Why I was denied access to the First Class side of the Sydney lounge?
Nov 12, 2007, 6:55 pm
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: SJC/SFO/OAK
Programs: BD Gold (and future SEN), 0.2MM AA EXP, HHonors Gold, SPG Gold
Posts: 3,107
Why I was denied access to the First Class side of the Sydney lounge?
I was passing through SYD, and after having spent significant time in the NZ lounge previously, I had wanted to at least give the SYD SKL a try, despite that fact that I was told by several FTers to skip it and stick with the NZ lounge.
When entering, I presented my UA F boarding pass, and man oh man was the dragon quick to point out that this was the SQ lounge, the UA lounge is over yonder, etc etc. "Yes, but I wanted to visit this lounge for the great views," I replied. I was told that it wasn't possible, as I was flying United.
I then politely asked if a Star Alliance First Class ticket was no longer sufficient to enter a Star Alliance First Class lounge. She claimed to have never heard of that, so I produced a printed copy of the Star Alliance website. She said that lounge access was for PPS and SQ C and F pax. When I asked about the "Star Alliance Gold" printed clearly on the door, she demanded to see my card. Doing my best to not get visibly frustrated, I pull out my BD *G card, as I had a BD # on the BP.
She takes it, then proceeds to give me the "one-time exception" speech, and then she points me to the Raffles side. I inquired once more about the First Class side, only to get answered with a scowl.
All I really wanted was a shower and a glass of bubbly, and I ended up with neither
The showers weren't stocked with anything, and when I couldn't find anyone else, I went back to the dragon. Clearly not happy to see me again, she said that it would be a while before someone could help me.
At this point I went back and picked up my things, thanked her as genuinely as I could as I walked past, and turned left. I was greeted with a smile at the NZ lounge, grabbed a nice hot shower, and enjoyed a few pasties and mimosas before my flight.
It was painfully obvious that I wasn't going to be welcomed into the lounge from the beginning, but I really wanted to see the F side. If I was simply told that the lounge was at capacity, I would have been irritated on the inside, but at least understood (and I know that it's the standard cop-out any lounge agent can use to turn people away). But why the constant change of stance, and inconsistent application of rules?
Has the SYD lounge gone the way of SFO, where its no longer a *G or *A lounge? Did I catch a particularly nasty dragon? Anyone else have issues accessing the SYD lounge?
When entering, I presented my UA F boarding pass, and man oh man was the dragon quick to point out that this was the SQ lounge, the UA lounge is over yonder, etc etc. "Yes, but I wanted to visit this lounge for the great views," I replied. I was told that it wasn't possible, as I was flying United.
I then politely asked if a Star Alliance First Class ticket was no longer sufficient to enter a Star Alliance First Class lounge. She claimed to have never heard of that, so I produced a printed copy of the Star Alliance website. She said that lounge access was for PPS and SQ C and F pax. When I asked about the "Star Alliance Gold" printed clearly on the door, she demanded to see my card. Doing my best to not get visibly frustrated, I pull out my BD *G card, as I had a BD # on the BP.
She takes it, then proceeds to give me the "one-time exception" speech, and then she points me to the Raffles side. I inquired once more about the First Class side, only to get answered with a scowl.
All I really wanted was a shower and a glass of bubbly, and I ended up with neither
The showers weren't stocked with anything, and when I couldn't find anyone else, I went back to the dragon. Clearly not happy to see me again, she said that it would be a while before someone could help me. At this point I went back and picked up my things, thanked her as genuinely as I could as I walked past, and turned left. I was greeted with a smile at the NZ lounge, grabbed a nice hot shower, and enjoyed a few pasties and mimosas before my flight.
It was painfully obvious that I wasn't going to be welcomed into the lounge from the beginning, but I really wanted to see the F side. If I was simply told that the lounge was at capacity, I would have been irritated on the inside, but at least understood (and I know that it's the standard cop-out any lounge agent can use to turn people away). But why the constant change of stance, and inconsistent application of rules?
Has the SYD lounge gone the way of SFO, where its no longer a *G or *A lounge? Did I catch a particularly nasty dragon? Anyone else have issues accessing the SYD lounge?
Nov 12, 2007, 8:19 pm
#2
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Sydney, Australia
Programs: Velocity Platinum, UA MM
Posts: 557
I use the SQ lounge at Sydney quite frequently.
My understanding of the protocols is that the First Class section is strictly for those holding SQ first class boarding passes and the business class section is for all others including *G members or SQ business class passengers.
Holding a UA first class boarding pass meant that you were entitled to use the UA First class lounge.
My understanding of the protocols is that the First Class section is strictly for those holding SQ first class boarding passes and the business class section is for all others including *G members or SQ business class passengers.
Holding a UA first class boarding pass meant that you were entitled to use the UA First class lounge.
Nov 12, 2007, 8:30 pm
#3
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: SJC/SFO/OAK
Programs: BD Gold (and future SEN), 0.2MM AA EXP, HHonors Gold, SPG Gold
Posts: 3,107
I use the SQ lounge at Sydney quite frequently.
My understanding of the protocols is that the First Class section is strictly for those holding SQ first class boarding passes and the business class section is for all others including *G members or SQ business class passengers.
Holding a UA first class boarding pass meant that you were entitled to use the UA First class lounge.
My understanding of the protocols is that the First Class section is strictly for those holding SQ first class boarding passes and the business class section is for all others including *G members or SQ business class passengers.
Holding a UA first class boarding pass meant that you were entitled to use the UA First class lounge.
F bps entitle one to F lounge access, except for US and UA domestic F. The only way that it doesn't, as far as I can think, is if the lounge is a contract lounge, and hence not technically a *A lounge.
Nov 12, 2007, 9:39 pm
#5
Moderator, Hilton Honors
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: on a short leash
Programs: some
Posts: 71,419
Correct - assuming you have access to that part of the terminal, and of course subject to capacity rules and the like. A *A lounge agent (contract lounges don't count) should not blanket turn away pax on a whim. The OP was correct to point out the error, but confused the issue by referring to *G (as *G access is to *G lounge, generally business not first).
Nov 12, 2007, 10:19 pm
#6
Join Date: May 2006
Location: SYDNEY
Programs: SQ/PPS SOLITAIRE, QF/CC, AA,UA
Posts: 53
My understanding is a star carrier is only obliged to provide lounge access - not access to the F class section. Hence in SIN SQ operate a star lounge separate to their own. In Sydney the rules clearly state that you should be allowed in if you hold a *gold card - but no of course to F class regardless of your boarding pass. But not only SQ are ignorant of the rules; I have been denied access to the SYD NZ lounge even with a PPS Solitaire Gold * card and told to go to the lounge of my carrier of the day. Helps to carry a copy of the rules.
http://www.staralliance.com/en/trave...s/lounges.html
F bps entitle one to F lounge access, except for US and UA domestic F. The only way that it doesn't, as far as I can think, is if the lounge is a contract lounge, and hence not technically a *A lounge.
F bps entitle one to F lounge access, except for US and UA domestic F. The only way that it doesn't, as far as I can think, is if the lounge is a contract lounge, and hence not technically a *A lounge.
Nov 12, 2007, 10:34 pm
#7
Moderator, Hilton Honors
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: on a short leash
Programs: some
Posts: 71,419
My understanding is a star carrier is only obliged to provide lounge access - not access to the F class section. Hence in SIN SQ operate a star lounge separate to their own. In Sydney the rules clearly state that you should be allowed in if you hold a *gold card - but no of course to F class regardless of your boarding pass. But not only SQ are ignorant of the rules; I have been denied access to the SYD NZ lounge even with a PPS Solitaire Gold * card and told to go to the lounge of my carrier of the day. Helps to carry a copy of the rules.
A *A F pax is allowed access to all designated *A F lounges (as well as *A C lounges). Note that LH designate SEN lounges as F lounge also thus not obligated to provide access to FCT/FCL.
Most *G lounges are business class. A *G travelling (in any class) can use the *G lounge. Note that SQ do not designate SKL at SIN as *G, thus instead Premier Lounge is designated *G. Of course a *G flying F can use any *A F lounge also.
Nov 12, 2007, 11:38 pm
#8
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 994
Note that LH designate SEN lounges as F lounge also thus not obligated to provide access to FCT/FCL.
Most *G lounges are business class. A *G travelling (in any class) can use the *G lounge. Note that SQ do not designate SKL at SIN as *G, thus instead Premier Lounge is designated *G. Of course a *G flying F can use any *A F lounge also.
Just so happens, I tried both and preferred the spaciousness of the Busines lounge. Likewise in SIN, I actually find the Premier Lounge not bad at all.
But rules are rules, and the Lounge blurb on the *A website linked above is really clear. It's just super-embarrassing to have to beg to be let in.
Nov 12, 2007, 11:53 pm
#9
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: SFO
Programs: United 1K 2MM / Marriott LTP
Posts: 5,071
My experience during the last two weeks.
Just returned from SYD this morning where there are a few *A lounge options (SQ, NZ, UA). After going to the RCC to re-checkin the agent in the RCC, who claimed to have helped me before, she invited myself and 2 traveling partners into the F lounge. We declined the invitation from the agent at the RCC and went upstairs to the SQ lounge. Upon presenting our 2 UA F BP's we were informed that the UA lounge is downstairs. I said I knew the lounge is downstairs but preferred to use this one per the *A benefits. As she was jotting down some information I asked her how things were going. She commented that the lounge has been busy with a lot of UA passengers and that we really should tell UA to fix their lounge. She also commented their lounge is small which I said yes it's small and how with the A380 they only have room for their passengers. Should be noted that if you arrive in the morning on UA 863 ex-SFO- or UA 839 ex-LAX and have onward travel you will probably be declined entry into the SQ lounge due to the arrival/departure of SQ 221/220.
Just returned from SYD this morning where there are a few *A lounge options (SQ, NZ, UA). After going to the RCC to re-checkin the agent in the RCC, who claimed to have helped me before, she invited myself and 2 traveling partners into the F lounge. We declined the invitation from the agent at the RCC and went upstairs to the SQ lounge. Upon presenting our 2 UA F BP's we were informed that the UA lounge is downstairs. I said I knew the lounge is downstairs but preferred to use this one per the *A benefits. As she was jotting down some information I asked her how things were going. She commented that the lounge has been busy with a lot of UA passengers and that we really should tell UA to fix their lounge. She also commented their lounge is small which I said yes it's small and how with the A380 they only have room for their passengers. Should be noted that if you arrive in the morning on UA 863 ex-SFO- or UA 839 ex-LAX and have onward travel you will probably be declined entry into the SQ lounge due to the arrival/departure of SQ 221/220.
Nov 13, 2007, 12:58 am
#10
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: SJC/SFO/OAK
Programs: BD Gold (and future SEN), 0.2MM AA EXP, HHonors Gold, SPG Gold
Posts: 3,107
My experience during the last two weeks.
Just returned from SYD this morning where there are a few *A lounge options (SQ, NZ, UA). After going to the RCC to re-checkin the agent in the RCC, who claimed to have helped me before, she invited myself and 2 traveling partners into the F lounge. We declined the invitation from the agent at the RCC and went upstairs to the SQ lounge. Upon presenting our 2 UA F BP's we were informed that the UA lounge is downstairs. I said I knew the lounge is downstairs but preferred to use this one per the *A benefits. As she was jotting down some information I asked her how things were going. She commented that the lounge has been busy with a lot of UA passengers and that we really should tell UA to fix their lounge. She also commented their lounge is small which I said yes it's small and how with the A380 they only have room for their passengers. Should be noted that if you arrive in the morning on UA 863 ex-SFO- or UA 839 ex-LAX and have onward travel you will probably be declined entry into the SQ lounge due to the arrival/departure of SQ 221/220.
Just returned from SYD this morning where there are a few *A lounge options (SQ, NZ, UA). After going to the RCC to re-checkin the agent in the RCC, who claimed to have helped me before, she invited myself and 2 traveling partners into the F lounge. We declined the invitation from the agent at the RCC and went upstairs to the SQ lounge. Upon presenting our 2 UA F BP's we were informed that the UA lounge is downstairs. I said I knew the lounge is downstairs but preferred to use this one per the *A benefits. As she was jotting down some information I asked her how things were going. She commented that the lounge has been busy with a lot of UA passengers and that we really should tell UA to fix their lounge. She also commented their lounge is small which I said yes it's small and how with the A380 they only have room for their passengers. Should be noted that if you arrive in the morning on UA 863 ex-SFO- or UA 839 ex-LAX and have onward travel you will probably be declined entry into the SQ lounge due to the arrival/departure of SQ 221/220.
Kiwi - I had only mentioned Star Gold because the matron had erroneously claimed that only PPS, SQ biz and SQ F had lounge access, despite the "Star Alliance Gold" in giant *A font slapped on the door and sign outside. You might be right in that it confused the situation a little, but it was already a bad situation in that I had to break out the printout. Funny she made no mention of KF Gold.
I wonder if SQ has specifically instructed the matrons to not allow UA passengers into the lounge. Maybe they don't get reinbursed sufficiently by UA? Or maybe its part of SQ's current march towards exclusivity (no awards in New C, New F, PPS changes, etc).
Nov 13, 2007, 12:58 am
#11
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Melbourne, Vic., Australia.
Programs: QF Platinum One (LTG), UA Plat IHG Plat
Posts: 5,836
The staff at SQ SKL at SYD have been pulling this one for years now. I had the same fight about 2 years ago and they only let a friend of mine and myself in because he had a 1K card on him (as usual UA didn't get me my card in time to travel). Forget the F side.. no way no how.
I have also been invited into the F SEN lounges at FRA (and also a surprise) just with my UA 1P card. Very odd.
I have also been invited into the F SEN lounges at FRA (and also a surprise) just with my UA 1P card. Very odd.
Nov 13, 2007, 1:14 am
#12
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Sydney, Australia (from time to time)
Programs: QF-LTS & P, SQ-TPPS, IC-RA, HH-D, *wood G, Others
Posts: 1,729
My experience with the ladies in the SYD SKL has been outstanding. Without exception they are friendly and helpful and welcoming.
Nov 13, 2007, 1:27 am
#13
Suspended
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 551
i would suggest pestering the station managers instead. There are 3 of them and one of the guys is actually behind this whole denial. The managers who are seconded from the SIN office have however chose to keep quiet. I won't reveal my sources. There are obviously some sq staff who are lurking here.
