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-   -   The SQ A350 - shockingly bad J-class seat (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/singapore-airlines-krisflyer/1804727-sq-a350-shockingly-bad-j-class-seat.html)

Clack Nov 27, 16 1:20 am

The SQ A350 - shockingly bad J-class seat
 
Was excited to take my first A350 flight the other day from JNB-SIN. Cool-looking plane from the outside, nice curved winglets, and anticipating the usual good SQ service.

My excitement quickly turned to confusion and then extreme annoyance as I settled into window seat 17K. First, I am 6'2" (188cm) - tall but not inordinately so. I sit down and discover that I cannot even straighten my legs while sitting upright - the seat in front is too close and with no open space underneath. There is more room in economy to put your feet under the seat in front of you! Only if you angle your feet toward the window can you extend your legs much at all, and that's not great on the back. I've never seen this in a business-class seat before, and certainly not on SQ.

Then, if things can even get worse, the full-flat seat is a joke. Again you must angle yourself with feet closer to the window, but your feet and lower legs have to be stuffed inside a tiny opening. My US size-12 feet would not even fit! I had to try to sleep with my legs at an almost 90-degree angle. It was impossible to lay flat and extend my body.

This is such a massive failure for SQ, I can't believe this seat design made it through their review process (not sure if the fault of Airbus or some external vendor). It is literally useless for anyone over six feet tall. And I'm not some huge guy, I weigh 185 lbs, but it is not remotely comfortable to try to stuff your legs into this small compartment. I had a similar concern with United's new business seat that was rolled out a few years ago, but this is far worse.

So now for any overnight flight I have to make sure it's not an A350 or pick a different carrier. The video screen might be nice and large, but the inability to lay flat is a massive mistake on the part of SQ. I can't believe they blew it so badly, just to squeeze in another row of J seats. They will lose my PPS business for overnight long-haul if they roll out this crappy design all over the fleet. :mad:

malmostoso Nov 27, 16 2:06 am

I was about to open the same thread :)

I flew yesterday my first SQ J segment on an A380, and apart from the shortcomings of a decrepit seat (had to switch twice before finding one seat where both motors would work), I was just puzzled about how short it is. I'm about your size and I also could not straighten my legs either when lounging or trying to sleep.

The service and food were nice, but unless you are well below 6' SQ J is not great at all.

And I hope nobody will try to explain how you should sit in it: if a seat needs instructions beyond "place your behind in the middle of it", it's a crappy seat.

jjjohn Nov 27, 16 2:07 am

Never find SQ J seat (on either A388 or B77W) comfortable
A330 is totally no good for night flight.

carrotjuice Nov 27, 16 4:24 am

I always liked the 77W J seat much better than the A380 equivalent because there's more space between seats in the 77W. Is this real or illusionary?

From the sounds of it, the space between A350 seats is narrower than A380?

FlyerEC Nov 27, 16 6:18 am


Originally Posted by carrotjuice (Post 27531550)
I always liked the 77W J seat much better than the A380 equivalent because there's more space between seats in the 77W. Is this real or illusionary?

From the sounds of it, the space between A350 seats is narrower than A380?

I prefer the Boeings any time .
A380 seats seem somewhat better than the A350 . I really don ' t understand how they passed muster , narrow aisles to boot .
It was bad enough on a short flight . Can ' t even think of flying them on those LH non stops , now only across the Pacific .

demue Nov 27, 16 9:51 am

I tend to agree with the OPs sentiment. I'm only 6 feet tall and lounging in the seat is not very comfortable unless one contorts the spine and sticks the feet into the cubby hole. Sleeping (angled) does work just about okay for me, but overall the only way I'm comfortable in the seat is in a bulkhead one. However, that has been the same since 2006 when the first version of the seat was launched and the 2013 update tried to make the lounging position a bit better, but still not great and the tight foot print didn't change.

crazycrab955 Nov 27, 16 1:31 pm


Originally Posted by carrotjuice (Post 27531550)
I always liked the 77W J seat much better than the A380 equivalent because there's more space between seats in the 77W. Is this real or illusionary?

From the sounds of it, the space between A350 seats is narrower than A380?

You are not imagining things. The 77W cabin is substantially larger than the A380 upper deck, so the 2006 J seats had to be modified and narrowed to fit into to the A380 cabin.

Similar thing has happened with the A350, which is a much smaller/narrower cabin than the 77W. The 2013 J seats have had to be modified to be shoehorned into the cabin.

A350 "XWB." :rolleyes:

SQ325 Nov 27, 16 7:22 pm

I much prefer the old 2006 seats over the new ones. Although there are some downsides on the A380 compared to the 77W, I still prefer these seats over the new ones. I hope that they still keep on dragging the retrofit programme on the 77W.
But still, rather the cramped A350 J than the A330 regional seats on a redeye flight.

crazyanglaisy Nov 27, 16 9:58 pm

Totally agree. I find it incredible that this seat was signed off - it so obviously pales in comparison to the competition in business class from SIN. I won't fly the SQ 350 again for precisely this reason.

Volasia Nov 27, 16 10:11 pm


Originally Posted by crazyanglaisy (Post 27534487)
Totally agree. I find it incredible that this seat was signed off - it so obviously pales in comparison to the competition in business class from SIN. I won't fly the SQ 350 again for precisely this reason.

Out of curiosity, what are the airlines You would then rate higher?

crazyanglaisy Nov 27, 16 10:53 pm


Originally Posted by Volasia (Post 27534519)
Out of curiosity, what are the airlines You would then rate higher?

Right now I'm back to doing LHR-SIN-LHR flights and it's BA now for me on those trips if the SQ A380 bulkhead seats aren't available. Obviously thats not a direct comparison because SQ dont fly the A350 on that route. There are a lot of negatives to the BA layout and business class service, but legroom and a good night's sleep aren't one of them. I also had a positive experience recently on the QR A350 from SIN - that's how a business class seat on that plane should be, as far as I'm concerned.

Hopefully the SQ A350 seat design, and its 77W cousin, are not a sign of things to come on the airline. I will happily sacrifice all the other bells and whistle for 8 hours of continuous, comfortable sleep. YMMV obviously.

shuigao Nov 28, 16 4:39 am


Originally Posted by Volasia (Post 27534519)
Out of curiosity, what are the airlines You would then rate higher?

Air France's new J seat ("reverse herringbone") is awesome.

nme7 Nov 28, 16 5:11 am

Some technical information about the planes:

A330 cabin width - 5.28m (17.33 ft)
A350 cabin width - 5.61m (18.4 ft)
A380 cabin width, upper deck - 5.8m (19.03 ft)
A380 cabin width, main deck - 6.5m (21.3 ft)
777 cabin width - 5.96m (19.6 ft)


Originally Posted by crazycrab955 (Post 27532956)
The 77W cabin is substantially larger than the A380 upper deck, so the 2006 J seats had to be modified and narrowed to fit into to the A380 cabin.

0.17m (6.84 inch) difference between the A380 upper deck and a 777.



Originally Posted by crazycrab955 (Post 27532956)
Similar thing has happened with the A350, which is a much smaller/narrower cabin than the 77W. The 2013 J seats have had to be modified to be shoehorned into the cabin.

0.37m (14.4 inch) difference between A350 and 777.

TravelwhileyouEat Nov 28, 16 6:12 am

I'm 175 cm (around 5'9) and the A380 J seats are okay, the only thing I don't enjoy is the angle when sleeping. I haven't tried the new seats.

Ausriver Nov 28, 16 7:05 am


Originally Posted by Volasia (Post 27534519)
Out of curiosity, what are the airlines You would then rate higher?

QR A350 products is great. It could be a space waste for the airline at the bar area but it is overall very good design and seats.


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