mooper

All of this is true, but overlooks the fact that it's describing rather extreme outliers. Very few Marriott LTPs got there through such extreme methods, and certainly not enough to justify giving favorable treatment to SPG LTPs who have under 750 nights. Even out of the 750+ SPG LTPers, there are some who gamed it a bit. I have two co-workers who for years have earned millions of SPG points via CC spend and redeem them readily and accumulate status nights that way. I don't see how this differs from someone who runs up Marriott CC charges to earn nights.

This wouldn't be equal opportunity if given to SPG LTPs with 500-750 nights, it would be favortism. Lurker - could you confirm whether a change is underway to give *all* SPG LTPs LTPP, just those with 750+ nights, or if no change is afoot? If thing if all are given LTPP - even those with 500-750 nights, there will be an even bigger backlash than if nothing is done.

spgplat21

Why in the world would there be an even bigger backlash? The best thing that ever happened to marriott elites was the Starwood acquisition. Even if they downgraded marriott platinums from premier to regular platinum that would still be more benefits than they ever saw under the old MR program.

yeunganson

I think being more generous generate more goodwill. I think it is not the same by equating a night in Starwood that you actually stay in vs some bonus nights received from credit card. The 2 million spend on credit card/stays is requirement at Marriott also hostile to those members that live in countries that don't have Marriott credit cards. I am sure their IT staff can calculate the average number of nights (that was actually sleeping in hotels) current Lifetime Marriott Plats have. Then calculate the average number of years these Lifetime Marriott Plats have been "Plats" with Marriott and how much revenue they bring by just sleeping in hotels. Then make adjustments on the global footprint that Marriott has vs Starwood and come to a proper qualification for giving SPG Lifetime Plat members the Life-time Platinum Premier status. I will put it further that those 10 years, 500 nights in loyalty that the SPG program put members through are Life-time Platinum Premier material - especially when these members still have decades of revenue to bring in.

In theory, the cream of the crop members of both programs that have been loyal for extended period of time with life-time status should be promoted to the new Lifetime Platinum Premier. The beef SPG members have is their best of best life-time customers that Marriott spent a fortune acquiring isn't being treated equally as those in Marriott.

X-ON

My suggestion to solve this obvious problem would be to;
(1) Any SPG LTP with 750+ nights => LTPP
(2) Any SPG LTG with 500+ nights => LTP alt. Any SPG LTG with 750+ nights => LTP

I am talking my own book here since I am a LTG with 800+ nights as of now this merger is quite a downgrade for me ...

I wonder what the cost of the above scheme would be for MAR?, Do anyone have any idea how many accounts we are talking about with respect of the above simple scheme?
If it not enrages legacy MR members and not affect too many accounts it could be a way out for MAR to
(a) Look gracious
(b) Give the impression that they listen to their customers
(c) Give the impression that they value both MR and SPG customers equally

yeunganson

I think the issue is still our 750 nights are more difficult to achieve than Marriott 750 nights due to their credit card bonus nights and 3 times the footprint in hotels. So a proper threshold should have been lower than 750 that Marriott has.

To be honest, they should have put in the 10 year Platinum requirements in additional to the nights for their new Life-time Platinum Premier Elite grandfathering. Anyhow, let's just hope their team is reconsidering this and making may make adjustments in the months ahead.

Keyser

i'm also of the opinion that only spg lifetime plats with over 750 nights should be grandfathered in the ltpp category....not to put down those with between 500 - 750 nights but its just fair if we are asking to be treated the same as marriott lifetime plats....

having said that, lets look at the bigger picture....how many spg lifetime plats would there be who are between the 500 - 750 nights range????my guess is that it would be a few hundred at best....giving these members a goodwill gesture & putting them at the same level as marriott lifetime plats would go a long way to ensure their loyalty....if i was in that boat & i were given this benefit then i would remain loyal to the program & not think about going anywhere else....i'm sure others would feel the same way....

X-ON

In principle I agree with you, and I think it is evident what is lacking in the mapping of LT statues into the new program; a least common denominator. For me it is mind boggling that MAR did not create one least common denominator between the programs that almost everybody regardless of origin and location could agree upon being fair and unbiased.
I think MAR overlooked that people would compare with "the other side", i.e. LT PLT SPG member with 750+ nights would feel unfairly treated with respect to LT PLT MR members getting LTPP and LT GLD members with 500+ nights would feel unfairly treated vs. LT MR GLD/PLT getting LTP/LTPP with in more than one variable having shown equal or more loyalty to the SPG brand(s) which now belongs to MAR... ( from my own point of view: especially as it seems that the GLD benefits are severely diluted .)

This feeling of unfair treatment is what is getting expressed on this board...there is still time if MAR want to change this by alter the matching procedure to address these shortcommings but it has to be done without creating a similar feeling on the MR side, therefore I see it being very unlikely that LTPP would be awarded to any SPG LTP with less than 750 nights, even though in many cases a lot of the MR nights are roll-over etc to address that so late in the game I wouldn't bet much money on.
But I would think if they mapped nights in SPG and MR into the new LT tiers nobody would complain ... at the end of the day that seems to be one variable most people agrees upon and IMHO it would create a goodwill among its customers, and most importantly it would reduce the feeling of "we and them" among MARs current customer base, at least those that are subject to LT matching.

If I were at MAR I would ask myself what is the cost of doing this and what is benefit...regarding this I don't have enough information to make a call ...but we should also cut them some slack a merger of two hotel loyalty programs on this scale haven't been done before so I would certainly not blame them if they amend some of the matching procedures closer to the 1st of August.

mooper

Generosity creates more goodwill to the point where it's fair, but issuing SPG LTPs with 500-750 nights the same status as MRP LTPs with 750+ nights is not fair because the vast majority from each group earned their nights the hard way (both groups have a small set of outliers who optimized their use of special offers to earn non-stay nights, so this shouldn't matter much in the bigger picture).

Well put, and agreed.

This type of logic could be used both ways and applies to a very small percentage of members in the first place. For example, many SPG LTPs got there by spending copiously on the superb Amex SPG CC, then redeeming their points for awards that earned status nights. This wasn't even possible with Marriott a few years back. It goes both ways. Some Marriott LTPs (myself included) earned a ton of nights through meetings and rollover. But again, all together, such "gamers" are a tiny minority... most non-Flyertalk LTPers from both brands are clueless about such methods.

dilbertsdaddy

I totally understand all the back and forth over the LTP vs. LTPP issue. It seems to be settled although there is a good chance the backlash will work. Good luck.

However, I'm confused as to why there has been no discussion over lifetime years. 50 nights is the new benchmark for Plat so in my view MR Gold years should count. Maybe that is settled too as far as what the document says but unlike the LTP/LTPP issue there should be people on both sides with this issue.

I have the combined nights but only have 5 years SPG Plat and probably only 1-2 years MR Plat (don't know, they can't tell me) but I know I have tons of Gold years (which they can't tell me either). I guess I should have saved all those old membership cards!

50 is 50, words are just words - old Gold is New Plat

jmkclee

RAPC

I was on the telephone earlier to sort out an issue with a Marriott stay for later this year and thought I would ask the agent how things were with all of the stuff going on. Feedback was as expected, namely that they are insanely busy and handled a lot of queries. I mentioned the LTP issue and I got a chuckle and sigh combo from the agent. She then mentioned that I must be happy as I was going to have LTPP soon. I queried this as I am SPG LTP, with circa 550 nights, having shifted many of my nights over to Marriott after qualifying with the deal already agreed.

She was adamant that I would be getting LTPP as 'there are some further updates', despite me pointing out what was communicated to us a few days ago. I've asked her to put it in writing, but I'm not holding out too much hope of seeing that email!

I do think there should be equality in the lifetime status for both schemes when coming together, because you cannot compare them like for like. You shoot for the targets set, which in both cases meant LTP in the scheme as of today. That said, Marriott presented what they did earlier this week and although it isn't equitable, it is what it is. It's the hope that is the potential killer now after being told that things are changing. I can probably take the original announcement on the chin a lot more easily than having a promise of something that quite possibly won't happen.

Whatever happens in the coming weeks and months, I wish you all happy and safe travels.

jrothenb

Thrilled to hear that the agent you spoke with confirmed the same information that the agent I spoke with last night did, namely that she spoke with two MR supervisors, and was told definitively that existing SPG LTP will be grandfathered as LTPP. I did get this in writing, and also posted the communications in here somewhere. Now, just waiting for a more "senior" announcement.

shuuy

I see that it's "7 days before the system recognises lifetime platinum".

Can I clarify something with the thread then on whether I should hustle for SPG stays?
* I'm 9 years platinum, 850 nights
* If I get 25 stays before August, then I hit 10th year as qualified platinum

Question 1: does lifetime platinum kick in when I hit 25 stays... Or is it 1 January? [I think 25 stays]
Question 2: should I try and hit 25 stays before 1 August [I think yes, as there's a non-zero chance of LTPP; but if I qualify for platinum after then there's a zero chance]

Thanks

EC Traveler

I am in a very different situation than many, but am just as eager and curious and would love any confirmation, or correction, and advice you can provide. For me, I am LTG and in my 8th year of Platinum. I have only 363 nights with Starwood - I achieve my Plat via 25 one-night stays quite often - just the nature of my travel. I also have 189 lifetime nights with Marriott. I have no idea if I have any previous Marriott Elite status based on nights - I might, but probably at best Gold, not Platinum.

Off the bat ... I have two questions.

1. Other than: A) 48 hour guarantee b) 25% more bonus points and C) an extra 5 SNA's ... is there any tangible difference for Marriott LTP vis LTPP?

I don't need/use the 48 hour ... bonus points is minor, and since I don't have SPG50, I actually "win" just getting to Platinum Elite with 5 SNA's now. If I understand all of this correctly, I don't feel like needing to push (except out of principle) for any workaround/plan for LTPP.

2. The plan this year will be to once again get to 25 stays with SPG, ... so if I do that, then I will be at 9 years but still many stays away from earning LTP through the old SPG Program. HOWEVER ... I could adjust my stay pattern and hit the 50 night Marriott/SPG stay threshold likley pretty easily ... as long as my 10 AMEX SPG nights count in that calculation (5 x 2 cards). THEN, I'd of course need a way to see if that helps, b/c otherwise I'm still at 9 years and no LTP. So with that in mind ...

No matter what, I don't see a path for me, by one year off, to getting to SPG LTP by end of 2018, so if the rumors are true, I'm one year away from SPG LTP mapping to Marriott LTPP ... which is again assuming they change the mapping like many speculate.

And if I go the Marriott Route, and qualify for it via Marriott Stays then still, even if I have a 1 year status count with Marriott, that gives me 10 years, and if I get 63 nights this year then 600 nights in total (doable!) then I'd reach LTP but not LTPP.

So bottom line ... LTPP is not going to happen for me, no matter what, no matter what crazy plan I come up with, due simply to me being one year away.

If anyone has any crazy thoughts on how I might possibly enhance my situation, I'm all ears. Otherwise I'll make sure to get my 9th year of SPG/Marriott Plat by the end of this year, leaving me one year more to go, plus a few nights (to get to 600 total) and then I'll have earned Marriott LTP.

Have we concluded how/if Marriott can tell us our years of Status that would count?

Thanks for bearing with me!

GVA