Question 9: How Will You Seek Input?

 
Old Nov 6, 2007, 2:45 pm
  #31  
 
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Originally Posted by kokonutz
If TB members either in clicks or en mass go to private communication and vote without deliberating on the TB forum that fact will become public knowledge as well.
Which is, for all intents and purposes, status quo ante with today's situation.. We know that prior Talkboards have rejected the call to toss open the doors and such.


I'm for it. No matter the tactics required to achieve it.
Perhaps there is something to be said for building consensus rather than burning the china shop down (skipping directly past the bull). I'd wager a plugged nickel and a pint of your choice that some degree of pragmatism results, in the end, in greater disclosure than what exists today, or minimally greater exposure that will result from gorilla warfare. Takers?


The REAL question is why on Earth are people against open talkboard deliberations (with a VERY few minor exceptions)!?!?!!?!?
Two reasons: TB members won't be able to talk about other members in a disparaging fashion (one member on the current iteration of Talkboard suggested that I personally be banished from the public TB forum, and then actually had the temerity to deny it in public). These types of activities, if brought to light, would be rather embarrassing. This kind of thing makes me want to toss open the door, especially as I've been victimized by it previously, as I believe you have as well.

The second reason is that people do tend to behave differently "behind closed doors," especially as it pertains to interpersonal discourse. A limited audience will tend to increase candor. I believe this to be good.

I think if you toss open the Talkboard forum, what will end up happening is that same give-and-take, back-and-forth, consensus-building and horse-trading moves to another forum or e-mail. Which kind of defeats your aison d'tre, no?

I think there is a more productive path via pragmatic moves that increment over time to the desired end result. I suppose we'll disagree about that, as has been the case in the past.....
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Old Nov 6, 2007, 2:59 pm
  #32  
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Originally Posted by kanebear
By the same token you sound like someone more interested in challenging and debunking others than putting forth your own platform and ideas.
Contrary to this post, I do have a platform, which will be evident from my answers to the ballot questions provided Internet Brands can actually get the answers to my other four questions posted before the election.

I believe that openness, candor, and transparency bring about the best decision making.

I believe that, with few exceptions, the TalkBoard has been nothing more than a glorified board-organizer the past 2 years:

Want a new forum? Ask TalkBoard, where they'll discuss it to death and then let their own personal feelings about the topic decide how they'll vote, rather than put up the board and monitor its progress.

Want to bash OMNI posters yet again? Why, let's put forward a motion to not count OMNI posts while ignoring real proposals other members make.

So, what's my platform?

I want to change how TB does business.

I want forums to be approved quickly and monitored after the fact.

I want every user-submitted proposal to be debated openly and voted on.

I want to seek out members and ask their opinions on how FT can be a better place. PM, emails, DOs, whatever medium possible.

I want the TalkBoard to meet at least twice a year in person and spend actual time together, discussing the future of FT and how the TB can improve that future.

I feel I have an actual platform and "challenging and debunking others" is my way of saying that I DON'T feel others do. This is a debate, right?
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Old Nov 6, 2007, 3:30 pm
  #33  
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Originally Posted by ClueByFour
Perhaps there is something to be said for building consensus rather than burning the china shop down (skipping directly past the bull). I'd wager a plugged nickel and a pint of your choice that some degree of pragmatism results, in the end, in greater disclosure than what exists today, or minimally greater exposure that will result from gorilla warfare. Takers?
I'm all for consensus building and proper channels and all that. And if you look back I said that's the path I'd prefer and WILL undertake if elected (but can I still get that Boddingtons!?!?!?).

But many before me have run on a platform of open Talkboard deliberations and been elected and still only incremental changes have taken place. If what it takes to have open Talkboard deliberations is Mr. Smith Goes to Washington-style tactics, well, like that fictional character, I believe that one man CAN make a difference.
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Old Nov 6, 2007, 5:10 pm
  #34  
 
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I've very available by PM and email so happy to have direct contact from members.

Reading my usual forums and branching out to see the activity of forums that I don't usually visit will be of great benefit to me.

Chatting and discusses problems or concerns with those very involved with the community such as moderators as well as frequent posters.

By just being around
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Old Nov 6, 2007, 5:33 pm
  #35  
 
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Originally Posted by flyertalk
This questions was submitted by member Kiwi Flyer:
It has been written: "This council establishes the direction that FlyerTalk is heading into our future and represents and directs the general membership in issues that serve both the short- and long-term interests of the FlyerTalk community."

I would like to know how the TalkBoard candidates will seek input from the membership at large whom they're seeking to represent.
Hi
The problem with seeking input is trying to get people interested in reading what has been either mentioned in a newsletter or postings at the top of forums.

I would say that a vast majority of FTers really dont care what happens in the background, but its just a few thousand who really get into the swing of things.

Look at the amount of folk who viewed the main posting regarding the elections, I think it only reached a few thousand, you would have thought it would have been in the 10,000s but nope, its of no interest to the others.

I think for starters that we could look at a newsletter that might be more interesting to folk.

Apathy plays a big part in any online forum, there are many lurkers and not enough posters at times.
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Old Nov 6, 2007, 5:33 pm
  #36  
 
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Originally Posted by flyertalk
This questions was submitted by member Kiwi Flyer:
It has been written: "This council establishes the direction that FlyerTalk is heading into our future and represents and directs the general membership in issues that serve both the short- and long-term interests of the FlyerTalk community."

I would like to know how the TalkBoard candidates will seek input from the membership at large whom they're seeking to represent.

I would like to more use of stickys throughout forums on FlyerTalk to alert members about issues and ask for community input. I have my website address for FlyerTalk set for Miles & Points, so I hardly ever see TalkBoard Topics as a forum. I have to look for it specifically.

Having spent years with teacher unions I learned that the main point is to give the membership the opportunity to participate. Opportunity comes from adequate and timely notification of issues and deadlines. If adequate and timely info is passed on to the members, then complaints and problems are reduced.

In any organization there are very few persons who do the vast majority of organizational planning, but an avenue to become an organization planner is key to a democratic organization. The fact that any member can run for TalkBoard demonstrates the power of the democratic organization of FlyerTalk.

The fundamental issue is to have an efficient process to inform members about FlyerTalk issues and provide for member responses. The TalkBoard forum is there and can serve this purpose. Perhaps we can do more to educate members about the avenues for input into the direction of FlyerTalk.

How would I actually do it?
I do not know the inner workings of FlyerTalk and TalkBoard to the extent that I can provide specifics at this time. I would work to make the system of communication more efficient and organized. That is a role I traditionally undertake in organizational work and I will figure out the actual methods for member communication based on what others are doing and what I find possible and efficient with the role as a TalkBoard member.
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Old Nov 6, 2007, 8:55 pm
  #37  
 
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Input

There's two ways I'd seek input here.

First, I have an "open inbox" policy where I'd welcome the thoughts, opinions, and ideas of any community member on any issue at any time.

Second, and what I believe to be more important, is that I'd get indirect input by simply being immersed in the conversations online. By reading and interacting with the content of the forums, I'd be able to gauge the direction that the community wishes to move in. From there, I'd act as the community facilitator to get them there.
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Old Nov 7, 2007, 7:50 am
  #38  
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A few thoughts on open deliberations.

Folks that have been around awhile will recall just how secretive the TalkBoard used to be. There was a gag order in effect, no TalkBoard member could discuss any issue that was currently under consideration, at all. So no engagement of the community.

And internally, the TalkBoard had formal procedures such that any motion had to be made and then debated in a dedicated thread, and that could only happen once the TalkBoard President posted that thread, and there were significant constraints even on deliberating.

And back in late 2003 when missydarlin and I were first elected to the TalkBoard we pretty much changed that. We rode hard on the internal procedures and pushed for new procedures and the TalkBoard is much more open and equally importantly each TalkBoard member has the ability to have a clear voice both inside the TalkBoard and with the community.

We've changed the way we've done things over time, something I've been a part of, and now we clearly let members know what items are under discussion (our procedures do carve out an exception for confidential items brought to us by Randy, a very rare thing) and we report back on our decisions and have created a dedicated forum for those announcements. Each member's vote is clearly recorded as well.

I don't think it's a good idea to open the private TalkBoard forum for all to read, I believe that members would be more 'on stage' and posing for the community rather than productively and genuinely deliberating.

At the same time, I have no concerns about any of my own individual posts. I am as careful as possible to pass the Wall Street Journal test, how would any post I make look if it appeared the next day on the front page of the Journal? And I can't tell you the number of times I write a post and then exit the window before hitting submit.
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Old Nov 7, 2007, 8:07 am
  #39  
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Originally Posted by gleff
I am as careful as possible to pass the Wall Street Journal test, how would any post I make look if it appeared the next day on the front page of the Journal? And I can't tell you the number of times I write a post and then exit the window before hitting submit.
Please don't defenestrate yourself, gleff.

Seriously, thanks for an excellent set of posts this morning. Your discussion of the criteria for establish a new forum was concise, illuminating, and right on target. As usual, you said it better than I ever could.
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Old Nov 7, 2007, 9:19 am
  #40  
 
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Originally Posted by RichMSN
Contrary to this post, I do have a platform, which will be evident from my answers to the ballot questions provided Internet Brands can actually get the answers to my other four questions posted before the election.

I believe that openness, candor, and transparency bring about the best decision making.

I believe that, with few exceptions, the TalkBoard has been nothing more than a glorified board-organizer the past 2 years:

Want a new forum? Ask TalkBoard, where they'll discuss it to death and then let their own personal feelings about the topic decide how they'll vote, rather than put up the board and monitor its progress.

Want to bash OMNI posters yet again? Why, let's put forward a motion to not count OMNI posts while ignoring real proposals other members make.

So, what's my platform?

I want to change how TB does business.

I want forums to be approved quickly and monitored after the fact.

I want every user-submitted proposal to be debated openly and voted on.

I want to seek out members and ask their opinions on how FT can be a better place. PM, emails, DOs, whatever medium possible.

I want the TalkBoard to meet at least twice a year in person and spend actual time together, discussing the future of FT and how the TB can improve that future.

I feel I have an actual platform and "challenging and debunking others" is my way of saying that I DON'T feel others do. This is a debate, right?
Certainly; yet debate is far more than merely gainsaying what has been previously stated.

What I read this as is simply change for change sake. Given that TalkBoard is going to be a mixture of currently serving and new members I'm interested to hear how you intend to turn your 'wants' into reality? It's all well and good to want to be a firebrand. It's another matter entirely to be an actual leader who can get things done by working with others to acheive one's goals.

My belief is that Flyertalk and TalkBoard currently work and work well. I don't think Talkboard needs a major overhaul, nor does FlyerTalk. There's a reason why FT has flourished over the years and the "FT-wannabes" that were started to serve some perceived unmet need have all but universally died on the vine (ITYT, Flyerchat, etc). As we go through the transition to InternetBrands we need agility, stability and focus, not fanciful distractive railings against the status quo and willy-nilly throw-it-at-the-wall-and-see-if-it-sticks expansion.
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Old Nov 7, 2007, 11:27 am
  #41  
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The rules for this forum are similar as other forums throughout FlyerTalk - stay on topic. I have soft deleted several posts by a number of candidates so that the members are not confused by side issues, side issues that are not addressing the thread title: How Will You Seek Input?

Thank you candidates.
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Old Nov 7, 2007, 11:27 am
  #42  
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What was the topic again? Oh yeah. Input.

Again: As a candidate for the Talkboard, I'll seek input in any manner possible. Be it listening to members at Do's, soliciting email/pm opinions on motions, participating in the TalkBoard forum, and I'll add a signature line soliciting input.

If elected to the Talkboard I'll respect the rules set up by the management of FlyerTalk (be it Randy or IB). If I disagree with any of the existing rules, I'll respect the wishes of FlyerTalk management, I won't make up my own rules. I'll abide by the existing rules until I am in a position to try to change them.

As it sits now, I am OK with the current rules that the TalkBoard is working under.
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Old Nov 8, 2007, 1:37 am
  #43  
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This is a public internet board. Seeking input would be best done via threads and personal messages.

Seeking input is the easy part. Sorting out input and ensuring fair consideration of input would be a bit more difficult.

It should be a public and transparent process to all.
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Old Nov 8, 2007, 11:33 am
  #44  
 
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Since TB represents all the FT community - not just "the only one that matters" - I can be reached by PM, email or posts to FT.

Although not everyone cares enough or bothers to read the TB Topics forum, a good way to inform the members of FT to the topics under discussion would be to include a section in Talkmail about these issues. Almost everyone reads Talkmail when it is sent. That way, if FTers have an opinion about a specific issue, they have the opportunity to discuss this with members of the TB. All that needs to be included in Talkmail is one small section such as:

Possible TB issues
  1. (one sentence)
  2. (one sentence)
  3. (one sentence)
  4. etc...
and the voting period for the issue(s).

As it is now, many times you either hear about the decision(s) after the voting has been completed or after the voting had begun. Why not have members given the opportunity to voice their opinion before the voting period begins?
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Old Nov 12, 2007, 12:03 am
  #45  
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I would like to know how the TalkBoard candidates will seek input from the membership at large whom they're seeking to represent.
A nice, simple approach in my opinion is to make use of the poll features built into the bulletin board software. Motions being discussed could be shared with FTers and a simple straw poll conducted. This not only would seek input, but encourage participation from regular FTers and stimulate more interest in TB. At the same time, it provides the TB members with more details about how FT members feel about an issue.
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