Why are all the flights ex ZRH delayed by 2 hours or more?

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Old Jun 28, 18, 7:48 am
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Why are all the flights ex ZRH delayed by 2 hours or more?

Hi,

Does anyone know why all the flights are delayed this afternoon out of ZRH?

Cheers
Steve
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Old Jun 28, 18, 9:21 am
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Adverse winds => runway 10 departures => capacity limitations
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Old Jun 28, 18, 11:13 pm
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This is what we have been told as well. However I do not see the logic on this: Departures are just the other way around, and landings were as always...

Regards,

Dirk
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Old Jun 28, 18, 11:23 pm
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Originally Posted by djohannw View Post
However I do not see the logic on this: Departures are just the other way around
Departures from runway 10 intersect with the go-around path of landings on runway 32 and therefore must be carefully spaced never to co-incide with a landing.
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Old Jun 29, 18, 10:25 am
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Originally Posted by airoli View Post
Departures from runway 10 intersect with the go-around path of landings on runway 32 and therefore must be carefully spaced never to co-incide with a landing.
Well, did not think about that, but then again this is pretty standard for O'hare on a normal day, so I still do not see why this should not work for ZRH as well with less influence on the schedule...other than that they are not used to it.

Greetings - Dirk
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Old Jun 29, 18, 11:02 am
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Originally Posted by djohannw View Post
Well, did not think about that, but then again this is pretty standard for O'hare on a normal day, so I still do not see why this should not work for ZRH as well with less influence on the schedule...other than that they are not used to it.

Greetings - Dirk
O'Hare has a completely different airfield layout with pairs of parallel runways. What is the relevance to this situation at ZRH?
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Old Jun 29, 18, 1:27 pm
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Originally Posted by bawm View Post
O'Hare has a completely different airfield layout with pairs of parallel runways. What is the relevance to this situation at ZRH?
Land and hold short is pretty much standard due to the large number of intersections, so in principle the same restriction will apply there (i.e. that go-around routes will cross departing traffic). At least that is what I remember from numerous channel 9 conversations...

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Old Jun 29, 18, 1:58 pm
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Originally Posted by djohannw View Post
so I still do not see why this should not work for ZRH as well
You are very welcome to read up on the complexities of airspace management at/around ZRH. www.skyguide.ch is a good starting point.

And pay special attention to the extra restrictions placed on the TMA by Germany, which begins about 10nm north of ZRH. Let's just say that the residents 10nm north of O'Hare don't get the same kind of leverage...
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Old Jun 30, 18, 3:42 am
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Originally Posted by airoli View Post
You are very welcome to read up on the complexities of airspace management at/around ZRH. www.skyguide.ch is a good starting point.

And pay special attention to the extra restrictions placed on the TMA by Germany, which begins about 10nm north of ZRH. Let's just say that the residents 10nm north of O'Hare don't get the same kind of leverage...
Totally agree. Also have a look at this video, which details the complexities and restrictions of take-off and landing in ZRH depending on the wind, German airspace, residential areas etc.


(in German, but the animations should be self-explanatory)
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Old Jul 2, 18, 4:47 am
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Originally Posted by djohannw View Post
Land and hold short is pretty much standard due to the large number of intersections, so in principle the same restriction will apply there (i.e. that go-around routes will cross departing traffic).
Many EU operators do not participate in the LAHSO wet or dry ops in the US and advise local ATC before landing. If you listen to the ORD frequency you will hear that quite often. I seriously doubt any EASA/European airfield has LAHSO in operation.
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Old Jul 2, 18, 5:10 am
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Originally Posted by oliver2002 View Post
Many EU operators do not participate in the LAHSO wet or dry ops in the US and advise local ATC before landing. If you listen to the ORD frequency you will hear that quite often. I seriously doubt any EASA/European airfield has LAHSO in operation.
Not just that, I actually think this is simply not allowed in (some? many? all of?) European countries.

Americans have a system that somehow works, but some of the principles applied (reduced visual separation, multiple landing clearances at the same runway at the same time) are quite worrying for those used to European system.
One advantage that we have is that going into non-visual conditions does not disrupt the whole system, whereas Americans schedule for the best conditions, resulting in frequent groundstops when weather does not cooperate.
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Old Jul 2, 18, 6:01 pm
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I was stuck in this and it was a cluster. Lounge refused to re-book and was sending everyone to the transfer desk. Of course I missed my ZRH-LAX and the transfer desk wait for business passengers was 3+ hours.
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