Let’s talk about alternatives to the SPG Amex after the massive Marriott devaluation
Aug 18, 2018, 3:20 pm
#571
Join Date: May 2011
Location: NYC (LGA, JFK), CT
Programs: Delta Platinum, American Gold, JetBlue Mosaic 4, Marriott Platinum, Hyatt Explorist, Hilton Diamond,
Posts: 4,888
I spent most of my SPG points on Starwood hotels, but if I were to transfer 60K points to AA and end up with 75K miles, I can book a one way biz award ticket on CX that may run $4,000-5,000 (say NYC to HKG). There is just no way one is going to get $4K+ of value from 60K Starpoints.
So it's incorrect to make a blanket statement that "the best value of the SPG points are hotel redemption"
So it's incorrect to make a blanket statement that "the best value of the SPG points are hotel redemption"
Aug 18, 2018, 3:43 pm
#572
Join Date: May 2011
Location: NYC (LGA, JFK), CT
Programs: Delta Platinum, American Gold, JetBlue Mosaic 4, Marriott Platinum, Hyatt Explorist, Hilton Diamond,
Posts: 4,888
I’m not sure if this was mentioned in this thread, but if you have $15,000 of dining and grocery spend to spare, you can earn 90,000 Hilton miles and a free weekend night with the Hilton Ascend. That puts you pretty close to two weeekend nights at Hilton’s most expensive properties every year. WOH Card seems solid as well.
For airlines, general spending should go on a Chase UR or Amex MR Card depending on what miles you value the most. People who highly value AA miles should consider buying them every year given their sales. Delta loyalists should consider the Amex cards with Mile Boost.
For airlines, general spending should go on a Chase UR or Amex MR Card depending on what miles you value the most. People who highly value AA miles should consider buying them every year given their sales. Delta loyalists should consider the Amex cards with Mile Boost.
Aug 18, 2018, 3:53 pm
#573
Join Date: May 2015
Location: LAX, BUR
Programs: AS,AA,JB, HH Gold, Starriott Titanium Elite, Hyatt Explorist, Global Entry
Posts: 1,929
Why you want to make the argument and compare apple vs orange?
Most people use the SPG card for the base earning and transfer for miles. For $20,000 spending on the old SPG card, you get 20,000 starpoints and you can transfer to 25,000 miles.
With the AmEx BBP card, with $20,000 spending, the base earning is 40,000 MR points, which can be transferred to 40,000 partner miles.
How you max the SPG and get 3x? Only through Marriott/RC/SPG hotel stays. That is very limited. AmEx has a full lineup of other cards that can earn MR points, such as the Plat, PRG, EDP etc....
Most people use the SPG card for the base earning and transfer for miles. For $20,000 spending on the old SPG card, you get 20,000 starpoints and you can transfer to 25,000 miles.
With the AmEx BBP card, with $20,000 spending, the base earning is 40,000 MR points, which can be transferred to 40,000 partner miles.
How you max the SPG and get 3x? Only through Marriott/RC/SPG hotel stays. That is very limited. AmEx has a full lineup of other cards that can earn MR points, such as the Plat, PRG, EDP etc....
We're comparing old SPG to new SPG which the earning is equal for transfers.
Since you want to mix things in, using the SPGB on one of the 4x categories spending $20k would = 75k plus miles
$40k= 160k miles
$60k= 240k miles.
Aug 18, 2018, 4:25 pm
#574
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: LGA/JFK/EWR
Programs: UA 1K1.75MM, Hyatt Globalist, abandoned Marriott LTT (RIP SPG), Hertz PC
Posts: 21,166
Me, I like to finance my personal global travels from both my work travel/spend as well as any personal spend I have. And that means earning points/miles in the natural sense, not spending thousands of miles just to buy them.
Aug 18, 2018, 4:32 pm
#575
Suspended
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: EWR/PHL/BWI
Posts: 4,412
You're the one missing the point, the SPGB & Marriott Biz 4X categories are not at hotels at all, it's dining and gas to name two.
We're comparing old SPG to new SPG which the earning is equal for transfers.
Since you want to mix things in, using the SPGB on one of the 4x categories spending $20k would = 75k plus miles
$40k= 160k miles
$60k= 240k miles.
We're comparing old SPG to new SPG which the earning is equal for transfers.
Since you want to mix things in, using the SPGB on one of the 4x categories spending $20k would = 75k plus miles
$40k= 160k miles
$60k= 240k miles.
SPG Amex Business vs. Personal:
- Annual fee: $95, waived for the first year, for both cards.
- Authorized users: SPG Business lets you add 99 additional users, and does not charge a fee for any of them. SPG Personal doesn’t charge a fee either, but you can only add 5.
- Initial bonus: For SPG business, it’s 25,000 points for spending $5,000 in the first three months. For SPG personal, it’s 25,000 points for spending $3,000 in the same period.
- Hotel rewards: Both cards give you 4 Starpoints per $1 spent at Starwood hotels (5 if you have Starwood Elite status).
- Everyday spending rewards: Both cards offer 1 Starpoint per $1 on non-Starwood purchases.
- Redemption: Both cards let you redeem points for free nights at Starwood hotels as well as flights booked on the SPG website. You can also exchange your points for frequent flyer miles from SPG’s airline partners. But the personal card limits you to 9 free nights per year. After that, you’ll have to use the other redemption options or just wait.
- Transfer bonus: Both cards offer a 5,000-point bonus when you transfer 20,000 Starpoints to one of Starwood’s 30+ airline partners. Options include Delta, Virgin Atlantic and Jet Airways. You can find the full list on the SPG website.
- Gold status bonus: Both cards give you Gold status if you spend $30,000 in a calendar year. Gold status members get free room upgrades when available.
- Free Wi-Fi: The business and personal options both give you Boingo Wi-Fi access and free Wi-Fi at Starwood hotels.
- Sheraton Club lounge access: The SPG Business Card gives you free access to Sheraton Club lounges – spaces inside Sheraton hotels where members can relax, socialize or work. They also feature free snacks and drinks. The personal version doesn’t offer this perk.
Where AmEx BBP give you 2.00 miles/$. And Chase FU gives you 1.5 miles/$. Those are the base categories, not counting Chase CSR 3x UR and AmEx Plat 5x on airfare and prepaid hotels....
Anything still no clear?
Aug 18, 2018, 10:15 pm
#578
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: DUB/ORD/SIN/PVG
Programs: EI AerClub Concierge, EK Gold, BA Gold, BD Gold (Retired), HHonors Diamond, Bonvoy Lifetime Gold
Posts: 2,923
Went with AMEX plat about 18 months ago and haven’t looked back (frequent long haul travel so the 5x for airfare makes sense).
One side benefit has been much more rational decision making on both airline and hotel loyalty.
The 5x points and instant trasfers makes it much more fun to shop around for upgrade friendly airlines (switched all Asia travel to Emirates partly because of this).
FHR takes much of the lottery out of decent benefits on leisure stays when it really matters. On works stays I have stopped caring...
One side benefit has been much more rational decision making on both airline and hotel loyalty.
The 5x points and instant trasfers makes it much more fun to shop around for upgrade friendly airlines (switched all Asia travel to Emirates partly because of this).
FHR takes much of the lottery out of decent benefits on leisure stays when it really matters. On works stays I have stopped caring...
Aug 19, 2018, 4:34 am
#579
Join Date: May 2011
Location: NYC (LGA, JFK), CT
Programs: Delta Platinum, American Gold, JetBlue Mosaic 4, Marriott Platinum, Hyatt Explorist, Hilton Diamond,
Posts: 4,888
If one wants to spend excess thousands of dollars every time there is a points/miles sale, that is their prerogative.
Me, I like to finance my personal global travels from both my work travel/spend as well as any personal spend I have. And that means earning points/miles in the natural sense, not spending thousands of miles just to buy them.
Me, I like to finance my personal global travels from both my work travel/spend as well as any personal spend I have. And that means earning points/miles in the natural sense, not spending thousands of miles just to buy them.
2) I was just questioning the concept that 75,000 AA miles should be valued at $4,000 to $5,000 (the standard one-way cost for a flight to Asia). Unless you are ready, willing and able to spend that in cash regularly for such flights, that’s not the real value. You should probably value those miles at whatever cost you regularly buy business class flights for in cash.
Aug 19, 2018, 5:36 am
#580
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: LGA/JFK/EWR
Programs: UA 1K1.75MM, Hyatt Globalist, abandoned Marriott LTT (RIP SPG), Hertz PC
Posts: 21,166
2) I was just questioning the concept that 75,000 AA miles should be valued at $4,000 to $5,000 (the standard one-way cost for a flight to Asia). Unless you are ready, willing and able to spend that in cash regularly for such flights, that’s not the real value. You should probably value those miles at whatever cost you regularly buy business class flights for in cash.
Of course I could pay for them whenever I wanted too - but that's not the point. Ergo, I value those 75K miles at $4K-$5K redemption.
Aug 19, 2018, 1:00 pm
#581
Join Date: Feb 2013
Programs: Hyatt Globalist, MLife Gold, Marriott Gold, HHonors Gold, Caesars Diamond, Amex Plat
Posts: 5,937
I've got that $60 off $300 on SPG offer on both my BBP and SPG Biz. Total spend will be around $500. At this point, am I better off with BBP 2x Membership Rewards or SPG 6x Marriott Rewards? My head is spinning with conversions.
Aug 19, 2018, 1:41 pm
#582
Join Date: May 2015
Location: LAX, BUR
Programs: AS,AA,JB, HH Gold, Starriott Titanium Elite, Hyatt Explorist, Global Entry
Posts: 1,929
Do you need a calculator or Redsun's phone number?
Aug 19, 2018, 2:47 pm
#583
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Programs: SPG, AA, UAL, Hyatt, Amex Plat
Posts: 38
:
REGISTER BY SEPTEMBER 9, 2018, AND EARN BONUS POINTS FOR ELIGIBLE PURCHASES MADE ON YOUR CARD THROUGH OCTOBER 31, 2018.
Basically, earn an extra 2 points per $ up to $15K before October 31st.
Pretty clear to me that whether this is a "devaluation" or not, Amex is feeling the pinch...
REGISTER BY SEPTEMBER 9, 2018, AND EARN BONUS POINTS FOR ELIGIBLE PURCHASES MADE ON YOUR CARD THROUGH OCTOBER 31, 2018.
Basically, earn an extra 2 points per $ up to $15K before October 31st.
Pretty clear to me that whether this is a "devaluation" or not, Amex is feeling the pinch...
Last edited by KParks; Aug 19, 2018 at 2:51 pm Reason: fix quote
Aug 19, 2018, 3:46 pm
#584
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: a hotel room, somewhere...
Posts: 962
as to your assault on my simple math: percentages are a funny thing- they depend on your perspective. i live in the real world where i am comparing real numbers/points/money. since you're so far removed from reality that you think putting 7 figures @ the previous 3x was stupid, i guess i'll have to walk you thru it:
$10,000 spent now is 20,000 MR points
$10,000 spent before was 30,000 MR points.
to 'earn' 30,000 MR points NOW, one must spend $15,000........ which is 50% MORE spend
$10,000 spent on a 2% cash back card 'earns' $200
$15,000 spent on a 2% cash back card 'earns' $300 --- well, look at that... FIFTY PERCENT MORE $
the opportunity cost of using the AWFUL, MASSIVELY devalued SPG card is 50%. the spend itself has a quantifiable cost. that cost is now 50% higher than it was on July 31st. (period)
this stands alone. now, factor in the substantial devaluation that has/is taking place, and it's well beyond 50%. top marriott (non-RC) were 45,000, now they can be as high as 110,000 points (ignore this 4 month period of 'deals' on high end properties, it's a carrot with the stick in force thereafter). Cat 2 goes up TWENTY FIVE % from 10,000 to 12,500, and 50% (15,000 points) when subjectively called 'peak' starting in 4 months. WOW... brutal. imo, factoring everything in, the return on my spend on the card has been devalued by at least 60%.
marriott did their yearly carnage to their award chart 3/7/18, further massively devalued it 8/18/18, further massively devalues it 1/1/19 and will, no doubt, further massively devalue it 3/19.
in the decade or so i've had my SPG card, i've received outsized value for every day spend. that proposition ended in 4/18 when marriott announced the new award chart and 50% devaluation of my spend on the card. it now makes zero sense to put additional spend on the card. i'll likely keep it for the free night and put a $1 purchase on it every 6 months to keep it active. but even that isn't for sure, as the free night isn't that great on the new chart, and i am lifetime plat premier, so i don't need the 15 nights (the most compelling feature for many).
it's a sad day when the ihg card, with that terrible 'reward' program, is a superior card to the spg card. with it's 4th night free on award bookings feature, it's clearly a better card. #ripspg
Aug 19, 2018, 5:12 pm
#585
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 107
I received an email. I have not seen it advertised. Maybe you can call Amex?