May 10, 2018, 7:14 am
Last edit by: Tokyoite
Regardless of the various arguments on whether SPG Golds were ever really "entitled" to Marriott Gold benefits, etc., etc... one thing is clear: SPG Golds will be losing a benefit mid-year, which is guaranteed 4 pm checkout.
It’s been clarified as of today. Starwood Lurker also just posted a clarification here:
https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/29734454-post980.html
It’s been clarified as of today. Starwood Lurker also just posted a clarification here:
https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/29734454-post980.html
Lifetime and Elite Status Updates
Since our announcement last month, we’ve been listening to member feedback and have a few updates and clarifications to share.
LIFETIME
Based on member response, we’re adding more flexibility for Lifetime Platinum Premier qualification. Now, SPG and Rewards members who achieve 750 nights and 10 years of Platinum status by December 31, 2018 will be grandfathered into that Lifetime tier, which starting in 2019 will no longer be available to earn. Rewards members can also qualify under the current criteria (750 nights + 2M points) through year end.
As we shared previously, members can also qualify for all other Lifetime tiers through both the new criteria on an ongoing basis and under the current criteria through December 31, 2018. And remember, we’ll combine lifetime activity across both Rewards and SPG toward qualification when members combine accounts in August.
AUGUST ELITE STATUS
We’ve also received some questions regarding status in the new program for members who status matched to receive elite in both SPG and Rewards. In August, nights earned (vs. linked status) will determine Elite status in the new program. For example, a SPG Gold member (10 stays/25 nights) who status matched to Rewards Gold Elite (50 nights) will be mapped to Gold Elite (25 nights) in the new program, whereas a Rewards Gold Elite (50 nights) will be mapped to Platinum Elite (50 nights).
The below FAQs hopefully provide even more detail, and have now been added to members.marriott.com. Please be sure to let us know what other questions we can help answer.
Additional FAQs
Can I earn Lifetime status under the legacy requirements (active prior to August 2018) for Lifetime Elite status in Marriott Rewards, Ritz-Carlton Rewards or SPG? If so, when will I be notified of my Lifetime Elite status?
Yes, in addition to earning based on the new criteria, members can earn Lifetime Elite Status under the legacy requirements through the end of 2018. If Lifetime status is achieved by legacy requirements, between August and December 31, 2018 you will receive notice of your updated Lifetime Elite status in January 2019. If Lifetime status is achieved based on the new criteria, you will be notified both in August 2018 as well as any time it is achieved through the end of the year.
Example: An SPG member has 300 Lifetime nights, 4 years of Gold Elite Status, and 1 year of Platinum Elite Status after August, 2018. Under the SPG legacy Lifetime requirements, this member would earn Lifetime Gold Elite status which would reflect in their account January 2019.
If I will not be grandfathered into Lifetime Platinum Premier Elite, will I have the ability to earn into this level in 2018?
Yes, members can earn Lifetime Platinum Premier Elite in 2018 if they achieve 750 Lifetime nights and 10 years at Platinum Elite status. This requirement is only for 2018 and will not be continued in future years. Members will receive notice of this Lifetime achievement in January 2019.
How are years at tenure calculated for Legacy MR and RCR members?
We are keeping members “whole” in the applicable night tier in which they earned their Elite status.
Example: If a member has 4 years of Elite status at the 50 night level (Gold Elite status) they will be counted in August and beyond as 4 years at the new 50 night level (Platinum Elite status). Only the names of the levels are changing. How we account for tenure is not changing.
I already linked my SPG and Rewards accounts. What will happen to my matched elite status in August?
The current status matching opportunity is tier for tier (e.g. Gold gets Gold, Platinum gets Platinum), even though the qualification requirements and benefits between SPG and Rewards are quite different. Given this, the following Elite status mapping will occur in August (unless a member has also qualified by nights for higher status):
SPG Members
· SPG Gold (10 stays/25 nights) is status matched to Rewards Gold Elite (50 nights) and in August will be Gold Elite (25 nights)
· SPG Platinum (25 stays/50 nights) is status matched to Rewards Platinum Elite (75 nights) and in August will be Platinum Elite (50 nights)
Rewards Members
· Rewards Gold Elite (50 nights) is status matched to SPG Gold (10 stays/25 nights) and in August will be Platinum Elite (50 nights)
· Rewards Platinum Elite (75 nights) is status matched to SPG Platinum (25 stays/50 nights) and in August will be Platinum Premier Elite (75 nights)
Question: Does this mean that SPG Gold who is given the elite status from Amex Plat or an airline program with 0 or less than 5 qualifying nights will get matched to... nothing (ie basic)?...Answer: I'm told "No" –if you have the card and get Gold today…you will be mapped to the NEW Gold tier. So, if you have the AMEX Plat/Centurion card that gives you Gold today…you’ll still get Gold status – just with the newly-defined post August 2018 benefits.
LIFETIME
Based on member response, we’re adding more flexibility for Lifetime Platinum Premier qualification. Now, SPG and Rewards members who achieve 750 nights and 10 years of Platinum status by December 31, 2018 will be grandfathered into that Lifetime tier, which starting in 2019 will no longer be available to earn. Rewards members can also qualify under the current criteria (750 nights + 2M points) through year end.
As we shared previously, members can also qualify for all other Lifetime tiers through both the new criteria on an ongoing basis and under the current criteria through December 31, 2018. And remember, we’ll combine lifetime activity across both Rewards and SPG toward qualification when members combine accounts in August.
AUGUST ELITE STATUS
We’ve also received some questions regarding status in the new program for members who status matched to receive elite in both SPG and Rewards. In August, nights earned (vs. linked status) will determine Elite status in the new program. For example, a SPG Gold member (10 stays/25 nights) who status matched to Rewards Gold Elite (50 nights) will be mapped to Gold Elite (25 nights) in the new program, whereas a Rewards Gold Elite (50 nights) will be mapped to Platinum Elite (50 nights).
The below FAQs hopefully provide even more detail, and have now been added to members.marriott.com. Please be sure to let us know what other questions we can help answer.
Additional FAQs
Can I earn Lifetime status under the legacy requirements (active prior to August 2018) for Lifetime Elite status in Marriott Rewards, Ritz-Carlton Rewards or SPG? If so, when will I be notified of my Lifetime Elite status?
Yes, in addition to earning based on the new criteria, members can earn Lifetime Elite Status under the legacy requirements through the end of 2018. If Lifetime status is achieved by legacy requirements, between August and December 31, 2018 you will receive notice of your updated Lifetime Elite status in January 2019. If Lifetime status is achieved based on the new criteria, you will be notified both in August 2018 as well as any time it is achieved through the end of the year.
Example: An SPG member has 300 Lifetime nights, 4 years of Gold Elite Status, and 1 year of Platinum Elite Status after August, 2018. Under the SPG legacy Lifetime requirements, this member would earn Lifetime Gold Elite status which would reflect in their account January 2019.
If I will not be grandfathered into Lifetime Platinum Premier Elite, will I have the ability to earn into this level in 2018?
Yes, members can earn Lifetime Platinum Premier Elite in 2018 if they achieve 750 Lifetime nights and 10 years at Platinum Elite status. This requirement is only for 2018 and will not be continued in future years. Members will receive notice of this Lifetime achievement in January 2019.
How are years at tenure calculated for Legacy MR and RCR members?
We are keeping members “whole” in the applicable night tier in which they earned their Elite status.
Example: If a member has 4 years of Elite status at the 50 night level (Gold Elite status) they will be counted in August and beyond as 4 years at the new 50 night level (Platinum Elite status). Only the names of the levels are changing. How we account for tenure is not changing.
I already linked my SPG and Rewards accounts. What will happen to my matched elite status in August?
The current status matching opportunity is tier for tier (e.g. Gold gets Gold, Platinum gets Platinum), even though the qualification requirements and benefits between SPG and Rewards are quite different. Given this, the following Elite status mapping will occur in August (unless a member has also qualified by nights for higher status):
SPG Members
· SPG Gold (10 stays/25 nights) is status matched to Rewards Gold Elite (50 nights) and in August will be Gold Elite (25 nights)
· SPG Platinum (25 stays/50 nights) is status matched to Rewards Platinum Elite (75 nights) and in August will be Platinum Elite (50 nights)
Rewards Members
· Rewards Gold Elite (50 nights) is status matched to SPG Gold (10 stays/25 nights) and in August will be Platinum Elite (50 nights)
· Rewards Platinum Elite (75 nights) is status matched to SPG Platinum (25 stays/50 nights) and in August will be Platinum Premier Elite (75 nights)
Question: Does this mean that SPG Gold who is given the elite status from Amex Plat or an airline program with 0 or less than 5 qualifying nights will get matched to... nothing (ie basic)?...
SPG Gold today? You will NOT be getting Platinum after August 1st.
Apr 18, 2018, 4:28 pm
#46
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: SFO
Posts: 3,879
Not according to the SVP in charge of the program who clearly states those who qualified for SPG Gold, whether they linked their accounts or not, were on par with the benefits being given under the new Gold. You can argue, disagree, think it is unfair, but that does not change that it is his program, the rules allow him to set the rules and he is the final arbiter if there are questions. "But a blogger said...." or "Some remote Marriott employee knows more about the program than the SVP of the program..." don't change that the verbiage being use about not losing benefits is code for SPG Golds will become new program Golds.
Apr 18, 2018, 4:44 pm
#47
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: SFO
Posts: 3,879
Agree but in the context of who posted a youtube video first, it's irrelevant to this thread topic/discussion.
Agree, who cares who posted a youtube link first.
Apr 18, 2018, 7:16 pm
#48
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: London / Los Angeles
Programs: Hilton Diamond, IHG Diamond Ambassador, Marriott Platinum, Hyatt Globalist, BA Silver
Posts: 1,631
I don't think it is anywhere as clear as some people are saying. He kinda stumbles over the question in a way that is confusing. He also says:
"In 2018 we are not going to be making any changes that takes anything away from our members. For anyone who has Marriott Gold today, they will end up continuing for the rest of the year to give them access to all the benefits [they currently have]".
Ultimately, he says that they will be taking away no benefits from members in 2018 but then when questioned appears to say that those with matched Marriott Gold will not get Platinum in August 2018, which means they are taking away breakfast and lounge access benefits from those members.
Given the contradictions in this video, I think until we have a clear definite statement on this from Marriott in writing - no matter what some of the current Platinums on this thread want to push as fact!
"In 2018 we are not going to be making any changes that takes anything away from our members. For anyone who has Marriott Gold today, they will end up continuing for the rest of the year to give them access to all the benefits [they currently have]".
Ultimately, he says that they will be taking away no benefits from members in 2018 but then when questioned appears to say that those with matched Marriott Gold will not get Platinum in August 2018, which means they are taking away breakfast and lounge access benefits from those members.
Given the contradictions in this video, I think until we have a clear definite statement on this from Marriott in writing - no matter what some of the current Platinums on this thread want to push as fact!
Apr 18, 2018, 7:32 pm
#49
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 196
I am SPG Gold. I got it the hard way by staying all those nights. I expect to be Plat. If I don't get Platinum, I will call and complain.
Apr 18, 2018, 7:32 pm
#50
Suspended
Original Poster
Join Date: Mar 2017
Programs: AC
Posts: 2,167
I don't think it is anywhere as clear as some people are saying. He kinda stumbles over the question in a way that is confusing. He also says:
"In 2018 we are not going to be making any changes that takes anything away from our members. For anyone who has Marriott Gold today, they will end up continuing for the rest of the year to give them access to all the benefits [they currently have]".
Ultimately, he says that they will be taking away no benefits from members in 2018 but then when questioned appears to say that those with matched Marriott Gold will not get Platinum in August 2018, which means they are taking away breakfast and lounge access benefits from those members.
Given the contradictions in this video, I think until we have a clear definite statement on this from Marriott in writing - no matter what some of the current Platinums on this thread want to push as fact!
"In 2018 we are not going to be making any changes that takes anything away from our members. For anyone who has Marriott Gold today, they will end up continuing for the rest of the year to give them access to all the benefits [they currently have]".
Ultimately, he says that they will be taking away no benefits from members in 2018 but then when questioned appears to say that those with matched Marriott Gold will not get Platinum in August 2018, which means they are taking away breakfast and lounge access benefits from those members.
Given the contradictions in this video, I think until we have a clear definite statement on this from Marriott in writing - no matter what some of the current Platinums on this thread want to push as fact!
Apr 18, 2018, 7:33 pm
#51
Suspended
Original Poster
Join Date: Mar 2017
Programs: AC
Posts: 2,167
What planet are you living on? If you didn't earn Marriott Gold the hard way, which has more stringent requirements than SPG Gold, then no, you should not expect to get Platinum, and feel free to whine all you want.
Apr 18, 2018, 7:34 pm
#52
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Original Poster
Join Date: Mar 2017
Programs: AC
Posts: 2,167
It is an attestation to how much or how little someone pays attention to details, but anyways, let's move on.
Apr 18, 2018, 7:43 pm
#53
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Programs: SPG Platinum; Hyatt Platinum; HH Blue; Best Western Platinum; Qantas Gold; Virgin; Hawaiian
Posts: 23
I have been enjoying all of the comments about this 'merger'. I would like to say that whilst Marriott / Starwood are a USA hotel company, they do have a large international presence and my particular instance being located in Asia/Pacific, we do NOT have access to Amex or UA cards or any other such credit card device... has to be "beds".
And of course, all Asia/Pacific hotels are very much in the 5-star category - Starwood went out of their way up until about 2014 trying to put Sheraton / W / Westin into China and leaving the Pacific as a poor cousin (more closures) - that has changed now with Westins & W's going into a number of Australian cities and Four Points are also be made up-market, still nothing back in NZ
I would be interested to know what the numbers are for the mix of international vs USA members looks like
Why the context - well it is very hard to have a responsible budget and stay at these places, so we work a lot harder to get the same recognition as our USA peers (and from looking at the posts overnight the Canadiens are in the same boat (not too much from Europe yet)
back on point - I received 2 emails, the 1st is what I now know came from Marriott which said Lifetime Gold elite would go to Lifetime Plat (big celebration there able to keep the late checkout etc) and then the kicker an SPG email saying LTGold goes to LTGold (and loss of amenities)
so.... why are Marriot LTGOLD going Plat and SPG are not - sorry where is that fair
And of course, all Asia/Pacific hotels are very much in the 5-star category - Starwood went out of their way up until about 2014 trying to put Sheraton / W / Westin into China and leaving the Pacific as a poor cousin (more closures) - that has changed now with Westins & W's going into a number of Australian cities and Four Points are also be made up-market, still nothing back in NZ
I would be interested to know what the numbers are for the mix of international vs USA members looks like
Why the context - well it is very hard to have a responsible budget and stay at these places, so we work a lot harder to get the same recognition as our USA peers (and from looking at the posts overnight the Canadiens are in the same boat (not too much from Europe yet)
back on point - I received 2 emails, the 1st is what I now know came from Marriott which said Lifetime Gold elite would go to Lifetime Plat (big celebration there able to keep the late checkout etc) and then the kicker an SPG email saying LTGold goes to LTGold (and loss of amenities)
so.... why are Marriot LTGOLD going Plat and SPG are not - sorry where is that fair
Apr 18, 2018, 8:50 pm
#54
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: London / Los Angeles
Programs: Hilton Diamond, IHG Diamond Ambassador, Marriott Platinum, Hyatt Globalist, BA Silver
Posts: 1,631
Seriously though, I don't disagree that he seemed to be saying that only those who "earned" Marriott Gold would get Platinum status but then he also said that Marriott would not be taking away any benefits from any of its members in 2018. Basically he contradicted himself a couple of times which was confusing. He definitely could have been clearer.
I think we would all be happier if Marriott just issued something unequivocal in writing.
I will say though that if I had booked a non refundable hotel stay past August partly on the basis of using the lounge benefits from my Marriott Gold status, I would not be happy about having that benefit removed before my status expired. Based on this kind of scenario, I would still bet on Marriott upgrading all Golds to Plat through 2018 even if it means reversing their decision... but only time will tell.
Apr 18, 2018, 8:56 pm
#55
Join Date: Jul 2017
Programs: IHG spire ambassador, SPG/Marriott Gold(new plat), Virgin Atlantic
Posts: 150
yep, bottom line in my case I earned with my 2017 stays SPG gold for 2018 which is a guaranteed 4pm checkout... now Marriott gifted me a match to their old gold which also has 4pm which was nice and i stayed at a few of their properties because of that, but as of August this benefit is being reduced to "2pm subject to availability" at all Marriott & spg hotels. Bottom line is that's a reduction in benefits. Hopefully Marriott will do the right thing here and find a work around, perhaps have spg properties still honor the 4pm for remainder of year to honor what was earnef but not upgrade to all platinum benefits? If not I could see many customers being upset by that and taking their business elsewhere...
I really hope Marriott does it right as i really want to drop IHG as i like the Springhills a lot more than HIX for those roadside quick stays! Time will tell
I really hope Marriott does it right as i really want to drop IHG as i like the Springhills a lot more than HIX for those roadside quick stays! Time will tell
Last edited by somedudefromFLa; Apr 18, 2018 at 9:03 pm
Apr 18, 2018, 8:59 pm
#56
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: ZOA, SFO, HKG
Programs: UA 1K 0.9MM, Marriott Gold, HHonors Gold, Hertz PC, SBux Gold, TSA Pre✓
Posts: 13,811
This is addressed in the Q&A video. If you have status in both programs the higher or the two will honored, although matched status from one program to the other will not be considered. In that case, the status earned originally will be considered, not the matched status.
First - forget the metals. Second, if you obtain your status through SPG-Marriott merger match, please forget your newly matched level and go back to your original unmatched status. You simply need to focus the issue by the night requirement to know your new level.
SPG Gold needs 25 night. Marriott Gold needs 50. Regardless how you obtain the SPG Gold (actual stay, AMEX, etc.), your new level will align to whatever level that represents 25 night or more, which is the new Gold. From the same logic, regardless how you obtain the Marriott Gold (actual stay, UA, etc.), your new level will align to whatever level that represents 50 night or more, which is the new Platinum.
LT status also aligns by the same logic.
In short, because SPG status requirement is generally lower than Marriott, SPG members will be hit by this the most. IMHO - what Marriott has done seems fair as it is based on your actual history except to the fact that LT Platinum Premier is a one-time thing only.
Apr 18, 2018, 9:02 pm
#57
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Barcelona, London, on a plane
Programs: BA Silver, TK E+, AA PP, Hyatt Globalist, Marriott LT Plat, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 13,041
Yet another example of how a travel company being generous gets themselves into difficulties.
Nobody and I mean nobody believed in 2015/2016 that SPG Gold was in any way equivalent to Marriott Gold. Not in terms of benefits obviously, but also in the criteria for earning the status. Yet Marriott decided to be generous and let SPG Golds match to Marriott Gold.
Fast forward two years and there are massive screams of protest as Marriott reverts to saying that 50+ nights are needed for the main status benefits.
Yeah, I know, you all have non-refundable reservations at Marriott hotels post-August based on expected benefits. And I have a giraffe that needs to join me in my complimentary suite...
Nobody and I mean nobody believed in 2015/2016 that SPG Gold was in any way equivalent to Marriott Gold. Not in terms of benefits obviously, but also in the criteria for earning the status. Yet Marriott decided to be generous and let SPG Golds match to Marriott Gold.
Fast forward two years and there are massive screams of protest as Marriott reverts to saying that 50+ nights are needed for the main status benefits.
Yeah, I know, you all have non-refundable reservations at Marriott hotels post-August based on expected benefits. And I have a giraffe that needs to join me in my complimentary suite...
Apr 18, 2018, 9:21 pm
#58
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,324
Yet another example of how a travel company being generous gets themselves into difficulties.
Nobody and I mean nobody believed in 2015/2016 that SPG Gold was in any way equivalent to Marriott Gold. Not in terms of benefits obviously, but also in the criteria for earning the status. Yet Marriott decided to be generous and let SPG Golds match to Marriott Gold.
Fast forward two years and there are massive screams of protest as Marriott reverts to saying that 50+ nights are needed for the main status benefits.
Yeah, I know, you all have non-refundable reservations at Marriott hotels post-August based on expected benefits. And I have a giraffe that needs to join me in my complimentary suite...
Nobody and I mean nobody believed in 2015/2016 that SPG Gold was in any way equivalent to Marriott Gold. Not in terms of benefits obviously, but also in the criteria for earning the status. Yet Marriott decided to be generous and let SPG Golds match to Marriott Gold.
Fast forward two years and there are massive screams of protest as Marriott reverts to saying that 50+ nights are needed for the main status benefits.
Yeah, I know, you all have non-refundable reservations at Marriott hotels post-August based on expected benefits. And I have a giraffe that needs to join me in my complimentary suite...
Apr 18, 2018, 9:44 pm
#59
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: BDU
Programs: DL:MM, Marriott:LTT
Posts: 8,779
I noticed the stumble, too, but had a very different inkling. It appeared he was trying to make sure he said the right words that were clear and met the rehearsed marketing verbiage. He repeated the party line a few times about not losing any benefits. The answer seemed very rehearsed so I took the pause as a shift from spontaneity into making sure he said every word exactly the way he memorized, that he followed the right script. And he explained that SPG Golds were not losing any SPG Gold benefits, of which breakfast was not one.
As someone who speaks publicly for a living and has done so for twenty years I can tell you that appeared to be a canned, prepared answer that was written. vetted, memorized and maybe even edited after the fact. If I am having dinner with friends and someone asks a question I often apologize first because I know I am about to give a prepared answer. It just comes across too methodical and detailed to be off the cuff. Even the voice changes, like his did. into clipped over enunciation with step by step points.
As someone who speaks publicly for a living and has done so for twenty years I can tell you that appeared to be a canned, prepared answer that was written. vetted, memorized and maybe even edited after the fact. If I am having dinner with friends and someone asks a question I often apologize first because I know I am about to give a prepared answer. It just comes across too methodical and detailed to be off the cuff. Even the voice changes, like his did. into clipped over enunciation with step by step points.
Apr 18, 2018, 9:45 pm
#60
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2017
Programs: AS 75K, DL Silver, UA Platinum, Hilton Gold, Hyatt Discoverist, Marriott Platinum + LT Gold
Posts: 10,498