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Baggage Allowance question: Two separate Star Alliance Ticket and two cabin classes

Baggage Allowance question: Two separate Star Alliance Ticket and two cabin classes

Old Sep 9, 20, 12:16 am
  #1  
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Originally Posted by stratidawn View Post
Hello Flyers.. I've got a tricky question here...

I booked two separate tickets: United Airline: SFO -> NRT (First Class Ticket); and within 40min of landing NRT, I will be boarding Shenzhen Airline's NRT --> SZX (Premium Economy)

Condition to be considered:
1. United Airline and Shenzhen Airline are both Star Alliance, I know that I will be able to checked all my luggage through final destination (SZX)
2. These two tickets are purchased separately, ie they are NOT under one itinerary/reservation code.

Here comes the tricky part:
1. SFO --> NRT is first class (longer flight, so UA is considered significant carrier throughout the trip), but NRT-->SZX is premium economy, when I check my bags at SFO, will I be able to check two 70lbs (32kg) luggages all the way through Shenzhen? The question here is that, would the NRT-SZX part of my trip limit my luggage allowance?
2. How does it work if I want to pre-purchase additional checked bags? UA charges $200/piece up to 70lbs per piece. If I do this, would this suffice for the 3rd checked bag to get to the final destination?

I read something about the IATA and the US DOT rules... But wanted to come here and ask you all expert Flyers here.

THANK YOU SO MUCH IN ADVANCE!
With separate tickets "significant carrier" does not apply. Each ticket, with its t&c's, stands on its own
UA will interline as link below. The cost of additional checked bags/weight is a big unknown. You may/may not get away with it
UA Bag Interlining If Separate Tix with *A Partners (YES) & Non *A Partners (NO)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shenzhen_Airlines

The chance of doing a 40 min transfer at the end of one flight and departure of another flight are close to nil.
Would UA sell SFO-NRT-SZX as 1 ticket?
The NRT-SZX flight will close X minutes before scheduled departure. You do not have 40 min.
NRT is a big airport. Just getting from the UA gate to the ZH gate to get boarding pass could take time. If UA is late by a few minutes you are doomed

UA will be looking for passport,visa,covid-19 requirements, visa, etc for Japan as that is where they are taking you. If UA would accept a ticket out of Japan (in a very short time) in lieu is a massive gamble. You may be denied boarding by UA.

Route ---> Great Circle Mapper
Time to start looking for new tickets
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Old Sep 9, 20, 12:34 am
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Wow, where to begin...

Since you have two completely different tickets, you neither have a connection nor any privileges across the bookings. UA may check your baggage through but may not, in which case you’d need to collect your luggage, and check in again for your next flight. Regardless of this, UA considers your trip to end in Japan, so you need to be able to enter Japan under the current circumstances. Have you checked that you are eligible to enter the country? I agree you will most likely be denied boarding in SFO unless you meet the requirements.

Aside from all of that, a 40 minute connection would have been pretty much impossible even in normal times, but now is completely out of the question. Even if you are allowed to board the UA flight, you’d likely forfeit the SZX flight. UA no longer has international first class, I believe you mean Polaris, which is a business class product.

Summary: depending on what passports you hold, you may wish to reconsider this whole trip, and at a minimum book it on one ticket or give yourself several hours in between.
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Last edited by LondonElite; Sep 9, 20 at 8:13 am
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Old Sep 9, 20, 8:34 am
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1. This is not a connection, but a transfer between two separate tickets.
2. Most significant carrier has not been used by any US carrier since 2011, so forget about it anyway.
3. No, UA will not check your bags through. The MCT for I-I at NRT is 1.00 and you are 20 minutes below that. While UA will check across separate *A tickets, it will only do so when MCT is met.
4. Thus, you will need to claim your bags at NRT, check them in with SH and so on. This entails being admissible to Japan. You will also have missed the bag check, check-in and gate deadlines for your onwards ticket.

In any event, UA would not even sell this as a connection, so it is an almost certainty that you can't make this work. Typically, I would allow at least 3x the MCT for separate tickets because you bear the risk of a delay on the inbound.
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Old Sep 9, 20, 11:05 am
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OP wrote they are boarding new flight 40 minutes of landing not new flight departing 40 minutes.

In any case I wouldn’t attempt this.
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Old Sep 9, 20, 11:53 am
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Originally Posted by seawolf View Post
OP wrote they are boarding new flight 40 minutes of landing not new flight departing 40 minutes.

In any case I wouldn’t attempt this.
Same thing?
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Old Sep 9, 20, 12:08 pm
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Originally Posted by seawolf View Post
OP wrote they are boarding new flight 40 minutes of landing not new flight departing 40 minutes.

In any case I wouldn’t attempt this.
Not sure I understand your concern.

I take 40 minutes of "landing" to mean 40 minutes of gate arrival, but if I am wrong and it is really "landing" then it is even less likely that OP will make his onwards flight.
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Old Sep 9, 20, 4:31 pm
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Originally Posted by Often1 View Post
Not sure I understand your concern.

I take 40 minutes of "landing" to mean 40 minutes of gate arrival, but if I am wrong and it is really "landing" then it is even less likely that OP will make his onwards flight.
It could mean whether the two flights can be sold as a connection.

If SZ flight typically (no idea if it does) boards 30 min prior to departure and “flight begins boarding 40 min after OP landing,” then the connection time is 70 min. If NRT MCT is 60 min as you indicated then OP should reconsider buying these flights as a connection.
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Old Sep 9, 20, 5:07 pm
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also, United does not have first class anymore.

i'm only aware of UA/JL/NH doing nonstop SFO-NRT, so OP could theoretically redeem United miles for NH First


still wouldn't do this. 40-70 self-connecting ticket is too tight
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Old Sep 9, 20, 8:12 pm
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Sorry guys... SFO-NRT lands 14:05 at NRT, and the NRT-SZX flight leaves 15:40...Sorry that caused such a debate... This is completely do-able since there's an hour and a half.
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Old Sep 9, 20, 8:17 pm
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Sorry guys... SFO-NRT lands 14:05 at NRT, and the NRT-SZX flight leaves 15:40

[QUOTE=Mwenenzi;32662149]With separate tickets "significant carrier" does not apply. Each ticket, with its t&c's, stands on its own
UA will interline as link below. The cost of additional checked bags/weight is a big unknown. You may/may not get away with it

The chance of doing a 40 min transfer at the end of one flight and departure of another flight are close to nil.
Would UA sell SFO-NRT-SZX as 1 ticket?
The NRT-SZX flight will close X minutes before scheduled departure. You do not have 40 min.
NRT is a big airport. Just getting from the UA gate to the ZH gate to get boarding pass could take time. If UA is late by a few minutes you are doomed

UA will be looking for passport,visa,covid-19 requirements, visa, etc for Japan as that is where they are taking you. If UA would accept a ticket out of Japan (in a very short time) in lieu is a massive gamble. You may be denied boarding by UA.

Originally Posted by LondonElite View Post
Wow, where to begin...

Since you have two completely different tickets, you neither have a connection nor any privileges across the bookings. UA may check your baggage through but may not, in which case you’d need to collect your luggage, and check in again for your next flight. Regardless of this, UA considers your trip to end in Japan, so you need to be able to enter Japan under the current circumstances. Have you checked that you are eligible to enter the country? I agree you will most likely be denied boarding in SFO unless you meet the requirements.

Aside from all of that, a 40 minute connection would have been pretty much impossible even in normal times, but now is completely out of the question. Even if you are allowed to board the UA flight, you’d likely forfeit the SZX flight. UA no longer has international first class, I believe you mean Polaris, which is a business class product.

Summary: depending on what passports you hold, you may wish to reconsider this whole trip, and at a minimum book it on one ticket or give yourself several hours in between.
Originally Posted by Often1 View Post
1. This is not a connection, but a transfer between two separate tickets.
2. Most significant carrier has not been used by any US carrier since 2011, so forget about it anyway.
3. No, UA will not check your bags through. The MCT for I-I at NRT is 1.00 and you are 20 minutes below that. While UA will check across separate *A tickets, it will only do so when MCT is met.
4. Thus, you will need to claim your bags at NRT, check them in with SH and so on. This entails being admissible to Japan. You will also have missed the bag check, check-in and gate deadlines for your onwards ticket.

In any event, UA would not even sell this as a connection, so it is an almost certainty that you can't make this work. Typically, I would allow at least 3x the MCT for separate tickets because you bear the risk of a delay on the inbound.
Originally Posted by seawolf View Post
OP wrote they are boarding new flight 40 minutes of landing not new flight departing 40 minutes.

In any case I wouldn’t attempt this.
Originally Posted by Often1 View Post
Not sure I understand your concern.

I take 40 minutes of "landing" to mean 40 minutes of gate arrival, but if I am wrong and it is really "landing" then it is even less likely that OP will make his onwards flight.
Originally Posted by seawolf View Post
It could mean whether the two flights can be sold as a connection.

If SZ flight typically (no idea if it does) boards 30 min prior to departure and “flight begins boarding 40 min after OP landing,” then the connection time is 70 min. If NRT MCT is 60 min as you indicated then OP should reconsider buying these flights as a connection.
Originally Posted by paperwastage View Post
also, United does not have first class anymore.

i'm only aware of UA/JL/NH doing nonstop SFO-NRT, so OP could theoretically redeem United miles for NH First


still wouldn't do this. 40-70 self-connecting ticket is too tight
Originally Posted by LondonElite View Post
Same thing?
Sorry guys... SFO-NRT lands 14:05 at NRT, and the NRT-SZX flight leaves 15:40...Sorry that caused such a debate... This is completely do-able since there's an hour and a half
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Old Sep 9, 20, 8:18 pm
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Sorry guys... SFO-NRT lands 14:05 at NRT, and the NRT-SZX flight leaves 15:40...Sorry that caused such a debate... This is completely do-able since there's an hour and a half
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Old Sep 10, 20, 12:26 am
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Originally Posted by stratidawn View Post
Sorry guys... SFO-NRT lands 14:05 at NRT, and the NRT-SZX flight leaves 15:40...Sorry that caused such a debate... This is completely do-able since there's an hour and a half.
You think?

What if you have to collect checked luggage? And in any case, are you permitted to enter Japan?
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Old Sep 10, 20, 6:18 am
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Yes, doable in the sense that it is within MCT if connecting. This is, however, not a connection. Thus, 100% of the risk of no show is on the passenger vs. the late delivering carrier. Meaning that OP if UA is late would have to purchase a new ticket and then deal with an immigration mess if the delay means an overnight.

But, back to OP's original question, if UA checks his bags through, it is a complete toss up as to whether SZ collects the additional bag charges at NRT. It is rare, but seems to occur with Chinese carriers. As it is on separate tickets, neither US DOT nor IATA MSC rules apply to the onwards ticket and OP's allowance for the onwards flight is whatever SZ provides. Thus, if all of this works, he will need to be prepared to pay.
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Old Sep 10, 20, 10:39 am
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Originally Posted by stratidawn View Post
Sorry guys... SFO-NRT lands 14:05 at NRT, and the NRT-SZX flight leaves 15:40...Sorry that caused such a debate... This is completely do-able since there's an hour and a half
Still don't know if you are flying UA or NH

Assuming UA837

https://www.flightstats.com/v2/fligh...ing/UA/837/SFO

Of course these are historical numbers, which may not be valid now
Avg delay 11 min, max delay 61(which means you'll miss your next flight)


​​​​Its certainly doable if everything goes right ... Until it doesnt

MCT apply for true connecting tickets. OP doesn't hold that (UA may accept checked bags at SFO if they meet MCT, but OP still incurs the risks of delays and losing 2nd ticket because 1st flight is delayed)

Reconsider your plan
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Last edited by paperwastage; Sep 10, 20 at 10:48 am
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Old Sep 10, 20, 12:23 pm
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Originally Posted by Often1 View Post
Yes, doable in the sense that it is within MCT if connecting. This is, however, not a connection. Thus, 100% of the risk of no show is on the passenger vs. the late delivering carrier. Meaning that OP if UA is late would have to purchase a new ticket and then deal with an immigration mess if the delay means an overnight.

But, back to OP's original question, if UA checks his bags through, it is a complete toss up as to whether SZ collects the additional bag charges at NRT. It is rare, but seems to occur with Chinese carriers. As it is on separate tickets, neither US DOT nor IATA MSC rules apply to the onwards ticket and OP's allowance for the onwards flight is whatever SZ provides. Thus, if all of this works, he will need to be prepared to pay.
Thanks!!! I confirmed with SZ airline again today and finally got an answer. They said UA can check the luggages through final destination but they do audit at NRT whether the luggages are within allowance. So, for safe bet, I should either 1) check in two 23kg bags at SFO or 2) upgrade SZ's ticket to match UA's flight so I can carry two 32kg bags. As for the 3rd prepay luggage, I was suggested that I can ask at the United check desk at the airport, whether United would collect the fee for SZ airline or not, if yes, then I can just show the receipt to SZ in NRT's boarding gate. If not, then there will be staff contacting me at NRT's boarding and I can pay the extra luggage fee there.

I will report back in a month once I finish the trip. Thank you all for your help!!
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