Thoughts on the decline of SQ First

Old Mar 20, 2016, 5:34 pm
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Thoughts on the decline of SQ First

I've always loved SQ and cherish the wonderful memories I've had from memorable trips, including my RTW SQ First trip with my dad a few years ago before he passed away.

But times have changed and so has SQ, unfortunately.
Thought I'd share my impressions after our six recent experiences with SQ First.

We flew 6 SQ First flights since the beginning of the year.
AKL-SIN A380
SIN-NRT A380
NRT-LAX A380
BOM-SIN 77W
SIN-NRT A380
NRT-LAX A380

Cabin crews continue to be universally excellent. Warm welcomes and perfect level of doting with excellent anticipation of needs. We were almost always addressed by name. Proper plating, presentation and pacing during meals. Crews were happy to make up beds for us in unoccupied suites. Solid and wonderful service as always.

But what on earth has happened to SQ catering? I remember wonderful Georges Blanc and Matt Moran meals that rivaled restaurant quality. Unfortunately, with only a couple of exceptions (BTC Singapore chicken rice ex-SIN), food was dismal, disappointing and at times, downright inedible. SQ has also cut the wine budget with the list, except for Dom/Krug, now featuring mostly mid/lower priced and/or unexciting selections.

The worst part of the SQ premium experience has been and continues to be its ground service, where SQ is positively terrible compared to many of its premium competitors. I'll give them a pass at out-stations like AKL and BOM, but there is no excuse at SIN. While Changi is a great airport to visit, not so much for the First Class passenger who must at times walk lengthy distances to and from the SKL/PR. On the outbound, one must of course then endure security checks at the gate. A couple of weeks ago, with no priority security line at the gate, we wound up behind 10 Economy passengers at B2 security. Compare this to Thai (golf cart pick ride from and to the gate), Lufthansa (with private FCT security and limo service to the jet bridge elevator) and Air France (agent escort thru security, meet and greet at the gate with private limo pickup drop off at La Premire Lounge and the reverse for departures) and SQ isn't in the same league. With a historically superior in flight product, one could perhaps have accepted a lesser ground product. Unfortunately, the days of a superior in flight product are no more and SQ's poor ground experience becomes more noticeable and important.

I realize that things change over time and, of course, these are all first world problems that seem silly to most. But if you are offering a premium product, the entire experience should be premium. My 2 cents, for what it's worth.
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Old Mar 20, 2016, 6:45 pm
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Their food has gotten noticeably worse compared to their competition but I don't agree that there has been a decline in ground services. They never existed in the first place so I don't see what has declined. But yes, there's no denying SQ's cost cutting is in full effect.

Regarding conducting security at the gate, a tip; while the absence of fast track is not ideal it really isn't a huge issue. If you're a premium passenger just turn up as late as possible. They won't refuse you and why would you want to turn up early? To sit in the holding pen? I fly out of Changi weekly and I never have an issue.

I also don't think TG should be on that list. Mediocre airline with a poor F lounge at a horrendous airport.

It's horses for courses at the end of the day. I'd fly SQ over LH and AF for the service alone, which you touched on.
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Old Mar 20, 2016, 6:49 pm
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don't they offer buggy service from SKL to the gate for FCL/RCL pax ex-Changi?
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Old Mar 20, 2016, 8:18 pm
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Ground service at JFK is nonexistent. It's a complete joke.
Standing in so-called "priority" line at JFK 4 is a pain and it shouldn't be.
But...
A Virgin lounge lady was so great, I quickly forgot about it.

The flight (SQ 25) was outstanding, a great crew and some amazing food.
The lobster bisque appetizer (everybody goes for the caviar choice, big mistake!)
was to die for. I booked the Lobster Thermidor and it was exceptional.
Skipped everything else and slept like a baby for 5 hours or so.

I think the way to make it great is to go for a good BTC choice.
And be lucky to get a great crew (not too difficult).

I just booked more SQ suites and can't wait. What else is so great out there?
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Old Mar 20, 2016, 8:30 pm
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SFO777, as much as I respect your opinion and reviews regarding all things first class, I'll beg to partly differ with you.

What I'll agree with is that the food isn't great, with the exception of the Lobster Thermidor. I don't know whether it's the same catering, but the four dishes my wife and I recently had while passing through The Private Room (flying SGN-SIN-NRT-LAX) were all mediocre. On our flights, the caviar was nice and the LT was great, but beyond that the food was so-so.

Wines I can't really opine on, as we generally stick with just the champagne and I'm simply pretty ignorant when it comes to vino.

Beyond that...I still love the F hard product and exceptional service. The IFE screen quality and selections were excellent. While TPR doesn't have all the bells and whistles of some other top lounges, it still offers superb ambiance and service.

As for SIN itself, I really like the gate-specific security and simply don't mind waiting a few minutes if there are folks in front of me. The F-specific immigration desk has come in handy when running late for a flight. And SIN remains my favorite airport in the world.

So...I guess it depends on what one prioritizes. I certainly understand your expecting a top F product in every way from a top airline. My own YMMV assessment is that the things that matter most to me - great hard product, great service, extremely reliable - are the things SQ continues to get right. And it also scores very well in terms of my next tier of priorities - very nice lounge, great bubbly, wonderful airport, good IFE.

Now, how SQ 380 F suites compare with EY's 380 F apartments is another matter. But I'll save that for another day.
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Old Mar 20, 2016, 9:18 pm
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Originally Posted by leogeo
don't they offer buggy service from SKL to the gate for FCL/RCL pax ex-Changi?
Not actively, but they do it on request.
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Old Mar 20, 2016, 10:46 pm
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Maybe it's not so much the "decline of SQ" as it is the "rise of the other airlines?"

Suites (hard product) have been one-upped by EY

J seat is no longer industry leading since many other airlines already have 1-2-1 (I tried AF's new J the other day and I prefer it to SQ cos of the 'reverse herringbone' layout)

Ground experience inferior to AF @ CDG and a host of other lounges / airports.
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Old Mar 21, 2016, 1:34 am
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I don't fly SQ F as much as SFO777 but manage a few trips each year.

I haven't noticed a recent decrease in catering (a few years ago there was with some of the medium haul flights reduced from 2 to 1 meal). Indeed there have been some (small) improvements such as redeye flights now explicitly providing both supper and breakfast options.

I also have generally had good luck with gates close to the SKL - mostly low A gates and sometimes B gates.

As for SIN security at gate I've also not had to wait more than a minute or so. Perhaps the OP is not good at picking which queue will be slow vs fast?

I do agree with some that there are a few airlines that have improved to(wards) SQ's standards in recent years.
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Old Mar 21, 2016, 6:59 am
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Good discussion.

Originally Posted by Phaze
Their food has gotten noticeably worse compared to their competition but I don't agree that there has been a decline in ground services. They never existed in the first place so I don't see what has declined. But yes, there's no denying SQ's cost cutting is in full effect.
I don't believe I stated that there was a decline in ground services, just lamenting the same old non-existent ground service which IMO is now more irritating given the decline in SQ catering.

Originally Posted by Phaze
Regarding conducting security at the gate, a tip; while the absence of fast track is not ideal it really isn't a huge issue. If you're a premium passenger just turn up as late as possible. They won't refuse you and why would you want to turn up early? To sit in the holding pen? I fly out of Changi weekly and I never have an issue.
We didn't sit in the holding pen. After we finally cleared security, we boarded straight away as it had already commenced.

Originally Posted by Phaze
I also don't think TG should be on that list. Mediocre airline with a poor F lounge at a horrendous airport. It's horses for courses at the end of the day. I'd fly SQ over LH and AF for the service alone, which you touched on.
Have you actually flown AF long-haul First recently? IMO, their new 77W La Premire is the #1 First Class product in the world. Amazing ground service, meet & greet & escort, limo transfers between the jet bridge and the Alain Ducasse FCL at CDG, meet & greet & escort even at outstations, spectacular on board catering and gorgeous and intimate 4 seat F cabin with solid ceiling to floor privacy curtains.

Originally Posted by Big_Foot
The flight (SQ 25) was outstanding, a great crew and some amazing food.
The lobster bisque appetizer (everybody goes for the caviar choice, big mistake!)
was to die for. I booked the Lobster Thermidor and it was exceptional.
Skipped everything else and slept like a baby for 5 hours or so.
I think the way to make it great is to go for a good BTC choice.
And be lucky to get a great crew (not too difficult).
I just booked more SQ suites and can't wait. What else is so great out there?
Glad to hear. We did BTC three times but two of them (ex-SIN Matt Moran's Lamb loin and ex-NRT Lobster Thermidor) were inedible.

Originally Posted by Thunderroad
So...I guess it depends on what one prioritizes. I certainly understand your expecting a top F product in every way from a top airline. My own YMMV assessment is that the things that matter most to me - great hard product, great service, extremely reliable - are the things SQ continues to get right. And it also scores very well in terms of my next tier of priorities - very nice lounge, great bubbly, wonderful airport, good IFE.
I agree. It's not like I won't fly them again as SQ's hard product is excellent and cabin crews still wonderful. IMO, SQ is no longer so much better than the competition that one can ignore the ground service failures. I view the entire First Class product from arrival at your departure airport to exiting at your destination. AF and LH understand this and that's why I rank their overall F products as #1 and #2.

Originally Posted by shuigao
Maybe it's not so much the "decline of SQ" as it is the "rise of the other airlines?"
Suites (hard product) have been one-upped by EY
J seat is no longer industry leading since many other airlines already have 1-2-1 (I tried AF's new J the other day and I prefer it to SQ cos of the 'reverse herringbone' layout)
Ground experience inferior to AF @ CDG and a host of other lounges / airports.
Good points.

Originally Posted by Kiwi Flyer
I also have generally had good luck with gates close to the SKL - mostly low A gates and sometimes B gates.
As for SIN security at gate I've also not had to wait more than a minute or so. Perhaps the OP is not good at picking which queue will be slow vs fast?
I think arriving from BOM at B9 with an already cranky Mrs. SFO777 probably set the mood for the day.
And I always seem to wind up in the slow lane.
Guess I'm so used to walk right thru US PreCheck that I'm out of practice when given a traditional security line choice.
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Old Mar 21, 2016, 11:02 am
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I suspect a big part of the reason that AF and LH offer such elaborate F ground experiences at CDG and FRA is that the J and Y passenger experience at those airports ranges from frustrating to eighth-circle-of-hell. SIN by contrast is fairly pleasant for all passengers. So F passengers don't get to feel as special, but it's not like one particularly suffers having to make your own way through Changi, other than the occasional long-ish walk.
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Old Mar 22, 2016, 6:47 am
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SFO777, I completely agree except on one point, and that's unfortunately in regards to the cabin crew being "universally exceptional". Some are still incredible, but some are just lazy.

I fly SQ F regularly, as recently as yesterday A380 SYD-SIN. The catering is revolting, more often than not (yes, sometimes it's great, but rarely), and the ground services are annoyingly bad.

SQ was once known for their consistently good crew, I feel up front this has changed. Some seem disenchanted. I'm not going to speculate about cost cutting, but there just isn't always the pride that there once was.

I also think Changi is a crappy airport and totally overrated, but that's subjective and most disagree. I'd rather HKG any day of the week.

TPR matches Changi perfectly; it's terribly dated, with crappy food and zero ambiance. Again, overrated.

Don't get me wrong, I don't hate SQ F, I still fly it... It just isn't consistently good, like LH for example.

I still fundamentally believe the thing everyone hates about flying is the ground experience, and LH is the airline that's mastered this at their home ports for premium travelers, and this trumps most things for me.
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Old Mar 22, 2016, 9:19 am
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Originally Posted by shuigao
Maybe it's not so much the "decline of SQ" as it is the "rise of the other airlines?"

Suites (hard product) have been one-upped by EY

J seat is no longer industry leading since many other airlines already have 1-2-1 (I tried AF's new J the other day and I prefer it to SQ cos of the 'reverse herringbone' layout)

Ground experience inferior to AF @ CDG and a host of other lounges / airports.
Originally Posted by bgriff
I suspect a big part of the reason that AF and LH offer such elaborate F ground experiences at CDG and FRA is that the J and Y passenger experience at those airports ranges from frustrating to eighth-circle-of-hell. SIN by contrast is fairly pleasant for all passengers. So F passengers don't get to feel as special, but it's not like one particularly suffers having to make your own way through Changi, other than the occasional long-ish walk.
I think these are both very good points as part of an interesting (though, as SFO777 flagged, an admittedly "first world problems") discussion.
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Old Mar 23, 2016, 2:41 am
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vantage 03 quote: "I completely agree except on one point, and that's unfortunately in regards to the cabin crew being "universally exceptional". Some are still incredible, but some are just lazy."

There is some merit in this post:

My thoughts? Well the last four sectors flown in suites class were very different: (first sector short haul, second long haul) were magnificent. Crews attentive, food terrific, hard product functional. The return (third sector long haul) crews great, food so, so and hard product tired. Fourth sector (short haul). Crews diabolical: poor welcome, sloppy service, appalling food (sent back uneaten) making the investment in suites class questionable.

I think the greatest risk to SQ F-class is the grand service we received when flying on a later trip on the new 777WN service (C-class): great hard product, good crew, nice experience and value for money.

However, as seasoned travellers, we all know it’s risky to base an opinion on a couple of trips – you are always going to get some variance. However, my partner, once a rusted fan of SQ F-Class, is now questioning my logic in supporting (read paying) for that ‘apparent’ privilege in SQ F-class.

A data point: we have at the Private Room (SIN) requested buggy service to the gate, especially if it required a long walk and have always been accommodated by the friendly PR SIA gate angels.
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Old Mar 23, 2016, 3:34 am
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A question, does SQ operate in the right markets to maintain a full bells and whistles F service, like AF and LH (who have access to the lucrative transatlantic market), or like the cashed up ME carriers?

So often you read of people liking SQ F because they have an empty cabin, one seat for sleeping and one for sitting - and these are on awards. How on earth do they make money on F if this is the case? Or is it simply a loss leader?

Basically the main market I would have thought SQ F now is Australia/SE Asia - Europe or SE Asia-North America. Outside those basic geographies you can get good non-stop services on a whole range of carriers and paid F (I assume) is less price sensitive, so people are more inclined to take a more expensive non-stop than backtracking through SIN, to get from say Shanghai to London.

We've also seen the reduction in 77W from 8 to 4 seats.

I'm being a bit provocative, but is the writing on the wall for SQ F?
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Old Mar 23, 2016, 3:41 am
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My 2 cents with SQ:

1. SQ's CEO is a joke. So I am not surprised in the declining service. The good news - the CEO is not stressed by the shareholders as a flag carrier.

2. CX, SQ's competitor in Asia, declines way much faster. There is no incentive for SQ to improve so long it is above CX.

3. SQ's Ground service is non-existence for the entire world. AFAIK - SQ outsources its own ground service to a subsidiary - SATS.
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