differences *A award availability with different *A FFPs?
 

I want 2 awards for ANZ flights between OZ and NZ, and can use either our UA MP miles or ANA ones for them. UA told me there was only 1 award seat available, while ANA said they could get me 2. That's the way it works, if one wants award seats on a given flight with carrier C, they may be able to get them with miles coming from their FFP account with carrier B, but with the carrier A one?

What about award rules, e.g., whether changes can be made after first leg traveled; stop overs; standby; etc? If one is going to be traveling on carrier C, does it ever matter whether the award is ticketed by carrier A vs carrier B? (There can be differences between an award ticket issued by A to travel on A and award ticket issued by B to travel on A.)

As I understand it, I am better off with UA and ANA miles than I would be with ANZ miles, since ANZ miles can only be used like UA "choices," that is 1 ANZ mile will be treated as 1 cent against price of an ANZ ticket. Am I right about that? (Value/use of ANZ miles is of little consequence to me, since I never expect to accrue any. If we pay to fly ANZ, as we may ZQN-CHC, we will take the miles as UA ones. I ask about this because I wonder if it is ever better to use carrier A miles for an award ticket with carrier B than to use carrier B miles for an award ticket on carrier B.)

Anything else to ask/say about awards when crossing over between *A carriers?

UA vs. ANA
 

hi,

one thing to note is that you can change the UA flight dates on an award without any penalties.

other FFPs like LH charge you 40 Euro per change of date etc.

in my eyes the free date change on UA award let them be more flexible than other awards. so if i book let say an award around christmas/newyears eve time, i will do so with UA miles, as sometimes the situation changes and i have to change the date of travel. with LH miles and ANA, i try to book on an shortnotice when i know there wont be any changes to my plan.

and yes unfortunately the award space is limited per carrier, i.e you might get an award with UA miles but not with ANA miles.

therefore collecting miles with different programs is essential for a flexible and sucessful mileage redemption!

dp

Thanks for pointing out this difference between *A carriers with respect to changing dates on award tickets. Just to be clear - you are talking about being able to change with/without fees one's dates before travel begins both when award is to be used on same carrier and when to be used on another *A carrier? (When "crossing over" from FFP on one to flying on another, never allowed to change dates/flights after start travel, right? Whereas advantage to same carrier FFP and travel is that you can make changes after starting, or at least you can with UA.)

Anything else when going from one carrier's FFP to another carrier's metal for award travel? For example, rules applicable to travel on ANZ (20K for AUS/NZ RT on nonstop flights between city pairs, 30K if must connect) are the same whether award issued by UA, ANA, or any other *A carrier to be used on ANZ?

the rules
 

depends on the carrier you have the miles with.
for example there are different stopover rules etc.

so each carrier have their own rules.

dp

You say it "depends on the carrier you have the miles with." Do you mean that you may do better/worse in terms of restrictions if you travel with C using an award ticket issued by A rather than B? Or it doesn't matter whether you are redeeming with A vs B (except perhaps where award inventory is concerned because one might have availability, the other not)? The rules for award travel on C will be the same whether one redeems their miles through A or through B?

I tried to ask ANZ about how they handle awards for their FFP members, but their "air points" and how they handle their own awards are very different from the way other *A carriers, e.g., UA and ANA, handle their own awards in return for redemption of miles. (ANZ air points seem to be somewhat comparable to UA "choices," with the amount of points required being a function of what the ticket would cost if purchased outright rather than a fixed number of miles for an award ticket, e.g., 25K miles for a saver domestic award ticket.

I gather that a difference we haven't talked about may be in the way fuel surcharges are handled with award tickets, some imposing those as a fee along with taxes, some just collecting the taxes on award tickets.

This thread appears to be leading to a discussion of the world, the universe and all the rest. :) However, the OP's main question was about differences in *A award availability with different *A FFPs.

The answer to this question is yes. It has been established that UA MP and US MP limit *A award availability on non-home carriers for their members, while (at least most of) the other *A FFPs don't.

Routing and rebooking rules and restrictions greatly differ from FFP to FFP and should be addressed in the respective FT forum, as that's where the experts are

No discussions of the world, the universe and all the rest contemplated. Just trying to nail down whether, and if so how, results might be different getting an award ticket on C using A's FFP vs B's FFP. (Inventory question has been answered, that they may differ in availability.)

well
 

it depends on the carrier you want to fly with.
for example if you are *Gold with thai, i can tell you that you will almost get every award on thai airways you want to book.

i know one program which allows waitlisting for awards, but awards waitlist normally only clear if you know how to pull the trigger.

some FFPs allow one ways like BMI, some earn more miles than others in C, so if you want to optimize you might give us the information where you are based, which airline is your home carrier, and which routes you are normally looking for awards.

as i am based in europe and asia, i am flying frequently between asia and europe on C & F awards. i found LH miles not bad for booking awards and i think that TG miles are for me the best bet, as i tend to punch in a stopover in BKK normally.

if the routing doesnt matter that all, * will bring you almost everywhere.
for example i was looking for europe- asia last time. LH did offer me one flight with OZ , LH, or TG via BKK . i took the BKK one, as i was able to go all the way in new C and i had a stopover in BKK getting a massage and having dinner with my friends and than leaving again with the 23pm flight.

dp

Except that there are no changes allowed whatsoever, at any price, after departure on Star Alliance awards.

before depature
 

yes, i assumed that everybody know that :).
anyway, after ticketing for example LH charges 40Euro which i find annoying for a date change.

for flexibility i think the UA miles a re very good.

one thing, with an LH award even after departure you can change the return date etc. but not the routing for 40euro. what do you mean that after departure changes are not allowed at any price. ?

dp

Yes, it's really that bad: absolutely no changes regarding date or route for UA star alliance awards after departure. If your plans change, you have to throw the ticket away.
BMI has the same rule, but as oneway awards are allowed for 50 %, booking two oneways instead of one return solves the problem (at the price of double cancellation fees).

Another possible difference occurs to me - I have award tickets on hold with ANA. My understanding is that once I ticket, the miles will be gone from my account and I don't think there is any opportunity to redeposit them if the tickets should go unused. If I pull miles out of my UA MP account, I can redeposit them if the tickets don't get used, and the $100 fee to redeposit is waived for 1Ks.

Anyway, all this helps me think about the relative advantages/disadvantages of accruing miles in different programs. My principle account is, and I expect will continue to be for the foreseeable future, UA. But I have been able to transfer a substantial number of miles to ANA from AmEx, which has helped with award ticket availability. Could make some use of a US account too. The opportunity to pull down OW rewards (1/2 of RT ones?) with BMI would be appealing, especially to get around that PIA *A business about not being able to change the return in any way once ticketed. (The OW rewards are only for miles coming out of a BMI FFP account? Are these OW rewards only good on BMI or can they be used on other *A carriers?)

Without the prospects of ever accruing miles with some carriers (e.g., Thai and SQ), their FFP rules for award travel, their own or with other *A carriers, don't much matter to me. To the extent I might be able to accrue or re-direct some miles to other carriers, it is worthwhile knowing what advantages/disadvantages the others might offer.

Award availability may be different on each FFP, especially for own metal but also other partner metal.

Award rules are definitely different on each FFP (so some may require most direct routing +/- % mileage while others are strict zone based and others only allow certain number of flights, etc).

Award costs are also different on each FFP.

As for NZ airpoints, I think you are misunderstanding slightly. The 1 airbuck (airpoint dollar) is good for 1 dollar fare only applies to awards solely on NZ metal. For partner awards (or awards that include a mixture of Air NZ + partners), the award cost is fixed. NZ also has some fixed cost awards on NZ metal (longhaul business class).

Thanks for the clarification about ANZ rules. The one we encountered was that it is 20K to fly AUS-NZ RT so long as the flights are all non-stops, no change of planes along the way. So when decided to go SYD-ZQN, which requires a change in CHC, rather than SYD-CHC, ours became 30K award tickets. I had never encountered that wrinkle before, and for this I don't think it mattered which *A FFP we were getting the awards through. (I will forego other questions about ANZ's own FFP because it is among the least likely for us to ever participate in.)

I'm not sure you understand yet. Unless you are using Air NZ Airpoints, the difference between a 20k and 30k cost is unrelated to Air NZ - rather it is the rules (and availability) of the FFP whose miles you are using.