Go Back  FlyerTalk Forums > Miles&Points > Airlines and Mileage Programs > TAP Air Portugal | Miles&Go
Reload this Page >

GUIDE: EC261 / EC 261/2004 “EU” complaints, compensation and TAP

GUIDE: EC261 / EC 261/2004 “EU” complaints, compensation and TAP

    Hide Wikipost
Old Jan 4, 20, 3:57 pm   -   Wikipost
Please read: This is a community-maintained wiki post containing the most important information from this thread. You may edit the Wiki once you have been on FT for 90 days and have made 90 posts.
 
Last edit by: JDiver
Wiki Link
Regulation (EC) No 261/2004 of the European Parliament and of the Council of 11 February 2004 establishes common rules on compensation and assistance to passengers in the event of denied boarding and of cancellation or long delay of flights, and repealing Regulation (EEC) No 295/91.

Best FT thread for referencing EC261/2004: The 2019 BA compensation thread: Your guide to Regulation EC261/2004

Note update - 2016 June 10
EU clarification on EC261/2004
http://ec.europa.eu/transport/themes...16)3502_en.pdf

Where and how to address for EC 261 claims:

Originally Posted by irishguy28 View Post
EC261/2004 claims should be lodged with the operating airline.

Go to the complaints page, select "Submit a complaint", and select "Delay" in the drop-down box.

Keep the comments to the bare minimum - stick to the facts, and best to use bullet points. Keep all commentary about anything other than the bald facts of the case out of the submission ("We were very upset and disappointed..." etc etc) and make no reference to any of the topics already explained to you in this thread to be of no relevance to the airline or to this claim ("We lost the first pre-paid night of our vacation as we had a non-refundable hotel booking" etc etc)

Attach scans/photographs of your boarding passes - the original boarding passes showing the original departure details, and the replacement boarding passes showing the later actual departure details - and include the original e-ticket receipt and any communications/emails/texts from the airline notifying you of the delay.

I would also advise you specifically write that you want the €600 per passenger in cash (transferred to your bank account) rather than a voucher to be used with TAP within 12 months of 50% greater value...unless this truly is your wish. I've explained above why it is generally a bad idea to accept a voucher in lieu of cash.
Code:
The regulation applies to any passenger:
 
 - departing from an airport located in the territory of a Member State to 
 which the Treaty applies;
 
The protection accorded to passengers departing from or to an airport located in a Member State should be extended to those leaving an airport located in a third country for one situated in a Member State, when a Community carrier operates the flight and where a community carrier is defined as any carrier licensed to operate within that community.
- departing from an EU member state, or travelling to an EU member state - on an airline based in an EU member state if that person has: - a confirmed reservation on the flight, and - arrived in time for check-in as indicated on the ticket or communication from the airline airline, or, if no time is so indicated, no less than 45 minutes prior to the scheduled departure time of the flight or - have been transferred from the flight for which he/she held a reservation to some other flight unless - the passenger is travelling on a free or discounted ticket not available to the general public, other than a ticket obtained from a frequent flyer programme. It does not apply to helicopter flights, to any flight not operated by a fixed-wing aircraft, nor to flights from Gibraltar Airport.[1] (wikipedia)
Link to article on Wikipedia: "The Flight Delay Compensation Regulation (EC) No 261/2004 is a regulation establishing common rules on compensation and assistance to passengers in the event of denied boarding, flight cancellations, or long delays of flights. It repealed Regulation (EEC) No 295/91, and went into effect on 18 February 2005. It sets out the entitlements of air passengers when a flight that they intend to travel on is delayed or cancelled, or when they are denied boarding to such a flight due to overbooking, or when the airline is unable to accommodate them in the class they had booked." It applies to Member States and includes French overseas territories.

Heretofore, the ruling only applied to flights leaving Europe on all airlines, or flights from anywhere to Europe, on European airlines. Most recently (July 2019), a new European Court of Justice ruling commands that even flights which connect to non-EU airlines, but were booked as one ticket from the EU must be compensated. (link to article on godsavethepoints.com)

Link to EC 261/2004 text in several languages.

Link to language (English) Adobe Portable Document Format (PDF) of EC 261/2004

Link to description by Air Passenger Rights a "multilingual consumer website explaining the rights of air passengers in the European Union."

Link to contact details of EC 261/2004 enforcement bodies

Link to English language EC 261/2004 compliaint form PDF

Email for EC claims at (to determine)

Link to BAEC Forum lengthy EC261/2004 thread.

Link to thisismoney.co.uk article explaining EC261/2004.

Emirates told to pay out on missed connection claims, by Mark Caswell, Business Traveller, 19 Mar 2018

“Despite all this, expect airlines to give you a hard time with your claim. File a claim on your own, but if you find yourself stonewalled or denied unfairly, enlisting a firm like AirHelp or Bott & Co can be huge, since they fight the case for you, in exchange for a 25% cut of the recovered cash. A 75% chunk of something is better than 100% of nothing.” (godsavethepoints.com)

Signed in members with 90 days / 90 posts can edit this Wikipost; wiki contents may be printed by using the (lower right wiki corner)
Print Wikipost

Old Aug 4, 17, 12:16 pm
  #1  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 134
Arrow GUIDE: EC261 / EC 261/2004 “EU” complaints, compensation and TAP

Hello all,

I was flying with TAP from LIS-ORY on the 2nd and the flight was delayed for well over three hours, and ultimately got cancelled at 18:10 (scheduled arrival 17:50). I was then put on another flight scheduled to leave at 18:10 but was also delayed and I ultimately made it to ORY at 22:30.

However there were baggage issues as well, since they were not transferred despite being told they were so I didn't end up leaving ORY till after midnight when the last flight from LIS-ORY came in with, thankfully, my bag on it.

It seems I could claim for both the delay and cancellation and it is 250 Euros for each claim? They also failed to provide food or water (I did ask for some), as on the original flight we boarded at 15:30 and sat on the plain till 18:10 when the flight got cancelled.

Would my first step be using the online complaint form here: https://www.flytap.com/en-gb/support/complaint ??

Seems a pretty clear cut case of violation and compensation owed.
Hellfire is offline  
Old Aug 4, 17, 2:59 pm
  #2  
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: CPT,AMS
Posts: 3,637
You cannot claim twice, you were scheduled to arrive at 17:50, you were rerouted and arrived at 22:30, for a flight of <1500km, you can therefore claim 250€, assuming that your original flight was not delayed/cancelled due to extraordinary circumstances etc.

As for food/water, if you bought any and saved the receipts, you should claim this from TAP as well.
Ditto is online now  
Old Aug 4, 17, 3:42 pm
  #3  
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: DCA
Programs: UA US CO AA DL FL
Posts: 45,136
"Hellfire: It seems I could claim for both the delay and cancellation and it is 250 Euros for each claim? They also failed to provide food or water (I did ask for some), as on the original flight we boarded at 15:30 and sat on the plain till 18:10 when the flight got cancelled."

No, it does not "seem" that at all. EC 261/2004 provides compensation when you are delayed at your final ticketed destination by at least a specified amount of time. In your case, you arrived at 22:30 when you had been scheduled to arrive at 17:50. That is a delay of 4:40. It entitles you to EUR 250. Not sure how you turn that into anything more.

Bags are irrelevant and not covered by EC 261/2004.
LondonElite likes this.
Often1 is offline  
Old Aug 7, 17, 3:20 am
  #4  
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: somewhere between Europe and Africa, from SFO
Programs: A3*G, EY Silver
Posts: 7,783
Did you originate in LIS or was LIS-ORY a connection?
Palal is online now  
Old Aug 7, 17, 3:26 am
  #5  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 134
Originally Posted by Palal View Post
Did you originate in LIS or was LIS-ORY a connection?
Originated in LIS.
Went MRS-LIS-RAK[stop] -LIS [stop] - ORY on an open jaw.
Hellfire is offline  
Old Aug 11, 17, 3:51 am
  #6  
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: somewhere between Europe and Africa, from SFO
Programs: A3*G, EY Silver
Posts: 7,783
Then you're due 250€ in compensation.
Palal is online now  
Old Jan 4, 18, 9:35 am
  #7  
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 217
Tap - eu261

Getting nowhere with an EU 261 claim with TAP.

Does anyone know of a TAP UK address where I can send a Letter before Action ?
Thanks
petez is offline  
Old Jan 4, 18, 9:46 am
  #8  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Netherlands
Programs: Platinum: KL Gold: A3 Silver: AZ, BA
Posts: 24,466
TAP's London office can be found at this address.

However, I am not sure that they can or will enter into discussions regarding EC261 claims, and you are probably best to continue directing correspondence to head office.

Have you considered getting a Claims Agency to pursue your claim?
irishguy28 is offline  
Old Jan 4, 18, 4:33 pm
  #9  
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 217
Thanks for that. Re agents I'm happy to do it myself as long as I can find the right information. The TAP contact centre is terrible and I'm getting nowhere so l'll see what a LBA brings.
petez is offline  
Old Jan 4, 18, 8:48 pm
  #10  
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 7,520
TAP have signed up to an Alternative Dispute Resolution body called AviationADR, and they should have told you this when they rejected your claim. You may want to try them before court action.

https://www.aviationadr.org.uk/how-t...ne-complaints/
nancypants likes this.
ft101 is offline  
Old Feb 22, 18, 9:39 am
  #11  
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: YUL
Programs: UA 1K, OZ
Posts: 6,402
Question How do I get someone at TP to deal with my EU261??

I had a flight canceled way back in November, that they never informed me about. I've been trying to get EU 261 since then, sent a complaint through the website, didn't hear anything. I called in January, I was told it was being handled by their "Swiss office," because I'm based in Switzerland. Been another month since then, so I've started trying to call again. I always get tossed around just trying to find the complaints department, today I've tried calling and have been disconnected 3 times. Agents tell me to press 4 in the menu, but 4 says its for internet support and still sends me to the booking department. This is getting ridiculous, is there any other way I can talk to someone, or a direct line to the complaints department?

Otherwise I'm going to submit a 261 form to the Swiss authorities.
dinoscool3 is offline  
Old Feb 23, 18, 12:20 pm
  #12  
formerly southsidesilver
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: San Diego,CA
Programs: BA Gold, UA Silver, HH Diamond
Posts: 960
I just posted about them and I see your having a similar problem. Mine is for a refund on a ticket and I have been waiting for 2 months. I just can't get a hold of anyone willing to help.
When I Travel The World is offline  
Old Feb 23, 18, 3:18 pm
  #13  
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: somewhere between Europe and Africa, from SFO
Programs: A3*G, EY Silver
Posts: 7,783
If you're based in CH, contact the Swiss regulator. You can also contact the Portuguese regulator ANAC, but I find that ANAC is less helpful.

Also consider using these guys https://www.aviationadr.org.uk
dinoscool3 likes this.
Palal is online now  
Old Feb 23, 18, 3:35 pm
  #14  
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: YUL
Programs: UA 1K, OZ
Posts: 6,402
Originally Posted by Palal View Post
If you're based in CH, contact the Swiss regulator. You can also contact the Portuguese regulator ANAC, but I find that ANAC is less helpful.

Also consider using these guys https://www.aviationadr.org.uk



I finally got through the someone. She said she’d request the file from their Swiss office, and handle it herself within a week. If that doesn’t happen, I’ll escalate to either the regulator, or go through Avaiatonadr.

Originally Posted by When I Travel The World View Post
I just posted about them and I see your having a similar problem. Mine is for a refund on a ticket and I have been waiting for 2 months. I just can't get a hold of anyone willing to help.
I supposedly got an email for the billing folks. I was told they handle refunds. If you want it, PM me.
dinoscool3 is offline  
Old Feb 27, 18, 10:30 am
  #15  
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: YUL
Programs: UA 1K, OZ
Posts: 6,402
Just got a reply from TP.
Dear Mr. dinoscool3,



This is to acknowledge receipt of you complaint lodged on our Website from the above-mentioned date. Please accept our unreserved apologies not only for the absence of communication pertaining to your schedule change, but also for the inordinate amount of time it has taken to process your claim.



We have gathered all information relevant to your booking. It documents that the change to your return journey from Casablanca to Milan via Lisbon on the 20th to the 19th of November 2017 was done on the 4
th
of October 20 - more than six (6) weeks before your slated date of departure. Article V of EU Regulation EC261/2004 clearly states that compensation is due only then if the changes and/or cancellation occurs within a 14-day (2 weeks) time frame to the date of passengers’ departure for the flight segment involved. Beyond the two week period, the passengers right to indemnification consists solely of either being re-protected on the earliest available flight at no extra cost or refund of the fare paid. We sincerely regret if there has been a lapse of information with regards to these changes. We have called the attention of the department concerned to ensure such oversight is not repeated.



Furthermore, as per your statement and as noted in the booking history, a later continuing flight from Lisbon was chosen. TP814 departing at 1950 hrs. was the preferred over TP804 which would have gotten you into Milan Malpensa at 1815 hrs. instead of the chosen flight which was arriving at 2330 hrs. In this scenario therefore, no compensation can be granted as the choice to arrive at a later time was voluntary and not imposed by the airline upon the passenger.



In closing, we hope to have addressed your questions concerning schedule changes and look forward to the opportunity of welcoming you again in one of our flights.



Thank you for your kind understanding and patience on this matter.
I’m really unimpressed

First off, the EU regulations say the airline has to inform of a cancelation, which they never did, I found out myself 7 days before departure!

Secondly, TP 804 was my original flight! I couldn’t make it because my CMN flight was canceled!

I’m going to file with Aviation ADR. This is ridiculous TP.

dinoscool3 is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search Engine: