want (for long term, not just this project), you can take a look at Adobe Premiere Pro (free 30-day free trial can be downloaded from Adobe.com
Have fun with your project
allset2travel is offline  
Old Oct 2, 2007, 3:13 pm
  #8  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Newport Beach, California, USA
Posts: 36,062
Originally Posted by allset2travel
Not 100% sure it will solve your issue. You might want to give Windows Movie Maker a try (assume you are using PC XP or Vista). WMM can be downloaded free from Microsoft.com
Within WMM, you import your clip(s). In the monitor (where you watch the clip; also edit), you can pick a spot on the clip to "trim". The operation involves selecting the frame to set "Trim beginning" and then another frame to set "trim end". After that, you are done.
If you are on the Mac, iMovie should take care of that (I don't know much detail about this).
If a heavy duty video editing software is what you want (for long term, not just this project), you can take a look at Adobe Premiere Pro (free 30-day free trial can be downloaded from Adobe.com
Have fun with your project
From what I've heard iMovie can handle mpeg. Do you know if Movie maker can?
PTravel is offline  
Old Oct 2, 2007, 7:20 pm
  #9  
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: SFOSJCOAK
Programs: AA-EXP & 1MM+, AS, MR-LTT, HH Gold
Posts: 7,574
Originally Posted by PTravel
From what I've heard iMovie can handle mpeg. Do you know if Movie maker can?
I think you can. Although personally, I have not worked with mpeg in WMM.

From WMM help and support, I copied and now paste the following for reference:

Import video files, pictures, and audio into Windows Movie Maker

You can import files with the following file name extensions into Windows Movie Maker to use in your project:

Video files: .asf, .avi, .dvr-ms, .m1v, .mp2, .mp2v, .mpe, .mpeg, .mpg, .mpv2, .wm, and .wmv

Audio files: .aif, .aifc, .aiff .asf, .au, .mp2, .mp3, .mpa, .snd, .wav, and .wma

Picture files: .bmp, .dib, .emf, .gif, .jfif, .jpe, .jpeg, .jpg, .png, .tif, .tiff, and .wmf

You can also import files into Windows Movie Maker that have a different extension from the ones listed above, but not all file types will work when you try to use them to make a movie.

Microsoft Recorded TV Show files (with a .dvr-ms file name extension) that are not protected using digital rights management can be imported into Windows Movie Maker if your computer is running Windows Vista Home Premium or Windows Vista Ultimate.
allset2travel is offline  
Old Sep 18, 2011, 7:48 am
  #10  
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: ORD, MBS
Programs: UA Plat., 1.52 MM
Posts: 2,053
Arrow Contemporary SOFTWARE TO EDIT HOME VIDEO

Hello:

Can anyone recommend to me a software package/suit that will enbale me to EDIT: cut, paste, add still photos; and put into sequence video clips?
I shot the clips on a Sony Handycam HDR cx150.
The end product needs to be compatible for upload on Youtube or embeded in blogs of sites like blogspot, tumblr .
Please use as simple language as you can.
Thanks to all Flyertalkers.
~ Mandy
Intrepid is offline  
Old Sep 18, 2011, 10:00 am
  #11  
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: YVR
Programs: AC E75, SPG Plat, HH peon-by-choice (ex Gold)
Posts: 8,090
Most consumer-level editing products (like Sony Vegas, Corel/Ulead Videostudio, Pinnacle) will do exactly what you want.

There is always a learning curve but it's not too difficult with entry-level software.
Braindrain is offline  
Old Sep 19, 2011, 10:25 am
  #12  
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: ORD, MBS
Programs: UA Plat., 1.52 MM
Posts: 2,053
Originally Posted by Braindrain
Most consumer-level editing products (like Sony Vegas, Corel/Ulead Videostudio, Pinnacle) will do exactly what you want.

There is always a learning curve but it's not too difficult with entry-level software.
Thanks for the suggestions. Will review them.
Intrepid is offline  
Old Sep 20, 2011, 9:59 am
  #13  
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: PSM
Posts: 69,232
You can do all that is described above with Windows Live Movie Maker, too. It isn't particularly powerful but it is also very easy to use and has minimal learning curve.
sbm12 is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Manage Preferences - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

This site is owned, operated, and maintained by MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Designated trademarks are the property of their respective owners.