catsfroggy1

I live on the east coast so it is going to take me a lot longer than 5 hours to get to Hawaii. I don't want to make my food at home for a flight. I do know I can buy food at concessions my point is I don't want to have to.

seigex

Max range on a 787 Max 8 is 4045mi, LGA to HNL is 4965mi, FLL to HNL is 4855mi, you won't be flying direct from the east coast to HNL on WN. Guess it means you will have a chance to grab food before your final legal.

jiburi

So, is it Hawaii that will change Southwest's Red Eye Flight culture? For people from East Coast, you would have to fly red-eye or overnight at a city for their return to East Coast from Hawaii. Currently Southwest have no transcon red-eyes.

As for logistics, I don't believe Southwest has Rafts, flotation seats, nor refrigeration or oven on any of its aircrafts (except ice)...... In order to serve fresh or cooked food, refrigeration or oven is needed.....

and probably need more lavatory than two....

Jiburi

rsteinmetz70112

There was a technology issue which is supposed to be fixed. I also believe there were some provisions in the pilots contract as well. Those were hopefully fixed in the last extension.

At least some aircraft are equipped for over water operation and new aircraft are being added every month.

sdsearch

Yes, don't they need to fly over water to some of their new international destinations?

If so, I presume they had to start equipping for over water operation once they started some over water international routes.

But don't planes need to be equipped for over-water even just flying MSY to FLL (unless they go the very long way around always over land)?

fiuchris

Some of the used -700s that were acquired have rafts installed, and some of the new build -800s came factory certified ETOPS (the N83xx birds), which includes rafts. In addition, every single plane in the fleet has life vests under the seats. It's always interesting to see who is paying attention to the safety demo

rsteinmetz70112

Some of the 700s acquired from Airtran were also ETOPS equipped.

rsteinmetz70112

They do not need ETOPS equipment for that flight, its always close enough to an airport.
ETOPS = "Extended-range Twin-engine Operational Performance Standards".

formeraa

Nope, as long as you are within a certain amount of time (IIRC 60-90 mins) of the coast.

garykung

FWIW - Boeing has a special B738 edition designed for short field airport (B737-800 SFP).

Hawaii is a different market. You can't really blame analysts have doubts.

Yes. Hawaiian baggage are subject to additional agriculture inspection, but not customs.

What if the aircraft turns mechanical during the inter-island runs?

That's why at the beginning, the pricing will be similar to those mainline.

Red-eyes flights are crucial to the operations of any airlines ex-Hawaii.

So it is a matter of when WN to get its first.

ryw

Playing devil's advocate, I think it's possible that Southwest could start serving Hawaii without red eyes (and not serving the east coast at launch). We've already had several threads about being unable to book flights from the west coast to Costa Rica (unless you book separate PNRs and do an overnight), so it's not without precedent to serve new locations that aren't reachable from parts of the network.

Current morning flights from HNL (on Hawaiian and United, leaving around 7 and 8am) arrive at LAX around 2:30 and 3:30pm. Within current WN schedules, that's plenty of time to make connections as far east as the midwest on the same day. Though the early departure out of HNL would likely mean that Southwest would have to fly the west coast to HNL route in the afternoon and overnight the plane in HNL instead of the quick turnarounds they seem to do in lots of outstations.

garykung

WN does not and will not pay for the hotel. If the fare does not absorb the extra expenses, the route is destined for cancellation.

writerguyfl

I don't believe that's entirely true. Although most airlines require red-eye flights in this scenario, Southwest could conceivably still get passengers back to the some East Coast cities using daytime flights.

Example:
HNL-LAS: 7am departure, 2:35pm arrival (flight time based on Hawaiian's current nonstop)

Possible Connections to Existing Nonstop Flights:
LAS-BWI: 3:30pm departure, 11:00pm arrival
LAS-TPA: 4:10pm departure, 11:20pm arrival
LAS-PHL: 4:40pm departure, 12:10am arrival
LAS-FLL: 4:45pm departure, 12:20am arrival
LAS-MCO: 5:10pm departure, 12:35am arrival
LAS-PIT: 5:45pm departure, 12:45am arrival
LAS-RDU: 5:45pm departure, 1:00am arrival

Southwest could even send the HNL-LAS plane back to a Hawaiian airport on the same day. Their planes sit empty at some airport over night. Why not have it sit idle in Hawaii?

Please note: I'm just playing Devil's Advocate here. I do think that adding red-eye flights would be a wise business decision. That change would only increase the number of potential passengers.

irishguy28

of course they can; Norwegian has used 737-800s across the Atlantic, which is a longer overseas trek than to Hawaii.

3Cforme

North Atlantic tracks commonly take aircraft no further than 60 minutes flight time from diversion points like Dublin, Reykjavik, southern Greenland, and Gander or Goose Bay. Continental U.S. to Hawaii requires 180-minute ETOPS.

http://aerosavvy.com/etops/