websterlewis

The trouble is "Rack" rate has absolutely no monetary value. It is an amount the hotel chooses to place on the value of it's room but I would guess that in 99% of cases 99% per cent of its room will not sell for that (over a 365 day period).

Apart from that, just by the law of averages most late cancellation/no shows would be at hotels that have not sold out or had to restrict room sales because of that one booking. In these cases I believe SPG pay a very small amount to the hotel $35.00 was the amount on the last bill that was slipped under my door with it on (and 20 minutes of messing around at reception to sort it out). So maybe the "no-show" penalty should match that

A far more straight forward approach would be whatever the SPG.com price of the standard room is on the day that you book is what should be the penalty, if the hotel chooses not to take the points.

I think it is best to avoid unnecessary hostilities with customers. If everyone was aware of the exact amount in black and white it would be a lot easier on everyone.

Has anyone had any actual experience of being charged with Hyatt, IHG, Hilton and Marriott when no-showing a points stay??

derpelikan

i had no-shows with hilton and they just took my points.

the hotels should just take the points and spg should pay them a fixed amount　for no-shows.

what is the difference of a no-show and a person actually staying in that room.

points are paid and deducted hotel should automatically get the money from spg if the cancallation deadline is crossed and even if the guest doesnt show up

dp

Sirecca

I tried explaining *wood's perplexing policy to a couple of colleagues yesterday, and this was the analogy I used:

Suppose you need to travel cross-country with only a few weeks notice. The coach fare is $500 but you discover that you can exchange your miles for a ticket and decide that the cash is much more valuable to you at that point than the miles.

Due to unforseen circumstances at the last minute, you miss the flight and aren't able to reschedule.

Instead of just taking your miles, or God forbid charging you the $500 it would have cost you had you purchased a ticket, the airline charges you the published last-minute walk-up fare of $1,750.

I guarantee you there would be Congressional investigations if an airline did that.

Starwood Lurker

It isn't necessarily the RACK rate. It is, however, whatever the hotel's standard cancellation policy is in place at the time for which the award is booked. It can be the RACK rate. It can also be based upon the BAR rate. It depends upon what cancellation policy the hotel has in place for when you are staying.

And this is absolutely my last post on this thread.

Best regards,

William R. Sanders
Online Guest Feedback Coordinator
Starwood Hotels & Resorts Worldwide

[email protected]

websterlewis

To think, this intense debate has only come about on this occasion because some IT guy, in error, stuck 14 days advance as the cancellation period on all points bookings.

I bet William won't be buying him lunch.

Maybe this should serve notice to SPG of leave your (once working) web-site alone!

thor17

If they know this is a mistake, why haven't they fixed it yet??

NBSPGMEMBER

True!

gfowler-ord-1k

There are so many known website problems that have not been fixed. I assume this one is just one of many in the list.

Sirecca

I've checked mutliple properties and the language in the T&Cs for failure to cancel an award reservation is the same: "1 night penalty." Without having to call *wood each time to find out whether that means points, BAR, or RACK, does anyone know where a hotel's actual cancelation policy can be found?

leejeffrey

I happen to have a prepaid Visa giftcard I was given. The card now has about $3 left on it. Just out of curiosity, what sytematic controls would prevent me from using this card in my record to guarantee my reservation. Does the hotel actually authorize the card when you make the reservation? I guess that this would guarantee that I would not get "fined" with a huge cash penalty for a no show as they have already takem my points.

GoingAway

No, they'll just complain to *Wood who will request compensation or close your account and take whatever points you have left.

Really, no idea if that would happen but it's certainly possible.

leejeffrey

I suppose they could do this, but it would seem unlikely. I am sure each of the SPG properties gets "no shows" each year where the hotel guest does not even have an SPG number to close. I would think the hotel would be out of luck in these circumstances.

Matt-KC

It can't be...and that is the problem (speaking of point reservations, not regular reservations). SPG's agreement with the hotels is that they can place whatever cancellation policy they want on the award. What they don't require, however, is for that exact policy to be accuratley disclosed. An accurate policy would include the EXACT penalty you would be subject to. By not requiring that, SPG is essentially allowing it's member properties to make up the rules as they go along, charging you whatever rate they want, and not forcing the accurate disclosure of such.

William's "this is my last post" comment is really a slap in the face for this issue. Obviously SPG is aware of the loopholes in their policy and instead of openly addressing it, they choose to continue the status quo of this hostile policy.

Of course a simple solution is available for this issue, should SPG feel that their customers deserve a fair policy. That would be to include the exact penalty in the award reservation. At the time of reservation, if the property uses points as the penalty, the reservation should specifically detail that the points will be used if you do not cancel by the specified time. If the property chooses to use the cash penalty, then the reservation should include the exact dollar amount that would applied if you did not cancel before the deadline.

Since it is already the responsibility of the property to load their rates into the system, and those rates already have varying cancellation policies, it should be systematically feasible to add this to the award rate when they load that into the system.

Here is a cancellation policy for a regular SPG property (not reward):

All they would need to do is add the specific penalty to the rate they have loaded for the corresponding reward.

Using the term "rack rate" is a wild card to allow a property to charge you whatever they want. Consider the signs on the back of the doors that state the maximum rate for that room (in states that require such). That rate is often a multiple of the rate the room regularly sells for. One recent example is a room that I had booked for $99 (which is the normal rate for that property), but the rate listed on the door was $750.

The current SPG policy of allowing a hotel to charge you whatever they want, and using revenue concern as the excuse is a horrible policy. A folio can be created for point stays just as it can for a cash stay so there should be no revenue issue present. The hotel would still get paid whether the guest showed or not (using William's folio example) as the points could still be redeemed if they did not cancel. This policy puts zero risk (and in reality, places the property in position of undeserved revenue generation) on the hotel and all the risk on the customer.

Not exactly a customer friendly policy for a company that exists in the hospitality industry.

Sirecca

I'm not disagreeing with you, as I haven't been able to find it myself, but in post #60 William says "We tell you in advance that the hotels are going to take the cash instead of the points." He reiterates the advance notice in post #69. Am I just missing something obvious? (Of course, all along I've thought that this was MY problem because I obviously wasn't paying close enough attention to the T&Cs. Now I'm beginning to wonder.)

emuyshondt

I have a C&P reservation at a Sheraton this weekend and under Terms and Conditions (in SPG.com) it states:

Cancellation Policy: Cancel By 4Pm Hotel Time 1 Days Prior To Avoid 1 Night Penalty

No description of the cash amount of the penalty.

Same for a points only reservation at the Westin Resort & Spa Cancun.

Neither explicitly states what a 1 night penalty means: points forfeited? Cash and Points forfeited in C&P? Rack rate? BAR rate? Arbitrary penalty rate for no-shows? I'm sorry William bowed out so quickly. Usually he takes more time to clarify things that are not obvious.