Swiss cancelled my flight.. and is refusing to compensate me
Dec 5, 2018, 12:03 pm
#16
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Geneva
Programs: LX SEN, AFKL Platinum, BA Bronze,
Posts: 5,626
Everyone agrees EC261 applies. The issue is that LX and Switzerland more generally don’t follow the ECJ jurisprudence on the regulation. So unless there is an EU angle involved the strict interpretation applies. In this case that means that all the ECJ jurisprudence about extraordinary circumstances vs what reasonably can be foreseen does not play a role.
OP will have to make a case that this was travel to an EU country via Switzerland, not to (a stop over of >24h) to Switzerland. If an UK court rejects this argument, (s)he has little recourse.
OP will have to make a case that this was travel to an EU country via Switzerland, not to (a stop over of >24h) to Switzerland. If an UK court rejects this argument, (s)he has little recourse.
Dec 5, 2018, 12:14 pm
#17
Original Poster
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: LON
Programs: LH M&M SEN, Accor Plat
Posts: 83
As a SEN, LH did the same thing to me in Tunis. Inbound flight was cancelled because it didn't leave before the airport closed. So at 11pm I find out that my 2am flight is cancelled. They said since I was getting a 2pm flight, no hotel was offered (same "day" travel) and no compensation because it was force majeur. Which it wasn't. The airport curfew had changed in September and this was Feb! They had already adjusted their schedules because of it. I just cut my SEN in two and sent it back.
EC261 covers the EU, Iceland, Norway and Switzerland airlines too.
EC261 covers the EU, Iceland, Norway and Switzerland airlines too.
I had a LX flight booked from LCY-ZRH a few months ago, just for a quick weekend. It was the last departing flight from LCY. We had a delay due a “storm” which came and went four hours before our departure. Flights started taking off again and the LX ground staff took their sweet time boarding us an hour after. We boarded and sat on the plane waiting for another half hour while they loaded our luggage (which they only started doing after we boarded despite the long delay and the aircraft sitting on the ground). Needless to say we missed our slot in ZRH as the airport has a curfew and our flight was cancelled. This was on a Friday night in London. Ground staff told us to find a hotel that wouldn’t cost more than GBP 115 and wouldn’t help with bookings. Good luck finding a hotel in London at 11pm on a Friday night for this amount. A group of people from Manchester started complaining desperately to staff and staff just walked away. I cancelled my booking and went home. LX’s response to the cancellation: “extraordinary circumstances due to weather”. Voila!
Dec 5, 2018, 2:08 pm
#19
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Luxembourg
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This was the SEN desk in Germany and in German. Not local. Their duty of care for a hotel, as far as they saw it, was not present since I was being offered a flight "same day".
Dec 5, 2018, 2:19 pm
#20
Suspended
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Location: DCA
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As a reference: https://www.bazl.admin.ch/bazl/en/ho...er-rights.html
EC 261/2004, is enacted as part of Swiss law. Thus, it applies to LX as well as to flights on any carrier departing Switzerland. However, Swiss courts interpreting the Regulation are not bound by and have not generally followed precedent established by EU Member State courts and the CJEU interpreting the Regulation.
Nothing in the Regulation suggests that all delays and cancellations occasioned by a technical fault are not "extraordinary circumstances." That comes from an interpretation by the CJEU. It is precedential, e.g. it binds decision-making in Member States, but not Switzerland. More importantly, Swiss courts have chosen, as they may, not follow that precedent and it is not Swiss law. That is because Switzerland is sovereign and has chosen not to subject itself to EU decision-making on this issue.
In practical terms this means that for this particular flight from a point outside both the EU and Switzerland to a point outside the EU, but in Switzerland, the technical fault as described by LX likely means no compensation.
Dec 5, 2018, 8:16 pm
#21
FlyerTalk Evangelist
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Location: Stoke on Trent, UK (MAN ), BUE, BKK, DBV
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[QUOTE=Fabo.sk;30500782
I'm also wondering, whether it would be potentially useful to claim IDB compensation from Lufthansa. You were checked in, after all.[/QUOTE]
I wondered that too & maybe it’s worth a claim, on the other hand OP got rebooked back to the original routing, so they would probably say they made the change only in the OP’s best interest.
I'm also wondering, whether it would be potentially useful to claim IDB compensation from Lufthansa. You were checked in, after all.[/QUOTE]
I wondered that too & maybe it’s worth a claim, on the other hand OP got rebooked back to the original routing, so they would probably say they made the change only in the OP’s best interest.
Dec 6, 2018, 5:21 am
#22
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: HAG
Programs: Der 5* FTL
Posts: 8,032
Well, original routing, but still, rerouted from a checked-in flight with presumably another delay.
Dec 10, 2018, 9:41 pm
#23
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: ORD
Programs: AA PLT
Posts: 2,781
Mar 1, 2019, 8:40 am
#24
Original Poster
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: LON
Programs: LH M&M SEN, Accor Plat
Posts: 83
Quick update on the above: I got in touch with flight compensation solicitors and they were very happy to take on my case on a no-win no-fee basis. They served LX with the claim, which LX ignored. A date was set for a court hearing and the court issued formal court proceedings to LX. And only then did LX suddenly agree to settle in full. Case never reached court and a cheque will soon be in the mail. Think of it what you will
Mar 1, 2019, 8:50 am
#25
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[QUOTE=mywaterbroke;30835387]Quick update on the above: I got in touch with flight compensation solicitors and they were very happy to take on my case on a no-win no-fee basis. They served LX with the claim, which LX ignored. A date was set for a court hearing and the court issued formal court proceedings to LX. And only then did LX suddenly agree to settle in full. Case never reached court and a cheque will soon be in the mail. Think of it what you will[/QUOTE
Excellent but again shame on LX, these cases really aren’t doing their reputation any good
Excellent but again shame on LX, these cases really aren’t doing their reputation any good
Mar 2, 2019, 1:24 am
#26
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: CPH, BRU
Programs: LH SEN* (*G), EBG (*G)
Posts: 793
Just for my understanding, can you actually claim your stop in ZRH?
If end destination is LON and ZRH is just transit, does it mean you still have a valid claim if you insist to have your transit?
If end destination is LON and ZRH is just transit, does it mean you still have a valid claim if you insist to have your transit?
Mar 2, 2019, 2:18 am
#27
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Geneva
Programs: LX SEN, AFKL Platinum, BA Bronze,
Posts: 5,626
. What happens after Brexit and UK leaving the EU is anyone’s guess...
Mar 2, 2019, 8:06 am
#28
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for EU 261…it’s what your ticket says, your final destination on that ticket
Mar 2, 2019, 8:26 am
#29
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I agree, the OP turned down the direct flight to the final destination (LHR) and asked to be rebooked for the following day in order to make a stopover at ZRH. Sorry, but I don't see how this claim could possibly fly in court...
Mar 2, 2019, 7:21 pm
#30
Original Poster
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: LON
Programs: LH M&M SEN, Accor Plat
Posts: 83
Not exactly accurate. My original itinerary included the stopover. I had meetings in ZRH. Swiss are the ones who decided to do without the stopover in my original booking and rebook me directly to LON, without even asking. I then had to spend time and money on calls to get myself rebooked onto a flight to ZRH and all this happened before my original cancelled flight was scheduled to take off. As expected all flights on the day I was meant to fly were full (or so I was told) and they could only offer the LH option the following day via FRA after a lot of looking around (which I didn’t even take in the end because they then decided to put me back on LX AFTER I CHECKED IN with LH, claiming that LH was overbooked and LX suddenly had seats). My final destination remained LON and I arrived in both ZRH and LON a day late. As per EU261, I am entitled to compensation which I also eventually got. But I had to almost go to court for it and that says all about their customer service