*a rtw stopover counting with surface sectors
 

I am really butting heads with both my TA, the NZ desk, and most recently with a "supervisor" at UA on this.

The situation is this. I have a lot of surface sectors. The definitions of how to count surface sectors are all located in the "Transfers" section of the rules sheet for some reason. Anyways, section 9f states:
"Surface Sectors: Intermediate surface sectors permitted at passenger’s expense. If such break in itinerary exceeds 24 hours it is considered as one stopover... The last point of arrival and the first point of departure together count as one stopover."

So as I count it, a simplified theoretical (not valid either) itinerary of:
LAX-AKL; surface; CHC-SYD; surface; PER-LAX would count as 5 coupons (24 allowed) but only 2 stopovers (15 allowed). AKL being the first point of arrival and CHC being the last point of departure would "together count as ONE stopover". Same thing for the SYD to PER surface segement. TWO stopovers Right?

A number of flyertalk folks have told me that my way is correct. And it is certainly logical. However, I have the desks telling me this is FOUR stopovers. In fact the "supervisor" told me (before we either got disconnected or she hung up on me because she started to have trouble with her story) that "every time you fly somewhere it is a stopover". Then she said that LAX-AKL was a "stopover", when I said that was a flight and a coupon but not a stopover she agreed, before then accusing me of confusing coupons and stopovers!

Am I crazy?

Is there some actual *A agent who actually specializes and understands RTW bookings? Or some higher power? Or someone who can just explain how the "first point of arrival/last point of departure" sentance applies? How can they be reached?

Thanks,

Jeff

According to the rules, you're correct. Are you doing any of the legs on LH? I've had a great experience setting up my RTW with them. I spent 40 minutes with an agent (at the res number...everytime someone picks up in under one minute) putting together the itinerary. It was sent to the rate desk for validation and pricing. Two days later, I got word that it was valid, with the price I expected. However, we decided to go the other way around the world and had to start over.

I did have to refer to the rules as the agent claimed that a certain LH codeshare in Europe wasn't eligible. I pointed out the latest version of the rules (thanks to FT...here's the link to the NZ version), and showed that the flight number was eligible and not excluded. The agent agreed and booked it!

I don't mean to hijack the topic, but a question to the FT'ers. On the RTW fares, UA only allows booking in A for the first class fare. However, SEA>SFO doesn't offer A or D, so I get bumped to economy. They booked me in M, but the rules say I should be booked in Y. Does UA have a program to instantly or otherwise pay a nominal amount to move into First when booked on a full Y fare?

Jsmbythebay - keep referring to the rules. Ask the agent to pull them up and then go over them with the agent. In any event, if you're not getting satisfaction, ask to be bumped to someone higher on the food train.

Eric

Well that's true - but challenge her with the fact that you're not actually flying to CHC or to PER (using your theoretical as an example) so how can she say they are a stopover using her definition of "flying to somewhere" when you're not actually flying to that somewhere?! :)

I honestly don't know how to help you further as I can't believe you are getting the runaround on such a basic, simple rule interpretation that's been a part of the :-: RTW rules since year dot.
Both ends of the ground segment are categorically, without doubt, 100% one stopover under number of stopover rules, but all 4 cities are counted as a city stopover under city stopover rules.

There have been several post threads/posts with helpful links or email addresses to agents that have provided knowledgeable and superior service for RTW fares. Maybe a search for them will help find one that's in your neck of the woods?
Cheers.

Yeah, hard to believe. I mean, it's plain english. The "supervisor" actually said "It doesn't matter what the words say" and twice "I can't believe that you have a problem understanding this". At one point she conceded that LAX-AKL was a "flight" and not a stopover, but then when I said what was the difference between that and CHC-SYD and a PER departure she got very wishy washy and then we were "disconnected". It's now three agents (one NZ and two UA) who are actually trying to contend that somehow AKL and CHC count as a stopover each when the language clearly says the opposite.

Well, I did get a lead on another agent who I am going to try if this doesn't clear up tomorrow (I need a Canadian TA to make this work even though I am in the US). I feel badly that the current agent has put a decent amount of work into it, but she doesn't seem to be able to be able to get it done and I am running out of time. Not sure what the ethics are of this.

Also not sure what effect it would have that she's actually made reservations, but can't get it rated. Can I make another reservation with a different carrier desk? Will there be some issue with double booking? Not sure how that will work.

I had a double booking. Booked a partial RTW on SQ, then when I couldn't get my italian flights, I booked on LH (then going back to cancel on SQ).

If SEA-SFO is a 1 class flight (A and D both not offered) then yes should be booked in Y. If SEA-SFO is a 2 class flight but just happens to be out of availability in A then go to the booking class for the next cabin down, which is M.

Are you sure that the flight you are looking at does indeed not have A class or is it sold out?

I browsed through the *A timetable and could only find UA flights operated by 319, 320, 733, 735 or 752 within the next twelve months (as far as they are already loaded) and all of these aircraft have either a two class F/Y or three class F/C/Y configuration and would therefore also have A or D class.

I confirmed using the KVS took that on the SFO>SEA route, on July 19, all flights (with the exception of one flight, which offered F/C/Y on a 737..strange), offer F/Y/B/M but no A (and certainly no D). Therefore, since there is no A or D available, I should be booked in Y.

On our most recent RTW, I had to double-triple cross-reference looking for A bucket availability on UA. What I found very frequently was that the codeshare under the US number had A seats while the UA flight said none.

cheers,

Henry

Holy Trans-Pacific! You're right, using the KVS tool, filtering out all but the USAir Non-Stops SFO>SEA, there is A availability.

Henry, you're a genius (big non-sexual kiss on the cheek of thanks) :D

Eric