Official Peanut Gallery Thread
May 19, 2020, 10:20 am
#1336
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: STL
Programs: Southwest A+/CP, Hilton Diamond, National Executive Elite
Posts: 170
Oh wow, I do get my coronavirus information from the CDC, Mayo Clinic, and WHO before it gets dramatized by the media. Straight from the source. I suggest you try it. While you are at it, please find a scientific controlled real-life study that proves mask wearing by asymptomatic people in a casual setting actually stops more people from getting sick than % increases caused by 1) Touching ones face all the time playing with their mask. 2) A false sense of security that one gets wearing a mask causing more interactions because they"feel safe" even though masks are largely ineffective for the user. I will be waiting eagerly for your answer.
Either way, until places like Disney open without masks...I frankly would rather be at home and not traveling (maybe my opinion would change if I got Lasik and got rid of my glasses). By all means wear one if it makes you "feel safe", it is your face and your body. However, making you "feel safe" while it makes me actually more unsafe is not very fair or smart in my book.
Either way, until places like Disney open without masks...I frankly would rather be at home and not traveling (maybe my opinion would change if I got Lasik and got rid of my glasses). By all means wear one if it makes you "feel safe", it is your face and your body. However, making you "feel safe" while it makes me actually more unsafe is not very fair or smart in my book.
May 19, 2020, 11:02 am
#1337
Moderator: Southwest Airlines, Capital One
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: California
Programs: WN Companion Pass, A-list preferred, Hyatt Globalist; United Club Lietime (sic) Member
Posts: 21,622
How about a masks-optional section aft of row 19, with mask required in the first 19 rows?
May 19, 2020, 5:12 pm
#1340
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Chicagoland, IL, USA
Programs: WN CP, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 14,189
It’s so cute how some of you guys believe the stuff that the CDC and WHO tell you. Even when it’s the opposite of what they said a few weeks ago.
And the epidemiologists like that “2,000,000 dead, whoops 20,000” fellow with the mistress.
And the epidemiologists like that “2,000,000 dead, whoops 20,000” fellow with the mistress.
May 19, 2020, 7:27 pm
#1341
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: PIT, BWI, or IPT
Programs: Dividend Miles, WorldPerks
Posts: 1,302
Seriously? A business can force me to be more unsafe, to make you "feel" safe? The logic is fascinating.
May 19, 2020, 9:21 pm
#1342
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: RNO
Programs: AA/DL/UA
Posts: 10,775
May 20, 2020, 6:27 pm
#1343
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: VPS
Programs: IHG Diamond, Delta PM, Hilton Gold, Accor Gold, Marriott Silver
Posts: 7,265
May 25, 2020, 8:23 pm
#1344
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Sarasota, FL (SRQ)
Programs: WN A-List, AA EXP, Hyatt Top Tier (definitely NOT a Globalist), National Exec Elite
Posts: 491
Hopefully the inflight mask requirement is gone by midsummer along with the breathless and reckless media hype.
May 26, 2020, 1:42 am
#1345
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Window Seat
Programs: National Executive, HHonors Gold, IHG Platinum, Hyatt Visitor
Posts: 2,495
thanks Karen
here in south Florida we have to wear masks until we sit down at a table at a restaurant and then out the mask back on to leave our tables. If we can do that then I think we can take our masks off for a few minutes in flight to eat/drink. That or somehow Coronavirus knows I’m eating on a plane and will contaminate me then but not in a restaurant.
here in south Florida we have to wear masks until we sit down at a table at a restaurant and then out the mask back on to leave our tables. If we can do that then I think we can take our masks off for a few minutes in flight to eat/drink. That or somehow Coronavirus knows I’m eating on a plane and will contaminate me then but not in a restaurant.
Or maybe it really is to protect you.
Who knows.
May 26, 2020, 1:46 am
#1346
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Window Seat
Programs: National Executive, HHonors Gold, IHG Platinum, Hyatt Visitor
Posts: 2,495
I was in two CA Counties over the weekend with mandated face masks required in ALL public places. Various businesses open with NO MASK NO SERVICE signs. Compliance was 100% and nobody seemed to be complaining or having any issues with the rule. I was very surprised. I complied and I don't think anyone heard me quietly making Baa noises through my mask. Also found a drug store selling 10pk masks for 8.99. Before this mess, you could get 10 masks like that at Dollar Tree or 99 Cents Only for $1. Someone is making a ton of money on selling masks and it seems the media has their back and is pushing these requirements.
I too will be happy when all of these mask requirements go away. However personally in an airplane I would feel safer wearing a mask (probably not in the airport though). Not really into it in a retail store I am in and out of in 10 minutes.
So again this is the issue here: to consume food/drink you have to take the mask on and off. That compromises you, compromises the mask. If you are going to eat or drink why bother to wear the mask at all.
May 27, 2020, 10:15 am
#1347
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: SNA
Programs: Bonvoy LTTE/AMB, AmEx Plat, National EE, WN A-List, CLEAR+, Covid-19
Posts: 4,964
(Cross-posted from the "Snacks Return" thread)
Actually the "shocking ignorance" is coming from grief pimps who continue to foist the lie that CV is an automatic death sentence for most people.
From the State of California Covid-19 Dashboard
CA Deaths
Death Stats by age
to date there have been 3,814 deaths (mind you, CA has 39 MILLION, 937,000 people in it).
Of that number:
0% have been < 18
6% (229) have been 18-49
15% (572) have been 50-64
So out of nearly ~40M people, ~801 people 18-64 have died of CV. While all deaths are unfortunate, 79% of the dead are 65 and older.
I couldn't find 2019 traffic fatalities, but in 2018 CA had 3,563 traffic deaths, or about 9.76 deaths/day. The CV stats on the site above started on 3/16, or 75 days ago, and using the 2018 stats that works out to an average of 732 deaths.
IOW, if you're 18-64 in the State of California, you're almost as likely to die from a car accident as you are from CV.
Quarantine the vulnerable. Leave the rest of us alone. Stop spreading fear.
From the State of California Covid-19 Dashboard
CA Deaths
Death Stats by age
to date there have been 3,814 deaths (mind you, CA has 39 MILLION, 937,000 people in it).
Of that number:
0% have been < 18
6% (229) have been 18-49
15% (572) have been 50-64
So out of nearly ~40M people, ~801 people 18-64 have died of CV. While all deaths are unfortunate, 79% of the dead are 65 and older.
I couldn't find 2019 traffic fatalities, but in 2018 CA had 3,563 traffic deaths, or about 9.76 deaths/day. The CV stats on the site above started on 3/16, or 75 days ago, and using the 2018 stats that works out to an average of 732 deaths.
IOW, if you're 18-64 in the State of California, you're almost as likely to die from a car accident as you are from CV.
Quarantine the vulnerable. Leave the rest of us alone. Stop spreading fear.
May 29, 2020, 2:56 pm
#1348
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 6,286
Here's a post from a doctor friend. It's very long, but very well researched and cross-referenced. Believe whatever you'd like about mask use, but I'm basing my beliefs on factual evidence. And I'll be wearing a mask whenever I'm in close proximity to others for the time being.
There has been plenty of debate about wearing masks to help prevent the spread of coronavirus. And with good reason. At the start of this pandemic, we didn’t really have much scientific evidence. And what little evidence we had involved other diseases, like the flu, which can’t be applied to the COVID-19 virus, SARS-CoV-2 or Coronavirus.When this all got really bad, I was in Peru, desperately trying to get home the day before that country shut its airports. I was traveling with a handful of other doctors, and none of us wore masks. We were sure that anything other than an N95 was pointless.
But I was wrong. We were wrong. The WHO is STILL thinking wrong. Because we were thinking backward. We were thinking of how to avoid getting it. But we should have been thinking about how to avoid spreading it.
Because yes, if an infected person coughs in your face, you are likely to get infected unless wearing an N95 and face shield. But a simple cloth face mask turns out to be remarkably effective at keeping someone’s germs to themselves, especially during the presymptomatic phase of the disease.
I’m not here to force you to wear a mask, or to call you stupid for not wearing one. I’m just here to show you the evidence that changed my mind. I hope you come to the same conclusion as I did: We don’t have to choose between killing the economy or killing people. With simple face masks in addition to hand washing we can eliminate the virus, reopen the economy, and save thousands of lives all at the same time.
THE TRUTH ABOUT MASKS
The truth is that coronavirus is largely spread by respiratory droplets. And homemade masks can block the majority of those droplets. “Healthy” people infect just as many people as sick ones. And places like Austria saw a 90% drop in COVID infection within two weeks of mandating masks. So all of us should be wearing masks. But please don’t take my word for it. I’ve been wrong before, I’ll be wrong again. Instead, look at all the evidence below.
CLOTH MASKS BLOCK THE PRIMARY MODE OF CORONAVIRUS TRANSMISSION
First of all, we needed to realize exactly how coronavirus spreads. This is primarily through respiratory droplets which are about 5-10 microns in diameter. Studies tracing the outbreaks in China show that the transmission mode was primarily through these larger droplets. https://www.who.int/…/modes-of-transmission-of-virus-causin…
Still we can’t rule out transmission through aerosols (droplets smaller than 5 microns). But, fortunately cloth masks can block both droplets and aerosols.
A study from Wake Forest (in publication) shows that home-made masks can block almost all droplets, including aerosols. The better the material, the more droplets they block. The best masks are made with two layers of batik quilting fabric, or else cotton backed with flannel. These block even more droplets than a standard surgical mask, like the one I’m wearing in the photo on this post. https://newsroom.wakehealth.edu/…/Testing-Shows-Type-of-Clo…
Other studies have shown that unfitted surgical masks can drastically reduce the spread of the seasonal human coronavirus, a much less virulent cousin that causes mild colds. This study shows that even if aerosols and droplets emerge through the mask, they seem to have been filtered of all coronavirus RNA. https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-020-0843-2#Tab1
The following video demonstrates the effect on a scale we can see. These droplets are bigger than the ones we’ve talked about so far. I use it only to help visualize what the other studies show on the microscopic scale.
https://m.youtube.com/watch…
And its important to remember, that you have to inhale a certain number of live viruses to actually catch the disease. That exact number isn’t known for COVID. But 1000 is the best guess of virologists. You may think “who cares if the mask blocks most virus? All it takes is one and I get sick.” But that’s not correct.
https://www.sciencemediacentre.org/expert-reaction-to-ques…/
Blocking most of the virus droplets means the people around you are unlikely to inhale enough to get infected. This is also why being outside is safer than in an enclosed area; the wind spreads your droplets around and people nearby are less likely to get hit with enough live virus to cause an infection https://www.vox.com/…/coronavirus-runners-cyclists-airborne…
WHY HEALTHY PEOPLE SHOULD WEAR A MASK
This is a frequent topic of debate. Why should healthy people be made to wear a mask? Well there is one major problem: up to half of those infected with COVID don’t know it, but can still spread it. So you can’t really know whether you are truly healthy. It’s an assumption of health, and it’s often incorrect.
In fact numerous studies have found that roughly half of COVID infections are transmitted between people before they know they are sick. (These are in process but so is the pandemic.) https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-020-0869-5
https://www.medrxiv.org/conte…/10.1101/2020.03.05.20031815v1
This asymptomatic transmission is what accounts for people developing infections after lockdowns and quarantines are instituted.
https://www.medrxiv.org/conte…/10.1101/2020.04.17.20053157v1
MASKS WILL STOP THE SPREAD OF THE VIRUS
Using all of these numbers, new models predict a vast drop in COVID cases with the universal use of face masks. (I know models have been wildly inaccurate, but stick with me just a bit more.) Some actually show it to be far more effective than the economic shutdown we have been going through. In fact they give us hope that with only 70% of the population wearing masks we could extinguish this disease before a vaccine is ever developed. That’s something we can all be happy about.
https://arxiv.org/abs/2003.07353
https://news.cgtn.com/…/AI-modeling-shows-mask-e…/index.html
https://www.medrxiv.org/…/05/15/2020.05.09.20096644.full.pdf
BUT DOES IT WORK IN REAL LIFE?
Like I said, the last few months have been full of models and predictions whipsawing from one extreme to another. And there are valid concerns that average people don’t know how to use masks or that masks might give us too much confidence, leading to unsafe behavior. But we can look to real-life examples to provide evidence of the effectiveness of masks. And that shows us that masks can be incredibly effective.
Let’s talk about Japan (we’ve had 10 times their number of cases despite only being 2.5 times as large.) They’ve had no lockdown and closed no stores, but everyone wears masks. And they’ve had days with no new cases reported. But there could certainly be other reasons for their low case levels, such as total testing and differences in reporting. Besides, you could argue that their culture is used to wearing masks and would use them more effectively.
So instead let's look at Austria, a country with no previous culture of face mask wearing. They made masks mandatory in public starting April 6. Two weeks later, infections had dropped by 90%. https://www.sciencetimes.com/…/austria-90-drop-coronavirus-…
Let’s look at the Czech Republic. They required facemasks in mid March. Within three days, the people produced enough masks at home for every man, woman and child, all 10 million. Coupled with their social distancing, this has kept the total cases in Czech Republic to one of the lowest in Europe, with only 50 deaths. https://www.usatoday.com/…/czech-government-imp…/2940393001/
Similarly, Slovakia, the second country in Europe to implement facemask use has had some of the lowest cases and deaths in Europe. https://www.euractiv.com/…/facemasks-against-covid-19-why-…/
And finally let's look to America. What happens when a hot zone institutes face mask policies? Well Brigham and Women’s Hospital in Boston instituted universal masking of patients and staff, the rate of staff COVID infections dropped by 50%. https://www.wbur.org/…/…/brigham-and-womens-masks-infections
Other than that, it’s hard to say. Our testing rates are low, case reporting and compiling vary significantly from state to state, and most states only require employees to wear masks when in contact with customers. We really don’t have reliable data from which to draw conclusions.
WHY NOT JUST MASK THOSE AT HIGH RISK?
While this seems like a reasonable and simpler solution at first, it is logistically impossible. Most elderly people here live in multigenerational homes and can't afford to live on their own. Even if they stay home, their families will bring COVID home to roost.
And if we were to round them all up and put them in some sort of protective housing, well that too would be an enormous violation of civil rights. Plus putting many high risk individuals together just means that when a care worker at this facility eventually infects somebody, we will have just set up a slaughterhouse and made the disease that much more likely to kill them all.
Plus you have the final piece in this puzzle. Unfortunately it's another one that puts egg on the face of the medical community and our assumptions. It turns out that wearing an N95 mask is maybe not the best way to keep yourself from getting sick. Having the infected person wear the mask is. In a study published (and largely overlooked) in 2013 in the Journal of Aerosol Medicine and Pulmonary Drug Delivery, it was shown that even a simple surgical mask on a source of aerosol was better at preventing exposure than an N95 on the “healthy subject.” https://www.liebertpub.com/doi/10.1089/jamp.2012.0998
This is why the motto in Czech Republic is “My mask protects you, your mask protects me.”
WHY WE SHOULD ALL BE WEARING MASKS
Putting it all together, we should definitely all be wearing masks as much as possible in public. Especially situations with high risk of transmission (office buildings, restaurants, parties, bars, nightclubs, public transit, gyms, and religious services). For more info on that, please read this incredibly informative article by Dr. Erin Bromage at Dartmouth https://www.erinbromage.com/…/the-risks-know-them-avoid-them
I’ll be the first to admit that the medical profession is playing catch up here. And the inconsistent, conflicting messages have been very confusing. Hell, I’m contradicting the WHO! But I think the evidence is solid. And so do others:
Face Masks Against COVID-19: An Evidence Based Review https://www.preprints.org/manuscript/202004.0203/v1
CAN’T WE JUST GET IT OVER WITH?
I know I sometimes think “I’d rather just catch this virus, get it over with and get back to normal life.” I’m sure many of you do too. Some think that risking infection is their duty to return the country to normal. But that’s letting the virus win.
Patriots make sacrifices, sure. But not senseless ones. And risking infection is an unnecessary sacrifice because wearing a mask, washing your hands, and keeping 6 feet away is the only sacrifice you have to make. (Well, that and getting your brain tickled by the COVID nasal swab if you have symptoms.)
I hope you come to the same conclusion I did. I hope we can all agree to make these accommodations. For so long, it has seemed like we would have to choose between our people and our economy. But with this new information, for the first time in a long time, I’m hopeful we can save both.
Stay safe my friends
But I was wrong. We were wrong. The WHO is STILL thinking wrong. Because we were thinking backward. We were thinking of how to avoid getting it. But we should have been thinking about how to avoid spreading it.
Because yes, if an infected person coughs in your face, you are likely to get infected unless wearing an N95 and face shield. But a simple cloth face mask turns out to be remarkably effective at keeping someone’s germs to themselves, especially during the presymptomatic phase of the disease.
I’m not here to force you to wear a mask, or to call you stupid for not wearing one. I’m just here to show you the evidence that changed my mind. I hope you come to the same conclusion as I did: We don’t have to choose between killing the economy or killing people. With simple face masks in addition to hand washing we can eliminate the virus, reopen the economy, and save thousands of lives all at the same time.
THE TRUTH ABOUT MASKS
The truth is that coronavirus is largely spread by respiratory droplets. And homemade masks can block the majority of those droplets. “Healthy” people infect just as many people as sick ones. And places like Austria saw a 90% drop in COVID infection within two weeks of mandating masks. So all of us should be wearing masks. But please don’t take my word for it. I’ve been wrong before, I’ll be wrong again. Instead, look at all the evidence below.
CLOTH MASKS BLOCK THE PRIMARY MODE OF CORONAVIRUS TRANSMISSION
First of all, we needed to realize exactly how coronavirus spreads. This is primarily through respiratory droplets which are about 5-10 microns in diameter. Studies tracing the outbreaks in China show that the transmission mode was primarily through these larger droplets. https://www.who.int/…/modes-of-transmission-of-virus-causin…
Still we can’t rule out transmission through aerosols (droplets smaller than 5 microns). But, fortunately cloth masks can block both droplets and aerosols.
A study from Wake Forest (in publication) shows that home-made masks can block almost all droplets, including aerosols. The better the material, the more droplets they block. The best masks are made with two layers of batik quilting fabric, or else cotton backed with flannel. These block even more droplets than a standard surgical mask, like the one I’m wearing in the photo on this post. https://newsroom.wakehealth.edu/…/Testing-Shows-Type-of-Clo…
Other studies have shown that unfitted surgical masks can drastically reduce the spread of the seasonal human coronavirus, a much less virulent cousin that causes mild colds. This study shows that even if aerosols and droplets emerge through the mask, they seem to have been filtered of all coronavirus RNA. https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-020-0843-2#Tab1
The following video demonstrates the effect on a scale we can see. These droplets are bigger than the ones we’ve talked about so far. I use it only to help visualize what the other studies show on the microscopic scale.
https://m.youtube.com/watch…
And its important to remember, that you have to inhale a certain number of live viruses to actually catch the disease. That exact number isn’t known for COVID. But 1000 is the best guess of virologists. You may think “who cares if the mask blocks most virus? All it takes is one and I get sick.” But that’s not correct.
https://www.sciencemediacentre.org/expert-reaction-to-ques…/
Blocking most of the virus droplets means the people around you are unlikely to inhale enough to get infected. This is also why being outside is safer than in an enclosed area; the wind spreads your droplets around and people nearby are less likely to get hit with enough live virus to cause an infection https://www.vox.com/…/coronavirus-runners-cyclists-airborne…
WHY HEALTHY PEOPLE SHOULD WEAR A MASK
This is a frequent topic of debate. Why should healthy people be made to wear a mask? Well there is one major problem: up to half of those infected with COVID don’t know it, but can still spread it. So you can’t really know whether you are truly healthy. It’s an assumption of health, and it’s often incorrect.
In fact numerous studies have found that roughly half of COVID infections are transmitted between people before they know they are sick. (These are in process but so is the pandemic.) https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-020-0869-5
https://www.medrxiv.org/conte…/10.1101/2020.03.05.20031815v1
This asymptomatic transmission is what accounts for people developing infections after lockdowns and quarantines are instituted.
https://www.medrxiv.org/conte…/10.1101/2020.04.17.20053157v1
MASKS WILL STOP THE SPREAD OF THE VIRUS
Using all of these numbers, new models predict a vast drop in COVID cases with the universal use of face masks. (I know models have been wildly inaccurate, but stick with me just a bit more.) Some actually show it to be far more effective than the economic shutdown we have been going through. In fact they give us hope that with only 70% of the population wearing masks we could extinguish this disease before a vaccine is ever developed. That’s something we can all be happy about.
https://arxiv.org/abs/2003.07353
https://news.cgtn.com/…/AI-modeling-shows-mask-e…/index.html
https://www.medrxiv.org/…/05/15/2020.05.09.20096644.full.pdf
BUT DOES IT WORK IN REAL LIFE?
Like I said, the last few months have been full of models and predictions whipsawing from one extreme to another. And there are valid concerns that average people don’t know how to use masks or that masks might give us too much confidence, leading to unsafe behavior. But we can look to real-life examples to provide evidence of the effectiveness of masks. And that shows us that masks can be incredibly effective.
Let’s talk about Japan (we’ve had 10 times their number of cases despite only being 2.5 times as large.) They’ve had no lockdown and closed no stores, but everyone wears masks. And they’ve had days with no new cases reported. But there could certainly be other reasons for their low case levels, such as total testing and differences in reporting. Besides, you could argue that their culture is used to wearing masks and would use them more effectively.
So instead let's look at Austria, a country with no previous culture of face mask wearing. They made masks mandatory in public starting April 6. Two weeks later, infections had dropped by 90%. https://www.sciencetimes.com/…/austria-90-drop-coronavirus-…
Let’s look at the Czech Republic. They required facemasks in mid March. Within three days, the people produced enough masks at home for every man, woman and child, all 10 million. Coupled with their social distancing, this has kept the total cases in Czech Republic to one of the lowest in Europe, with only 50 deaths. https://www.usatoday.com/…/czech-government-imp…/2940393001/
Similarly, Slovakia, the second country in Europe to implement facemask use has had some of the lowest cases and deaths in Europe. https://www.euractiv.com/…/facemasks-against-covid-19-why-…/
And finally let's look to America. What happens when a hot zone institutes face mask policies? Well Brigham and Women’s Hospital in Boston instituted universal masking of patients and staff, the rate of staff COVID infections dropped by 50%. https://www.wbur.org/…/…/brigham-and-womens-masks-infections
Other than that, it’s hard to say. Our testing rates are low, case reporting and compiling vary significantly from state to state, and most states only require employees to wear masks when in contact with customers. We really don’t have reliable data from which to draw conclusions.
WHY NOT JUST MASK THOSE AT HIGH RISK?
While this seems like a reasonable and simpler solution at first, it is logistically impossible. Most elderly people here live in multigenerational homes and can't afford to live on their own. Even if they stay home, their families will bring COVID home to roost.
And if we were to round them all up and put them in some sort of protective housing, well that too would be an enormous violation of civil rights. Plus putting many high risk individuals together just means that when a care worker at this facility eventually infects somebody, we will have just set up a slaughterhouse and made the disease that much more likely to kill them all.
Plus you have the final piece in this puzzle. Unfortunately it's another one that puts egg on the face of the medical community and our assumptions. It turns out that wearing an N95 mask is maybe not the best way to keep yourself from getting sick. Having the infected person wear the mask is. In a study published (and largely overlooked) in 2013 in the Journal of Aerosol Medicine and Pulmonary Drug Delivery, it was shown that even a simple surgical mask on a source of aerosol was better at preventing exposure than an N95 on the “healthy subject.” https://www.liebertpub.com/doi/10.1089/jamp.2012.0998
This is why the motto in Czech Republic is “My mask protects you, your mask protects me.”
WHY WE SHOULD ALL BE WEARING MASKS
Putting it all together, we should definitely all be wearing masks as much as possible in public. Especially situations with high risk of transmission (office buildings, restaurants, parties, bars, nightclubs, public transit, gyms, and religious services). For more info on that, please read this incredibly informative article by Dr. Erin Bromage at Dartmouth https://www.erinbromage.com/…/the-risks-know-them-avoid-them
I’ll be the first to admit that the medical profession is playing catch up here. And the inconsistent, conflicting messages have been very confusing. Hell, I’m contradicting the WHO! But I think the evidence is solid. And so do others:
Face Masks Against COVID-19: An Evidence Based Review https://www.preprints.org/manuscript/202004.0203/v1
CAN’T WE JUST GET IT OVER WITH?
I know I sometimes think “I’d rather just catch this virus, get it over with and get back to normal life.” I’m sure many of you do too. Some think that risking infection is their duty to return the country to normal. But that’s letting the virus win.
Patriots make sacrifices, sure. But not senseless ones. And risking infection is an unnecessary sacrifice because wearing a mask, washing your hands, and keeping 6 feet away is the only sacrifice you have to make. (Well, that and getting your brain tickled by the COVID nasal swab if you have symptoms.)
I hope you come to the same conclusion I did. I hope we can all agree to make these accommodations. For so long, it has seemed like we would have to choose between our people and our economy. But with this new information, for the first time in a long time, I’m hopeful we can save both.
Stay safe my friends
May 29, 2020, 5:58 pm
#1349
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: SNA
Programs: Bonvoy LTTE/AMB, AmEx Plat, National EE, WN A-List, CLEAR+, Covid-19
Posts: 4,964
So am I, so I won't be wearing a mask a picosecond longer than compelled to nor any other guidelines, as the math and reality doesn't bear out the fear Medical Professionals are still trying to push on the population. That wall of text is still trying to spread fear about getting infected like it's some death sentence when it's obvious by the numbers that it's just not a factor for younger, healthier people (and most folks are asymptomatic anyway).
The public is starting to realize that Public Heath officials have their heads up their rears, don't appear to care about the huge amount of economic damage they're causing as they shut everything down, and are putting millions of working-age people in unemployment to save a small minority of victims, most of whom weren't in the workplace anyway. Thankfully though, people are starting to clue-up and push back against all these measures. Among the many articles about house-arrest-easing communities:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/natio...-reopen-evers/
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/26/u...ronavirus.html
https://www.10news.com/news/coronavi...ers-police-say
https://www.kron4.com/news/bay-area/...arting-june-1/
People are over all these house-arrests, closed businesses and lost jobs and all this distancing and masks and ignore it when given the chance. Of course, in every article there's someCassan fear-monger trying to stay relevant preaching death.
Quarantine the vulnerable. Leave the rest of us alone. Stop spreading fear.
The public is starting to realize that Public Heath officials have their heads up their rears, don't appear to care about the huge amount of economic damage they're causing as they shut everything down, and are putting millions of working-age people in unemployment to save a small minority of victims, most of whom weren't in the workplace anyway. Thankfully though, people are starting to clue-up and push back against all these measures. Among the many articles about house-arrest-easing communities:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/natio...-reopen-evers/
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/26/u...ronavirus.html
https://www.10news.com/news/coronavi...ers-police-say
https://www.kron4.com/news/bay-area/...arting-june-1/
People are over all these house-arrests, closed businesses and lost jobs and all this distancing and masks and ignore it when given the chance. Of course, in every article there's some
Quarantine the vulnerable. Leave the rest of us alone. Stop spreading fear.
Jun 3, 2020, 2:36 pm
#1350
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 6,286
Earlier in the masks discussion, someone referenced Sweden as an example of how hoping for quick herd immunity was a better response than locking things down and reducing infections. In case people haven't been following along, that's been, predictably, a failure. Both on a public health and economic scale.
Man Behind Sweden’s Controversial Virus Strategy Admits Mistakes
Man Behind Sweden’s Controversial Virus Strategy Admits Mistakes
The laxer approach to containing the virus has drawn both praise and condemnation from across the globe. What is beyond debate, however, is the effect the strategy has had on the country’s death toll.
At 43 deaths per 100,000, Sweden’s mortality rate is among the highest globally and far exceeds that of neighboring Denmark and Norway, which imposed much tougher lockdowns at the onset of the pandemic.
…
What’s more, there’s so far limited evidence that Sweden’s decision to leave much of its society open will support the economy. Finance Minister Magdalena Andersson recently warned that Sweden is facing its worst economic crisis since World War II, with GDP set to slump 7% in 2020, roughly as much as the rest of the EU.
At 43 deaths per 100,000, Sweden’s mortality rate is among the highest globally and far exceeds that of neighboring Denmark and Norway, which imposed much tougher lockdowns at the onset of the pandemic.
…
What’s more, there’s so far limited evidence that Sweden’s decision to leave much of its society open will support the economy. Finance Minister Magdalena Andersson recently warned that Sweden is facing its worst economic crisis since World War II, with GDP set to slump 7% in 2020, roughly as much as the rest of the EU.