IAN-UK

One of the SWISS ground service aparatchiks told me - off the record! - that HONs were the problem for the F-lounge(s). They'd had to decide on letting in JV partner passengers travelling LX metal, or upsetting their HON base. I guess it was an easy decision

chris63

IAN-UK

Yes, i forget it figures in this thread.

Honestly it was no sacrifice at all - i don't go a bunch on airline catering, and I enjoyed myself. I'd hoped the point got through, but it wasn't made clearly or strongly enough to have any impact on Swiss policy.

My original report attracted opprobrium from an attention seeking blogger, but apart from that I think the action was recognised as valid form of theatre-criticism

Zurick

hey 600,000 bus/first miles over 2 years is not that hard to do if your job takes you all over the world and "life" it keeps renewing every 3rd year if you do 300k/year. It is about 4000 miles Geneva to NY, 5500 Geneva - Brazil. And up to 100,000 miles taking the train in Europe. But like every other "elite status" on this board, one enjoys the perks that go along with sleeping in hotels - and hates to see them reduced. I used to fly Virgin across the bond until they stopped the onboard massage. The best is that MrsZurick got Sen Status and now my girlfriend does

chris63

Fabo.sk

If United stopped selling UA numbered codeshare flights in F and now only sells F on LX as interline on LX numbers (even if UA plated), then he did sort it out, after a fashion...

FrequentFlyerNOT

So I didn't buy a Code Share when I bought my Swiss ticket from United, OK. Back to my question, what exactly is the difference between a code share and a ticket sold by another airline? I did get my miles on United MileagePlus, but it was for a Swiss ticket? Obviously from a passenger perspective, there is no real difference (other than the topic of this thread of course). Why would one airline decide to sell a code share versus just selling another airline's ticket?

FrequentFlyerNOT

IAN-UK, I had you in mind when I was approaching the Swiss FC lounge desk. I loved your earlier response I had read and do agree it was a valid form of theatre-criticism! I thought I would buy a bottle of champagne and some nuts and take them on board in case they didn't serve me!

I do think it is a valid comparison to compare loss of ground privileges with loss of cabin privileges. If they call it a First Class Lounge, then it should be for those flying in First Class. If they are going to restrict it, then call it something else like is done with The Concorde Room or the Private Room. Maybe, The Alpine Room?

Fabo.sk

A code share ticket allows you to have a ticket with a different airline code. That is tied to some of the ticket features that might differ based on marketing carrier rather than operating carrier. For example, for Flying Blue, mileage award depends on marketing carrier.
So if I buy KLM ticket that connects in PRG to a KLM codeshare on OK operated flight, I get KLM miles, not OK miles.
It might also have an impact on baggage rules or so I expect.

LHR/MEL/Europe FF

You got your United miles because Swiss and United are part of Star Alliance. Generally speaking, frequent flyer programs within any particular alliance allow you to corss earn on partners within that alliance.

But the benefits for passengers can be that you will earn more miles and perhaps get extra benefits towards elite status if you fly on a flight number of the airline to which you are a member. So a United MileagePlus member flying on a United flight number may get more miles and move further towards achieving status than if they were to fly on the Swiss flight number (or any of the other star alliance carriers).

You may also get more assistance in the event of delays or cancellations. If you are a United passenger and the Swiss flight is delayed, United may have more options for you than Swiss.

Finally, you may have more options for fares and ticketing. United may offer more connections to or from more airports for example than a Swiss ticket alone.

The differences are mainly before you fly. At the airport and on board there is little or no difference (except for this lounge access issue).

For the airlines, it comes down to commercial issues. Being able to offer more connections, get more revenue, make more money off their seat on the flight rather than giving all the money to Swiss.

airoli

From a customer experience / product consistency point of view, I am firmly of the opinion that every passenger departing ZRH in the LX First Class cabin should be allowed to use the associated ground services such as the lounge. I find this LX policy petty and stupid.

But I understand where it comes from.
There are important commercial differences here, which is likely what drives the lounge admission decision:

• A codeshare flight is a flight priced and sold by airline A, but operated by airline B. Airline A sets the pricing, fare rules, availability, combinability etc. of this codeshare flight independently. Airline A then pays airline B for each seat sold on such a codeshare based on a contractually agreed rate, which can be quite different from what airline A's customer saw / paid. Often, there are price differences for passengers booking the very same flights on the operating carrier or a codeshare carrier.
• A airline A flight segment sold by airline B is a different arrangement, which only requires an interline ticketing agreement. This allows airline A to sell flight segments sold and marketed by airline B. Crucially, it must use the availability, pricing, fare combinability rules etc. dictated by airline B. Airline A then pays airline B exactly what airline B asked for at the specific time the segment was sold.

Codeshares tend to be more concentrated within alliances, whereas interline agreements tend to be much broader. For instance, AF could probably sell a LX F segment but there is no AF codeshare on LX flights.

Hope this helps clarify where this - non-intuitive - issue likely comes from.

IAN-UK

Yup. Not all passengers share the same perspective of our all-knowing colleagues of FT.

There was a time when admittance to Lufthansa's Frankfurt arrivals lounge was governed by the metal rule - basically, fly on a Lufthansa aircraft and you get in the lounge. This brought about furious arguments between lounge agents and passengers who'd bought a pricey Lufthansa business-class ticket, then travelled from (say) Los Angeles on a Lufthansa flight number - but on an aircraft operated by United Airlines. The agents were carefully following their rule book, which disregarded the notion that the passenger had bought a Lufthansa ticket and believed he'd be travelling on a Lufthansa aircraft, had been mildly surprised to find it was in fact a UA plane, then bitterly disappointed that Lufthansa Nickel and Dimed him on lounge access: and he'd probably take great care not to travel with Lufthansa again.

I think the rules slowly evolved into a more equitable, more understandable, framework.

Worth noting for all the different name, British Airways is happy to welcome to the Concorde Room any passengers flying in the first class cabin of its aircraft.

As airoli says, the Swissair rule seems to be an exercise in pettiness.

chris63

sophialite

miamiflyer8

Not when the dragons come up with asinine policies watering down the experience