It's important to try to build conscensus before just tossing out motions...

Well the consensus is 'No Change' !

I don't see a consensus yet for anything. Until that happens, the "no change" position wins. That's not the same as a consensus for "no change", but the result is the same.

Let's see shall we? My money is pretty firmly on 'no change' for quite a few months yet!;)

Well I am taking a little break for work between vacations so thought I'd chime in on this.

As best I can recall, during the arduous and drawn-out process of putting the current TB guidelines together there was a lengthy and somewhat contentious debate about whether an 'abstain' ought to count as a 'no' vote or as a 'no vote' in terms of the 2/3 math.

In the end the 'no' prevailed over 'no vote' by a simple majority 5-4 straw poll (which, ironically enough given the current topic, is how the guidelines were constructed). And in the end there was enough compromise and give-and-take in the final document that those (like me) who thought an abstain ought to be 'no vote' rather than a 'no' vote felt compelled to vote for the overall document including the odious (to me) provision.

Of course, I no longer have access to those debate archives (yet another reason why the TB deliberations forum ought to be open to all posters on a read-only basis, imho!!!!), and I'm sure that while current TB members could go and look at the archives, for them to post who said what there here could potentially lead to their expulsion from the TB. That said, I do specifically give my express written consent for any TB member to re-post whatever I posted about this matter in the private TB forum in this forum if I have misremembered or if anything there might help shed light on this matter.

But, bottom line, as I recall, like it or lump it, an 'abstain' currently is the same as 'no.'

Hopefully TB members are voting accordingly, and TB observers are tabulating votes thusly:

Yes = SUPPORT CHANGE
No = OPPOSE CHANGE
Abstain = OPPOSE CHANGE

koko -- again, your efforts during that period are very much still appreciated as are your comments here.

Sure thing, boss. ^

And frankly I'm not even sure why this issue has come up as I've been enjoying a quiet little retirement from the TB and this forum, although I am guessing it has to do with the (to me bizarre) chain of votes, unvotes and revotes on the MR forum.