Who would be the next Skyteam member?
Nov 30, 2018, 9:02 pm
#1278
Join Date: Oct 2012
Programs: Dynasty Frequent Flyer (Elite Plus),Accor Platinum
Posts: 1,866
Sichuan would be a great addition for Skyteam as they need a stronger presence in Southwest China like Chengdu or Chongqing now that CZ is leaving. Virgin Australia would be wonderful even if just a connecting partner as this is by far the weakest link in Skyteam with no domestic options. A recent article I read even said is the forgotten Airline alliance in Australia and NZ as most people only know Oneworld and Star alliance. India is still a developing market so I am sure alliances will want to get a partner within the next 10 years or so.
Dec 4, 2018, 8:15 pm
#1279
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 84
Well, as for India, so far only Star Alliance already snatched a member, which is Air India. Jet Airways could be the next future member as eight of their codeshare partners are SkyTeam members and Delta is their codeshare partner for the US flights, so it's a "deal-sealer". Just sayin'
Last edited by T.A.Music; Dec 4, 2018 at 8:34 pm
Dec 5, 2018, 2:43 am
#1280
Suspended
Join Date: May 2011
Location: London
Programs: *A G, OW S.
Posts: 996
Sichuan would be a great addition for Skyteam as they need a stronger presence in Southwest China like Chengdu or Chongqing now that CZ is leaving. Virgin Australia would be wonderful even if just a connecting partner as this is by far the weakest link in Skyteam with no domestic options. A recent article I read even said is the forgotten Airline alliance in Australia and NZ as most people only know Oneworld and Star alliance. India is still a developing market so I am sure alliances will want to get a partner within the next 10 years or so.
Dec 5, 2018, 8:29 pm
#1281
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 84
Correction: By October 2016, Air New Zealand was no longer a Virgin Australia shareholder. Singapore Airlines hold the stake alongside Virgin Group, Etihad Aviation Group, Nanshan Group (who owned Qingdao Airlines) and HNA (who owned Hainan Airlines).
Virgin Australia has a JV with Delta, codeshares with Alitalia and Virgin Atlantic, which 49% is owned by Delta. Not to mention Richard Branson still has a stake in Virgin Australia so, despite (half-hearted) opposition from SQ, Richard will persuade Virgin Australia to enter SkyTeam as (according to Richard) Delta is Virgin Atlantic's savior.
For someone that suggested Hainan Airlines, as much as I wanted them to join alongside my suggestion Sichuan Airlines, I'm not sure if China Eastern wanted another huge airline in SkyTeam's arsenal. They prefer Sichuan Airlines which is the same size as Xiamen Airlines. But who knows if Hainan can complement China Eastern. If things go well, they can bring HK Airlines, too.
By the time AFKLM Group enters Virgin Atlantic ownership alongside Delta and Virgin Group, maybe 2019 could be the perfect time for SkyTeam to recruit Virgin Atlantic? Royal Air Maroc recently got recruited by Oneworld. I also would love to see Etihad enters SkyTeam despite AA codeshare for Etihad Guest in the future. And Air Serbia, too.
Virgin Australia has a JV with Delta, codeshares with Alitalia and Virgin Atlantic, which 49% is owned by Delta. Not to mention Richard Branson still has a stake in Virgin Australia so, despite (half-hearted) opposition from SQ, Richard will persuade Virgin Australia to enter SkyTeam as (according to Richard) Delta is Virgin Atlantic's savior.
For someone that suggested Hainan Airlines, as much as I wanted them to join alongside my suggestion Sichuan Airlines, I'm not sure if China Eastern wanted another huge airline in SkyTeam's arsenal. They prefer Sichuan Airlines which is the same size as Xiamen Airlines. But who knows if Hainan can complement China Eastern. If things go well, they can bring HK Airlines, too.
By the time AFKLM Group enters Virgin Atlantic ownership alongside Delta and Virgin Group, maybe 2019 could be the perfect time for SkyTeam to recruit Virgin Atlantic? Royal Air Maroc recently got recruited by Oneworld. I also would love to see Etihad enters SkyTeam despite AA codeshare for Etihad Guest in the future. And Air Serbia, too.
Jan 30, 2019, 10:43 pm
#1282
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Programs: AA Gold AAdvantage Elite, Rapids Reward
Posts: 38,310
Feb 21, 2019, 11:48 pm
#1283
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 84
Air France-KLM can sell back Virgin Atlantic shares over Brexit
20 FEBRUARY, 2019 SOURCE: FLIGHT DASHBOARD BY: OLIVER CLARK PARIS
Air France-KLM has the right to sell the 31% stake it has acquired in Virgin Atlantic back to Virgin Group in the event that a hard Brexit inhibits the UK airline's ability to operate.
Speaking to FlightGlobal at a press briefing in Paris today, Air France-KLM finance chief Frederic Gagey said that there was a clause in the agreement under which it bought the Virgin Atlantic stake that stipulates that it can under certain conditions insist that Virgin Group takes the stake back.
"Suppose that one day we need absolutely Virgin Atlantic being UK – UK capital, UK equity, UK voting rights... due to a new regulation. There is the possibility to look at all the solutions. And if ultimately there is no solution there is a commitment by Virgin Group to buy back the shares," says Gagey.
Earlier this month, Air France-KLM received regulatory clearance from the European Commission to obtain the Virgin Atlantic stake. The group is purchasing the stake from Richard Branson's Virgin Group, which will retain a 20% holding. The remaining 49% is held by Delta Air Lines.
Under EU ownership and control rules, an airline based in the bloc must be 49% owned by EU nationals. The status of UK shareholders after Brexit has not yet been clarified.
Gagey predicts that Virgin Atlantic will secure US regulatory approval to join Air France-KLM in the transatlantic joint venture with Delta Air Lines in July.
He says this will add an operator with a presence comparable to KLM on the North Atlantic market to the immunised JV, and end the "confused set-up of multiple joint ventures", creating a "simplified" structure.
Air France-KLM is "not happy" with sales in the UK, and expects the inclusion of Virgin Atlantic to give it enhanced access to customers and markets in the country. Gagey says it is too early to say how Brexit will affect demand.
He says that it is up to new Virgin Atlantic chief executive Shai Weiss whether the airline joins the SkyTeam alliance, but adds that it would be "totally natural" were it to happen.
20 FEBRUARY, 2019 SOURCE: FLIGHT DASHBOARD BY: OLIVER CLARK PARIS
Air France-KLM has the right to sell the 31% stake it has acquired in Virgin Atlantic back to Virgin Group in the event that a hard Brexit inhibits the UK airline's ability to operate.
Speaking to FlightGlobal at a press briefing in Paris today, Air France-KLM finance chief Frederic Gagey said that there was a clause in the agreement under which it bought the Virgin Atlantic stake that stipulates that it can under certain conditions insist that Virgin Group takes the stake back.
"Suppose that one day we need absolutely Virgin Atlantic being UK – UK capital, UK equity, UK voting rights... due to a new regulation. There is the possibility to look at all the solutions. And if ultimately there is no solution there is a commitment by Virgin Group to buy back the shares," says Gagey.
Earlier this month, Air France-KLM received regulatory clearance from the European Commission to obtain the Virgin Atlantic stake. The group is purchasing the stake from Richard Branson's Virgin Group, which will retain a 20% holding. The remaining 49% is held by Delta Air Lines.
Under EU ownership and control rules, an airline based in the bloc must be 49% owned by EU nationals. The status of UK shareholders after Brexit has not yet been clarified.
Gagey predicts that Virgin Atlantic will secure US regulatory approval to join Air France-KLM in the transatlantic joint venture with Delta Air Lines in July.
He says this will add an operator with a presence comparable to KLM on the North Atlantic market to the immunised JV, and end the "confused set-up of multiple joint ventures", creating a "simplified" structure.
Air France-KLM is "not happy" with sales in the UK, and expects the inclusion of Virgin Atlantic to give it enhanced access to customers and markets in the country. Gagey says it is too early to say how Brexit will affect demand.
He says that it is up to new Virgin Atlantic chief executive Shai Weiss whether the airline joins the SkyTeam alliance, but adds that it would be "totally natural" were it to happen.
Sep 28, 2019, 7:04 pm
#1284
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Currently SJO (but also LON and NYC)
Programs: SkyTeam: AF/KL Gold. Star Alliance: CM Gold; AV Gold; UA. OneWorld: BA Sapphire
Posts: 183
LATAM might join at some point soon! That would be a much better option then GOL, of course... Great coverage of most South American countries.
Granted, this is not yet official... But it seems like a logical next step now that Delta is buying stake in LATAM and the latter is leaving One World.
https://www.flyertalk.com/articles/d...-in-latam.html
Granted, this is not yet official... But it seems like a logical next step now that Delta is buying stake in LATAM and the latter is leaving One World.
https://www.flyertalk.com/articles/d...-in-latam.html
Sep 28, 2019, 10:33 pm
#1285
Join Date: May 2004
Location: formerly Gold now Diamond, formerly MSY, now LAX, formerly NW, now DL
Programs: Hyatt Plat, Hilton Gold, SPG Gold, Delta Diamond/1MM
Posts: 4,635
Nope.
LATAM will stay out of any alliances, maintain current relationships with other airlines except AA, forge new DL once of course, I bet also AM/KL/AF/VS/MU/KE/Westjet and maybe VA? (The airlines DL has a deep relationship with)
LATAM will stay out of any alliances, maintain current relationships with other airlines except AA, forge new DL once of course, I bet also AM/KL/AF/VS/MU/KE/Westjet and maybe VA? (The airlines DL has a deep relationship with)
Sep 30, 2019, 12:01 am
#1286
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: DUS, BRU, POA
Programs: Skyteam E+ (FB PfL), Latam Black, LH MM, Iberia plus, HH: Diamond, Marriott Bonvoy: Plat
Posts: 1,117
Not so sure. Since Copa left Skyteam about a decade ago, Delta (as well as AF/KL) were always interested in identifying a proper ST partner in South America. There were several attempts with Gol but it didn't work out. Now Delta with a 20% share in Latam, let's wait and see...
In any case, this investment is interesting and not an obvious move since both business and leisure related travel in the region didn't develop well over the last many years.
In any case, this investment is interesting and not an obvious move since both business and leisure related travel in the region didn't develop well over the last many years.
Sep 30, 2019, 12:14 am
#1287
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Paris, France
Programs: AF/KL Flying Blue Platinum for life/Club2000 Ultimate, Accor ALL Diamond
Posts: 21,904
DL does not care anymore about Skyteam. They do care only about their own cooperation arrangements. They do not even let VS join ST. I am guessing Latam will not join as well.
Sep 30, 2019, 4:41 am
#1288
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 84
^^That could be a possibility, unless Cueto decided that he wanted to join ST. Let's see if with AFKL entering VS can change the tide and make VS join the alliance as well.
I mean, of all investments DL have made, only VS and WestJet are thes one that didn't join the alliance. (I'm excluding GOL because DL divests its share soon) And tbh, DL keeping VS and LA to itself sounds unfair to smaller ST airlines like GA.
I mean, of all investments DL have made, only VS and WestJet are thes one that didn't join the alliance. (I'm excluding GOL because DL divests its share soon) And tbh, DL keeping VS and LA to itself sounds unfair to smaller ST airlines like GA.
Oct 20, 2019, 6:29 pm
#1289
Join Date: Feb 2019
Posts: 40
^^That could be a possibility, unless Cueto decided that he wanted to join ST. Let's see if with AFKL entering VS can change the tide and make VS join the alliance as well.
I mean, of all investments DL have made, only VS and WestJet are thes one that didn't join the alliance. (I'm excluding GOL because DL divests its share soon) And tbh, DL keeping VS and LA to itself sounds unfair to smaller ST airlines like GA.
I mean, of all investments DL have made, only VS and WestJet are thes one that didn't join the alliance. (I'm excluding GOL because DL divests its share soon) And tbh, DL keeping VS and LA to itself sounds unfair to smaller ST airlines like GA.
It all become moot with the management changes and shareholder exits (E.g NZ), both EY and SQ reducing involvement in VA due to financial troubles at EY (and SQ drawing back on their stake/involvement), which has since led to VA slowly branching out on partnerships e.g HA, NH, VS.
Oct 27, 2019, 8:43 am
#1290
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: SE England
Programs: AF-KL Platinum, ALL Platinum
Posts: 755
DL, along with AF, AM and KE, founded SkyTeam so if DL are doing their own thing then why don't DL just make the alliance work better and encourage VS, WS etc. to join. Don't the pros of airline alliances still outweigh the cons? What's with joint ventures being any different to alliances? Aren't alliances better than joint ventures for passengers, as it gives greater scope for earning status and redeemable points, more connections/flight options etc?
Also, it appears from many articles/blogs/comments that the existence of SkyTeam is only for the benefit DL, and that all the other members (from big AF, KE etc. to small RO, UX etc.) are superfluous. Personally, I use a range of SkyTeam carriers due the ability to have common STE+ benefits and more flight options e.g. MF + KL codeshare tickets between LHR and Asia.
Also, it appears from many articles/blogs/comments that the existence of SkyTeam is only for the benefit DL, and that all the other members (from big AF, KE etc. to small RO, UX etc.) are superfluous. Personally, I use a range of SkyTeam carriers due the ability to have common STE+ benefits and more flight options e.g. MF + KL codeshare tickets between LHR and Asia.
