Oct 31, 2014, 6:05 am
Last edit by: lifeonthego_k
I'm going to update this first post as more info flows in to create a 'master list' of all credit cards that offer a decent way of accruing miles - so please help out!
If you know of and/or use any other cards (or the ones already mentioned), please share your thoughts.
***ALL VALUES BELOW IN SINGAPORE DOLLARS (SGD)***
============
In no particular order (apart from personal preference in terms of good-mileage opportunities):
============
1. UOB PRVI Miles VISA, MasterCard, AMEX
VISA:
http://www.uob.com.sg/personal/cards...iles_visa.html
MasterCard:
http://www.uob.com.sg/personal/cards...astercard.html
Amex:
http://www.uob.com.sg/personal/cards...amex_card.html
http://www.uob.com.sg/personal/cards...ard/microsite/
Mileage accrual:
The earn rate will be 1.4 miles for every $1 spent in multiples of S$10 (every multiple of S$5 gives 6 to 7 miles due to 3.5 UNI$ rounding off, every S$10 gives 14 miles), and 2.4 miles for every $1 spent OVERSEAS (every $5 gives 12 miles).
Requirements: min. income $80,000 (not strict).
Cost: First year free, then S$256.80 for main, first two supplementary always free. Annual fee waiver for Amex card if you charge $50,000 or more in a year.
Miles conversion fee: $25 per conversion. UNI$ are combined in 1 cardholder's name/FIN Number/NRIC together for all UOB cards which earn UNI$.
Pros: Best mileage accrual rates for overseas spend only. 20,000 bonus miles and annual fee waiver with spend of $50,000 per year (both only for Amex card). $45 1-way airport transfer voucher for $1,000 overseas spend in a given quarter (Amex only).
Cons: AMEX not always accepted by merchants. Points allocated on every $5 spent, rounded down to next $5. Transfer in blocks of 5000 UNI$ points = 10,000 miles. Points are valid for 2 years (transfer before expiry and they will subsequently be valid for a further 3 years from the date of transfer to KrisFlyer).
2. UOB Preferred Platinum Visa
http://www.uob.com.sg/personal/cards..._platinum.html
http://www.uob.com.sg/personal/cards...visa_card.html
Mileage accrual: Earn 4 miles for every $1 spent using ONLY MOBILE CONTACTLESS every $5 gives 10 UNI$ which equal 20 miles). Same incredible mileage-earning ratio for internet shopping with certain restrictions (travel-related, utilities, etc.). Earn 0.4 mile for every $1 for regular, signature-based payments AND ORPHAN SPEND DUE TO $5 ROUNDING OR EXCEEDING THE BONUS U$2000 SPEND (every $5 gives 1 UNI$ which equal 2 miles).
Earning 4 miles/$ is limited to the first S$1110 spent during the per calendar month (via Mobile Contactless). 2,000UNI$ refers to the extra 9UNI$ and does not include the normal 1UNI$.(Stop when you notice you earn 3UNI$ (1 + bonus 2) for the last S$5 transaction. ($1110/5)x9=1998UNI$, hence the last S$5 transaction will earn 2 bonus UNI$. The total bonus UNI$ awarded to you from qualifying spend on Selected Online Transactions and Mobile Contactless Transactions is capped at UNI$2,000 for each calendar month. THE CAP IS ON THE 9 UNI$ BONUS NOT 10UNI$ TOTAL YOU GET WITH BASE OF U$1 PER $ SPEND
Keep in mind that some merchants offer different, non-mileage accruing awards with UOB cards which are called SMART$. Some popular merchants include Cold Storage, Guardian and Giant Supermarket, ToastBox and Starbucks. A full list of merchants where Mobile contactless transactions will NOT earn miles can be found here: http://www.uob.com.sg/personal/cards...smartclub.html
Requirements: min. income $30,000 ($60,000 for foreigners).
Cost: First year free, then $192.60 for main and $96.30 for supplementary. Annual fee waived off easily.
Miles conversion fee: $25 per conversion, in blocks of 5000 UNI$=10,000 miles. UNI$ are combined in 1 cardholder's name for all UOB cards.
Pros: Incredible mileage accrual rates for Paywave transactions (not all merchants - some give SMART$ instead which are different rewards!) as well as internet transactions (some restrictions apply).
Cons: Points allocated on every $5 spent, rounded down to next $5. Transfer in blocks of 5000 UNI$ points = 10,000 miles. Points are valid for 2 years (transfer before expiry and they will subsequently be valid for a further 3 years from the date of transfer to KrisFlyer).
3. Citi PremierMiles MasterCard
https://www.citibank.com.sg/credit-cards/travel/premiermiles-card/?ecid=PSGONSGCCAENPM
Mileage accrual: Earn 1.2 miles for every $1 spent. Earn 2 miles for every $1 spent OVERSEAS. 10,000 bonus miles for each annual membership renewal.
Requirements: min. income $50,000 for VISA. Principal cardholder must be at least 21 years of age.
Cost: First year free, then $192.60 for VISA main, supplementary always free. Annual fee waiver available in exchange for forfeiting the 10,000renewal bonus.
Miles conversion fee: $25 per conversion.
Pros: Decent all-rounder, good for overseas spend. Points never expire. Bonus miles for annual card renewal. 11 frequent flyer programs & 3 hotel programs to choose from, including EVA Air - only 25,000 miles for 1 way Business Class within Asia!!
Cons: No miles awarded for EZ-Link & Transitlink transactions. Miles awarded per S$1. Cents not included. 1.2 miles/S$1. Transfer in blocks of 10,000 miles.
4. DBS Altitude VISA/AMEX
http://www.dbs.com/sg/personal/cards...e/default.aspx
http://www.dbs.com/sg/personal/cards...e/default.aspx
Mileage accrual: Earn 1.2 miles for every $1 spent (every $5 gives 3 DBS points which equal 6 miles). Earn 2 miles for every $1 spent OVERSEAS.
Requirements: min. income $80,000.
Cost: First year free, then $180 for main and $90 for supplementary. Annual fee waiver if you charge $25,000 or more in a year.
Miles conversion fee: S$26.75 per transfer, redeem 1700 DBS points to waive off.
Pros: Points never expire. No rounding down transaction amount to nearest $5 (calculation is done as follows: DBS points = 'transaction amount' divided by 5, multiply by 3, after that round down to nearest whole number. Minimum spend is S$1.67. Each DBS point = 2 miles). Earn 3 miles per S$1 spent on all online Flight and Hotel transactions (capped at S$5,000 per month). 10,000 miles renewal bonus if you have to pay card renewal fees.
Cons: All local spend now down to 1.2 miles/$ (since Dec 1, 2013). AMEX not always accepted by merchants. Transfer in blocks of 5000 DBS points = 10,000 miles (on the plus side points don't expire). Per transfer of S$26.75, redeem 1700 DBS points to waive off.
5. Maybank Horizon Platinum Visa
http://info.maybank2u.com.sg/persona...visa-card.aspx
Earn 3.2 air miles (8X TREATS Points) with every dollar spent on dining, petrol, taxi fares and hotel bookings at Agoda.com/horizon
Earn 2 air miles (5X TREATS Points) with every dollar spent on air tickets, travel packages and foreign currency transactions, with a minimal S$300 in a calendar month
Earn 0.4 mile for every $1 spent elsewhere (1 mile for every $2.50 spent).
Requirements: min. income $30,000 ($80,000 for foreigners).
Cost: $150 for main, supplementary always free. Unsure of any annual fee waiver conditions.
Miles conversion fee: In blocks of 5,000 points to 2000 Asia Miles or KrisFlyer. S$26.75 fee applies.
Pros: Great for ticket purchases and overseas spend. Complimentary access to selected VIP airport lounges when you charge a minimum of S$400 in a single transaction on air tickets or travel packages to your Card 3 months prior to the date of travel.
Cons: Great ONLY for ticket purchases and overseas spend. Points are valid for 1 year only, expire either on 30 June or 31 December of the same year if not Rewards Infinite member.
6. Singapore Airlines KrisFlyer Ascend AMEX
https://www.americanexpress.com/sg/s...nd-credit-card
Mileage accrual: Earn 1.2 KrisFlyer miles for every S$1 spent on all your eligible purchases with your Card
Earn 2 KrisFlyer miles for every S$1 equivalent in foreign currency spent overseas on eligible purchases during June and December
Requirements: min. income $50,000 ($60,000 for foreigners). Principal cardholder must be over 21 years of age.
Cost: First year free, otherwise $256.80 for main, 2 supplementary cards always free (more available at $80.25 each). Annual fee cannot be waived unless you spend alot.
Miles conversion fee: None - your KrisFlyer miles are transferred to your account directly with no conversion fees or charges.
Pros: None, except for welcome offers (4 complimentary airport lounge access vouchers, one complimentary night with Millennium Hotels and Resorts).
Cons: Simply nothing special - there are better cards available for all types of purchases, including flight tickets, even with all of the bonuses above applied. AMEX not always accepted by merchants.
7. Citibank Rewards Card
http://www.citibank.com.sg/gcb/credi...CACRENCCHOCALM
Earn 10X Rewards (10 Rewards Points or 4 Miles for every S$1 spent) when you shop for clothes, bags and shoes or at departmental stores or online shopping websites, including SingTel & M1 online bill payment!
Pros: Transfer to 11 FFPs & 3 Hotel programs in blocks of 25,000 points=10,000 miles; S$25 fee.
Cons: Points awarded per S$1 spend. Cents not included. Cannot combined Thank You Points across cards.
8. DBS Woman's World MasterCard® Card
http://www.dbs.com.sg/personal/cards...astercard-card
10X Rewards for Online Retail Purchases
T&C Here: https://www.dbs.com.sg/iwov-resource...s_card_tnc.pdf
Pros: Men also can get this card!! DBS points are combined in 1 cardholder's name. No rounding down transaction amount to nearest $5 (calculation is done as follows: DBS points = 'transaction amount' divided by 5, multiply by 10, after that round down to nearest whole number. Minimum spend is S$1. Each DBS point = 2 miles).
Cons: DBS points are valid for 1 year based on card anniversary date. The additional 9X DBS Points for online retail spend in a calendar month will be awarded on the 16th of the next calendar month. If the above days are not working days, the Points will be awarded on the next working day. The additional 9X DBS Points are only applicable to the first S$2,000 online retail spend every calendar month.
9. OCBC Titanium Rewards Card
https://www.ocbc.com/personal-bankin...astercard.html
10x OCBC$ on your shopping Local & Overseas Shopping Transactions, Local & Overseas Department Store Transactions and Local & Overseas Online Transactions.
The remaining 9 OCBC$ will be posted to the Card Account by the end of the next calendar month
https://www.ocbc.com/assets/pdf/card...ons.pdf?rand=1
10,000 KrisFlyer miles requires OCBC$ 25000, For each conversion of OCBC$ to KrisFlyer miles a fee of S$25 will be charged
10. UOB Lady's Card
https://www.uob.com.sg/personal/card...ard/index.page
============
If you know of and/or use any other cards (or the ones already mentioned), please share your thoughts.
***ALL VALUES BELOW IN SINGAPORE DOLLARS (SGD)***
============
In no particular order (apart from personal preference in terms of good-mileage opportunities):
============
1. UOB PRVI Miles VISA, MasterCard, AMEX
VISA:
http://www.uob.com.sg/personal/cards...iles_visa.html
MasterCard:
http://www.uob.com.sg/personal/cards...astercard.html
Amex:
http://www.uob.com.sg/personal/cards...amex_card.html
http://www.uob.com.sg/personal/cards...ard/microsite/
Mileage accrual:
The earn rate will be 1.4 miles for every $1 spent in multiples of S$10 (every multiple of S$5 gives 6 to 7 miles due to 3.5 UNI$ rounding off, every S$10 gives 14 miles), and 2.4 miles for every $1 spent OVERSEAS (every $5 gives 12 miles).
Requirements: min. income $80,000 (not strict).
Cost: First year free, then S$256.80 for main, first two supplementary always free. Annual fee waiver for Amex card if you charge $50,000 or more in a year.
Miles conversion fee: $25 per conversion. UNI$ are combined in 1 cardholder's name/FIN Number/NRIC together for all UOB cards which earn UNI$.
Pros: Best mileage accrual rates for overseas spend only. 20,000 bonus miles and annual fee waiver with spend of $50,000 per year (both only for Amex card). $45 1-way airport transfer voucher for $1,000 overseas spend in a given quarter (Amex only).
Cons: AMEX not always accepted by merchants. Points allocated on every $5 spent, rounded down to next $5. Transfer in blocks of 5000 UNI$ points = 10,000 miles. Points are valid for 2 years (transfer before expiry and they will subsequently be valid for a further 3 years from the date of transfer to KrisFlyer).
2. UOB Preferred Platinum Visa
http://www.uob.com.sg/personal/cards..._platinum.html
http://www.uob.com.sg/personal/cards...visa_card.html
Mileage accrual: Earn 4 miles for every $1 spent using ONLY MOBILE CONTACTLESS every $5 gives 10 UNI$ which equal 20 miles). Same incredible mileage-earning ratio for internet shopping with certain restrictions (travel-related, utilities, etc.). Earn 0.4 mile for every $1 for regular, signature-based payments AND ORPHAN SPEND DUE TO $5 ROUNDING OR EXCEEDING THE BONUS U$2000 SPEND (every $5 gives 1 UNI$ which equal 2 miles).
Earning 4 miles/$ is limited to the first S$1110 spent during the per calendar month (via Mobile Contactless). 2,000UNI$ refers to the extra 9UNI$ and does not include the normal 1UNI$.(Stop when you notice you earn 3UNI$ (1 + bonus 2) for the last S$5 transaction. ($1110/5)x9=1998UNI$, hence the last S$5 transaction will earn 2 bonus UNI$. The total bonus UNI$ awarded to you from qualifying spend on Selected Online Transactions and Mobile Contactless Transactions is capped at UNI$2,000 for each calendar month. THE CAP IS ON THE 9 UNI$ BONUS NOT 10UNI$ TOTAL YOU GET WITH BASE OF U$1 PER $ SPEND
Keep in mind that some merchants offer different, non-mileage accruing awards with UOB cards which are called SMART$. Some popular merchants include Cold Storage, Guardian and Giant Supermarket, ToastBox and Starbucks. A full list of merchants where Mobile contactless transactions will NOT earn miles can be found here: http://www.uob.com.sg/personal/cards...smartclub.html
Requirements: min. income $30,000 ($60,000 for foreigners).
Cost: First year free, then $192.60 for main and $96.30 for supplementary. Annual fee waived off easily.
Miles conversion fee: $25 per conversion, in blocks of 5000 UNI$=10,000 miles. UNI$ are combined in 1 cardholder's name for all UOB cards.
Pros: Incredible mileage accrual rates for Paywave transactions (not all merchants - some give SMART$ instead which are different rewards!) as well as internet transactions (some restrictions apply).
Cons: Points allocated on every $5 spent, rounded down to next $5. Transfer in blocks of 5000 UNI$ points = 10,000 miles. Points are valid for 2 years (transfer before expiry and they will subsequently be valid for a further 3 years from the date of transfer to KrisFlyer).
3. Citi PremierMiles MasterCard
https://www.citibank.com.sg/credit-cards/travel/premiermiles-card/?ecid=PSGONSGCCAENPM
Mileage accrual: Earn 1.2 miles for every $1 spent. Earn 2 miles for every $1 spent OVERSEAS. 10,000 bonus miles for each annual membership renewal.
Requirements: min. income $50,000 for VISA. Principal cardholder must be at least 21 years of age.
Cost: First year free, then $192.60 for VISA main, supplementary always free. Annual fee waiver available in exchange for forfeiting the 10,000renewal bonus.
Miles conversion fee: $25 per conversion.
Pros: Decent all-rounder, good for overseas spend. Points never expire. Bonus miles for annual card renewal. 11 frequent flyer programs & 3 hotel programs to choose from, including EVA Air - only 25,000 miles for 1 way Business Class within Asia!!
Cons: No miles awarded for EZ-Link & Transitlink transactions. Miles awarded per S$1. Cents not included. 1.2 miles/S$1. Transfer in blocks of 10,000 miles.
4. DBS Altitude VISA/AMEX
http://www.dbs.com/sg/personal/cards...e/default.aspx
http://www.dbs.com/sg/personal/cards...e/default.aspx
Mileage accrual: Earn 1.2 miles for every $1 spent (every $5 gives 3 DBS points which equal 6 miles). Earn 2 miles for every $1 spent OVERSEAS.
Requirements: min. income $80,000.
Cost: First year free, then $180 for main and $90 for supplementary. Annual fee waiver if you charge $25,000 or more in a year.
Miles conversion fee: S$26.75 per transfer, redeem 1700 DBS points to waive off.
Pros: Points never expire. No rounding down transaction amount to nearest $5 (calculation is done as follows: DBS points = 'transaction amount' divided by 5, multiply by 3, after that round down to nearest whole number. Minimum spend is S$1.67. Each DBS point = 2 miles). Earn 3 miles per S$1 spent on all online Flight and Hotel transactions (capped at S$5,000 per month). 10,000 miles renewal bonus if you have to pay card renewal fees.
Cons: All local spend now down to 1.2 miles/$ (since Dec 1, 2013). AMEX not always accepted by merchants. Transfer in blocks of 5000 DBS points = 10,000 miles (on the plus side points don't expire). Per transfer of S$26.75, redeem 1700 DBS points to waive off.
5. Maybank Horizon Platinum Visa
http://info.maybank2u.com.sg/persona...visa-card.aspx
Earn 3.2 air miles (8X TREATS Points) with every dollar spent on dining, petrol, taxi fares and hotel bookings at Agoda.com/horizon
Earn 2 air miles (5X TREATS Points) with every dollar spent on air tickets, travel packages and foreign currency transactions, with a minimal S$300 in a calendar month
Earn 0.4 mile for every $1 spent elsewhere (1 mile for every $2.50 spent).
Requirements: min. income $30,000 ($80,000 for foreigners).
Cost: $150 for main, supplementary always free. Unsure of any annual fee waiver conditions.
Miles conversion fee: In blocks of 5,000 points to 2000 Asia Miles or KrisFlyer. S$26.75 fee applies.
Pros: Great for ticket purchases and overseas spend. Complimentary access to selected VIP airport lounges when you charge a minimum of S$400 in a single transaction on air tickets or travel packages to your Card 3 months prior to the date of travel.
Cons: Great ONLY for ticket purchases and overseas spend. Points are valid for 1 year only, expire either on 30 June or 31 December of the same year if not Rewards Infinite member.
6. Singapore Airlines KrisFlyer Ascend AMEX
https://www.americanexpress.com/sg/s...nd-credit-card
Mileage accrual: Earn 1.2 KrisFlyer miles for every S$1 spent on all your eligible purchases with your Card
Earn 2 KrisFlyer miles for every S$1 equivalent in foreign currency spent overseas on eligible purchases during June and December
Requirements: min. income $50,000 ($60,000 for foreigners). Principal cardholder must be over 21 years of age.
Cost: First year free, otherwise $256.80 for main, 2 supplementary cards always free (more available at $80.25 each). Annual fee cannot be waived unless you spend alot.
Miles conversion fee: None - your KrisFlyer miles are transferred to your account directly with no conversion fees or charges.
Pros: None, except for welcome offers (4 complimentary airport lounge access vouchers, one complimentary night with Millennium Hotels and Resorts).
Cons: Simply nothing special - there are better cards available for all types of purchases, including flight tickets, even with all of the bonuses above applied. AMEX not always accepted by merchants.
7. Citibank Rewards Card
http://www.citibank.com.sg/gcb/credi...CACRENCCHOCALM
Earn 10X Rewards (10 Rewards Points or 4 Miles for every S$1 spent) when you shop for clothes, bags and shoes or at departmental stores or online shopping websites, including SingTel & M1 online bill payment!
Pros: Transfer to 11 FFPs & 3 Hotel programs in blocks of 25,000 points=10,000 miles; S$25 fee.
Cons: Points awarded per S$1 spend. Cents not included. Cannot combined Thank You Points across cards.
8. DBS Woman's World MasterCard® Card
http://www.dbs.com.sg/personal/cards...astercard-card
10X Rewards for Online Retail Purchases
T&C Here: https://www.dbs.com.sg/iwov-resource...s_card_tnc.pdf
Pros: Men also can get this card!! DBS points are combined in 1 cardholder's name. No rounding down transaction amount to nearest $5 (calculation is done as follows: DBS points = 'transaction amount' divided by 5, multiply by 10, after that round down to nearest whole number. Minimum spend is S$1. Each DBS point = 2 miles).
Cons: DBS points are valid for 1 year based on card anniversary date. The additional 9X DBS Points for online retail spend in a calendar month will be awarded on the 16th of the next calendar month. If the above days are not working days, the Points will be awarded on the next working day. The additional 9X DBS Points are only applicable to the first S$2,000 online retail spend every calendar month.
9. OCBC Titanium Rewards Card
https://www.ocbc.com/personal-bankin...astercard.html
10x OCBC$ on your shopping Local & Overseas Shopping Transactions, Local & Overseas Department Store Transactions and Local & Overseas Online Transactions.
The remaining 9 OCBC$ will be posted to the Card Account by the end of the next calendar month
https://www.ocbc.com/assets/pdf/card...ons.pdf?rand=1
10,000 KrisFlyer miles requires OCBC$ 25000, For each conversion of OCBC$ to KrisFlyer miles a fee of S$25 will be charged
10. UOB Lady's Card
https://www.uob.com.sg/personal/card...ard/index.page
============
The 'Best credit cards for KF miles accrual' master thread
May 27, 2013, 1:00 am
#1592
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Singapore
Programs: BW Diamond, SPG Gold, HHonors Gold, Priority Club Plat Ambassador, Club Carlson Gold, M&C Gold
Posts: 313
May 27, 2013, 1:54 am
#1593
Join Date: Aug 2012
Programs: KF G, UA 1K, SPG P, Marriott P, Hilton G, Wyndham G
Posts: 122
I once used Maybank horizon visa in HK and got DCC-ed, called Maybank and was able to get back he extra points, but they can do nothing about changing that payment to HKD instead of SGD.
May 27, 2013, 1:55 am
#1594
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: SIN
Programs: TK-G | Accor P | SQ-G | Marriott T
Posts: 3,828
Wow thanks for the long reply percysmith. I hate the way they do it in HK/CN. In BKK, the first think is the conversion rate, then the merchant will normally show you this small slip and ask if you want to pay in which currency.
Few occasion when I was in HKG (the last is HKG Duty free), they asked me which currency and I told her HKD, and the terminal slip show in HKG
Actually I still do not understand it for those carbonize copy, so what if I select the HKG/RMB(CNY) here? the transaction has already done right? so does it matter of what I thick?
Why Visa/MC allow this? I think the one they do it in BKK is better.
I do remember the transaction in FOTRESS is using the carbonize copy and I kind of remember that I selected HKD and the SMS came in SGD and I believe the amount is what stated as SGD amount.
What happen if I do not have the slip anymore (i.e. lost)? There are quite of number of transactions. Will it worth to dispute it one by one?
This will take long time for the reversal right?
Some of the FTers frequently travelling to/based in PRC have taken extraordinary steps to reverse engineer the cursed DCC terminals, with the help of sympathetic merchants.
But the PRC banks have all but deleted the cancel button and in recent cases have deleted the void button as well (St Regis Shenchen Decanter Bar).
With thermal terminals, the terminal is meant to stop for merchant to make a selection before printing the cardholder copy (this is the case in Australia and Taiwan). In the PRC, the non-compliant terminals will print both copies together, without waiting for your selection. If that happens, you've been DCCed, and should seek to cancel or void the selection per below:
Getting out of DCC (PRC and HK DCC in particular):
1. Ask merchant to void the transaction and re-run with DCC declined
2. Void the transaction and pay by alternate means (AE will be great here - AE cannot be DCCed - one of big big advantages of using AE overseas)
3. (If the merchant says voiding is impossible or requires a 30-minute call like St Regis Shenzhen) Make the currency selection, sign the slip, *photo* the slip with your smartphone and send the photo to your card issuer with the Reason 76 Chargeback request when the inevitable SGD charge gets posted.
Why Visa/MC allows this to happen? Shouldn't Visa/MC make a rule for offering DCC? Well I did choose the RMB, the case in PEK airport. When they told me they had charged me in SGD and they need to make a phone call to reversed it.
They asked me to change the slip choices to SGD, and I notice the slip has a rubbish statement that I have been given a choices.
Few occasion when I was in HKG (the last is HKG Duty free), they asked me which currency and I told her HKD, and the terminal slip show in HKG
Actually I still do not understand it for those carbonize copy, so what if I select the HKG/RMB(CNY) here? the transaction has already done right? so does it matter of what I thick?
Why Visa/MC allow this? I think the one they do it in BKK is better.
If the Citi SMS SGD amount matches the SGD amount on your slip, the Hong Kong merchant has applied Dynamic Currency Conversion against your wishes (set to default). This is non-compliant and you should raise a Reason Code 76 Chargeback request with Citi Singapore once the amount posts.
http://usa.visa.com/download/merchan...n.pdf#page=928
Fill in this: http://www.citibank.com.sg/global_do...isputeform.pdf .
I think you have to fill in others: "Billing currency not valid - HKDxxx.xx indicated in card slip but SGDyyy.yy charged by merchant by way of Chargeback Reason Code 76 per VIOR".
Do you happen to have a carbon copy of the slip? If yes, attach and your case should be slam dunk.
http://usa.visa.com/download/merchan...n.pdf#page=928
Fill in this: http://www.citibank.com.sg/global_do...isputeform.pdf .
I think you have to fill in others: "Billing currency not valid - HKDxxx.xx indicated in card slip but SGDyyy.yy charged by merchant by way of Chargeback Reason Code 76 per VIOR".
Do you happen to have a carbon copy of the slip? If yes, attach and your case should be slam dunk.
What happen if I do not have the slip anymore (i.e. lost)? There are quite of number of transactions. Will it worth to dispute it one by one?
Some of the FTers frequently travelling to/based in PRC have taken extraordinary steps to reverse engineer the cursed DCC terminals, with the help of sympathetic merchants.
But the PRC banks have all but deleted the cancel button and in recent cases have deleted the void button as well (St Regis Shenchen Decanter Bar).
With thermal terminals, the terminal is meant to stop for merchant to make a selection before printing the cardholder copy (this is the case in Australia and Taiwan). In the PRC, the non-compliant terminals will print both copies together, without waiting for your selection. If that happens, you've been DCCed, and should seek to cancel or void the selection per below:
Getting out of DCC (PRC and HK DCC in particular):
1. Ask merchant to void the transaction and re-run with DCC declined
2. Void the transaction and pay by alternate means (AE will be great here - AE cannot be DCCed - one of big big advantages of using AE overseas)
3. (If the merchant says voiding is impossible or requires a 30-minute call like St Regis Shenzhen) Make the currency selection, sign the slip, *photo* the slip with your smartphone and send the photo to your card issuer with the Reason 76 Chargeback request when the inevitable SGD charge gets posted.
They asked me to change the slip choices to SGD, and I notice the slip has a rubbish statement that I have been given a choices.
Last edited by lingua101; May 27, 2013 at 2:11 am Reason: add pictures
May 27, 2013, 1:55 am
#1595
Join Date: Aug 2012
Programs: KF G, UA 1K, SPG P, Marriott P, Hilton G, Wyndham G
Posts: 122
May 27, 2013, 2:19 am
#1596
Ambassador, Hong Kong and Macau
Join Date: May 2009
Location: HKG
Programs: Non-top tier Asia Miles member
Posts: 19,795
Mail them a written request for chargeback with VIOR Reason Code 76 and DCC receipt requirements attached as justification why they must do something.
May 27, 2013, 3:09 am
#1597
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: SIN
Programs: TK-G | Accor P | SQ-G | Marriott T
Posts: 3,828
actually I do not care much about the exchange rate. what I do care is I do not get the double points if it is charged in SGD
May 27, 2013, 3:45 am
#1598
Ambassador, Hong Kong and Macau
Join Date: May 2009
Location: HKG
Programs: Non-top tier Asia Miles member
Posts: 19,795
Westin Macau has carbon slip, with DCC offer, but charges local currency on request
Depends whether terminal stops to take a selection from cashier or not (Westin Macau: yes).
Not like thermal terminals where if you get cardholder slips, you know you've been fxcked.
Well the seperate slip requirement (which I've seen in both Thailand (Siam Commercial Bank, Sheraton Hua Hin) and Taiwan (Taiwan Cooperative Bank)) is not mandatory.
In Harrods and Lotte Duty Free Seoul (#23), the rate will simply show up on the till.
Or it can appear on the carbon or thermal slip (provided only the merchant bill has been generated but not the cardholder bill with the finalised choice) and you tick. The merhant cashier makes a choice in the terminal (like a tip adjustment) based on what you've ticked [this is only if the terminal is complliant; if it is not as in the case of Fortress/St. Regis Shenzhen etc then the card has already been held in SGD(you)/HKD(me)]
You might need to apply some sort of materiality...pick your fights
Plus, when you don't have the copy of the slip, you are on the back foot...
I'm not sure how consumer-friendly are Singaporean banks, but with HK banks if you don't have a slam dunk case that will get them into trouble with the next level up (HKMA) if they do nothing, they'd be seriously inclined to do nothing.
BTW - re Citi - I've been exchanging MSN messages with a friend of the SO who got overcharged (not DCC) by a Hilton in Europe (taxes were added when hotel reservation confirmation did not mention), Citi HK wants to charge HK$50 for any chargeback regardless of whether the complaint is ultimately successful or not!
I called up Citi myself to double check and they said "well, your friend can apply for a waiver if the chargeback is ultimately successful". I never disputed a charge with Citi (I do my best to avoid using it - when the earn rate is equal to another card the other card gets used).
Same for Citi SG?
Two and a half months if done properly (i.e. the DCC bank and merchant are made to hurt):
Complaint date: 27 January 2012
Completion of chargeback date: 12 April 2012
They just can't enforce it in Mainland China cos 1. the State hates Visa 2. the State controls the banks and 3. the state is promoting a competing card payment network.
Call it another symptom of an overbearing, emerging China. I suppose you guys in SG are also getting pushed out by the "PRC" emigrating to Singapore too right?
They asked me to change the slip choices to SGD, and I notice the slip has a rubbish statement that I have been given a choices.
Saw your slip - a 4% markup over Visa rate!
What's your Citi Singapore Foreign Currency Transaction fee again? 2.5% right?
Plus the overseas earn miles, of course - that's why FTers are the most fanatical DCC jihadists...
Last edited by percysmith; May 27, 2013 at 3:53 am
May 27, 2013, 4:31 am
#1599
Ambassador, Hong Kong and Macau
Join Date: May 2009
Location: HKG
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P.S. sanitised versions of my DCC complaint for your reference:
http://www.sendspace.com/file/kkq9ec
http://www.scribd.com/doc/143923335/...rgeback-Form-1
http://www.sendspace.com/file/kkq9ec
http://www.scribd.com/doc/143923335/...rgeback-Form-1
May 27, 2013, 4:40 am
#1600
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: SIN
Programs: TK-G | Accor P | SQ-G | Marriott T
Posts: 3,828
percysmith, thanks for the long reply again.
I am not sure what do you mean by
Well I can "tolerate" more if this is happen in China, but not HKG. HKG is an international financial centre and they should do thing in international standard.
Those of transactions have not showed up as the final charge into my account. So it may be just the SMS issue with Citi. I know Citi sms notification has issued when the transaction got amended.
I withdrawn money in Citi Beijing. I keyed in 5000 RMB instead of 500. So when it showed me the amount in SGD, I cancelled it and changed to 500. But the SMS alert that I received show 5000, which later on I checked in my account. They deduct 5000 RMB and do reversal of the same amount and then the correct transaction is posted.
But the SMS alert is not "smart" enough.
so I have to wait until it got posted.
For Beijing case, I will forgone as it is with HSBC and I sicked and tired dealing with HSBC. I am probably in the "hate" list there!!!
I am not sure what do you mean by
Never expect anything good out of Mr. Victor Li http://www.hongkongcard.com/forum/fo...p?id=8690&p=40 #391. Chargeback his axs
Those of transactions have not showed up as the final charge into my account. So it may be just the SMS issue with Citi. I know Citi sms notification has issued when the transaction got amended.
I withdrawn money in Citi Beijing. I keyed in 5000 RMB instead of 500. So when it showed me the amount in SGD, I cancelled it and changed to 500. But the SMS alert that I received show 5000, which later on I checked in my account. They deduct 5000 RMB and do reversal of the same amount and then the correct transaction is posted.
But the SMS alert is not "smart" enough.
so I have to wait until it got posted.
For Beijing case, I will forgone as it is with HSBC and I sicked and tired dealing with HSBC. I am probably in the "hate" list there!!!
May 27, 2013, 4:46 am
#1601
Join Date: May 2004
Location: SIN (LEJ once a year)
Programs: SQ, LH, BA, IHG Diamond AMB, HH Gold, SLH Indulged, Accor Gold, Hyatt Discoverist
Posts: 7,735
I want to ask about overseas transaction. I just came back from hkd. In the slip they have 2 choices of currencies which i can thicked (hkd or sgd). my question, does it matter what i thicked?
i thicjed hkd but I got sms from citibank the transaction is in sgd.
same problem in beijing dfs, they simply assumed that i want to be charged in sgd, when i told them i want rmb, they said they have to call to make reversal. this is very bad. why they always assume i want to pay in sgd, which means i will lose double points
i thicjed hkd but I got sms from citibank the transaction is in sgd.
same problem in beijing dfs, they simply assumed that i want to be charged in sgd, when i told them i want rmb, they said they have to call to make reversal. this is very bad. why they always assume i want to pay in sgd, which means i will lose double points
May 27, 2013, 5:30 am
#1602
Join Date: May 2012
Location: SIN
Programs: JL GC | Marriott LT Silver | Global Entry | SQ Silver
Posts: 6,819
That's why it's suggested to carry an Amex card as a backup. Sometimes when you're pushed into a corner or getting nowhere, you gotta pull out your Amex card.
I'm exclusively using Amex or Cash in China nowadays.
I'm exclusively using Amex or Cash in China nowadays.
May 27, 2013, 5:46 am
#1603
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 143
My rule is to always use Amex in China. The only exception would be hotel charges in an international chain. Even if DCC is applied, you can always write back and have them reverse it and sort it out.
With regards to the previous question about Singapore banks, don't expect them to do much wrt DCC reversals. I have been told by at least 3 banks that there is nothing they can do about it, and while you are welcome to dispute the charges, the possibility of success is extremely low.
With regards to the previous question about Singapore banks, don't expect them to do much wrt DCC reversals. I have been told by at least 3 banks that there is nothing they can do about it, and while you are welcome to dispute the charges, the possibility of success is extremely low.
May 27, 2013, 6:52 am
#1604
Ambassador, Hong Kong and Macau
Join Date: May 2009
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Surprising Fortress is doing it though. I wanted to tell you the general acquirer for AS Watsons group including Fortress is DBS *but* I've just been told Fortress (as well as its largest rival, Broadway Electronics) uses multiple acquirers for Visa/MC - Fortress as well as Broadway are large enough to have multiple banks' card terminals behind their sales counters and they try to match cards with their issuer banks to minimise interchange fees. So *I cannot say with certainty that DBS acquired your DCC slip*.
In HK merchants don't have to identify their acquirers (in PRC and Taiwan they do or we can figure it out anyway) (but I don't think Singapore merchants have to either). There is no way to make a complaint directly against the acquirer.
Those of transactions have not showed up as the final charge into my account. So it may be just the SMS issue with Citi. I know Citi sms notification has issued when the transaction got amended.
I withdrawn money in Citi Beijing. I keyed in 5000 RMB instead of 500. So when it showed me the amount in SGD, I cancelled it and changed to 500. But the SMS alert that I received show 5000, which later on I checked in my account. They deduct 5000 RMB and do reversal of the same amount and then the correct transaction is posted.
But the SMS alert is not "smart" enough.
so I have to wait until it got posted.
I withdrawn money in Citi Beijing. I keyed in 5000 RMB instead of 500. So when it showed me the amount in SGD, I cancelled it and changed to 500. But the SMS alert that I received show 5000, which later on I checked in my account. They deduct 5000 RMB and do reversal of the same amount and then the correct transaction is posted.
But the SMS alert is not "smart" enough.
so I have to wait until it got posted.
But in general, if the SMS amount matches the SGD amount of the DCC you've been DCCed - see my Dongguan Golf Club card slip. Time to start asking for the slip to be voided (hopefully it won't take 30 minutes).
But, they aren't the acquirer in your case (the no. 1 practitioner is - Bank of Cheapasses). And in HK, HSBC is one of the more consumer friendly banks in my view.
Correction 2:34AM: I received another PM that says Fortress is most likely DBS HK (DBS Bank (Hong Kong) Limited) as acquirer - the other terminals are for instalment payments only, or to facilitate redemption programmes on other cards. Therefore, your chargeback complaint, once completed, can be forwarded to:
Visa HK: http://www.hongkongcard.com/forum/fo...ow.php?id=5021
Visa Hong Kong Limited
Suite 1113-1119, Two Pacific Place, 88 Queensway, Central, Hong Kong
-and-
HKMA: http://www.hkma.gov.hk/eng/key-funct...eaflet_b.shtml
for further action on their systematic error (defaulting to DCC charging, which is against the DCC requirements in the VIOR).
I know we are becoming a Mainland city, but I hate to think we are one already. Please prove me correct.
Last edited by percysmith; May 27, 2013 at 12:40 pm
May 27, 2013, 7:25 am
#1605
Ambassador, Hong Kong and Macau
Join Date: May 2009
Location: HKG
Programs: Non-top tier Asia Miles member
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Mine too but it's increasingly difficult to find places to take them (I tried to have Shenzhen restaruants take Visa (if they don't take Visa what are AE's chances?))!
The standard HK retort to PRC DCC is "FORGET ALL THE TROUBLE, DO WHAT THEY WANT AND TAKE OUT YOUR UNIONPAY!". But, even the best Unionpay earns five to ten times less miles than a Visa/Mastercard on promo, the people who say that are obviously Hongkies and not FTers.
Actually this is the place where I'd really expect DCC...even though by and large I've managed to opt-out of it (with some effort).
I hate to think HK banks are better than Singapore banks in customer service...don't they do chargebacks which is a cardholder's clear right per the VIOR?
The standard HK retort to PRC DCC is "FORGET ALL THE TROUBLE, DO WHAT THEY WANT AND TAKE OUT YOUR UNIONPAY!". But, even the best Unionpay earns five to ten times less miles than a Visa/Mastercard on promo, the people who say that are obviously Hongkies and not FTers.
With regards to the previous question about Singapore banks, don't expect them to do much wrt DCC reversals. I have been told by at least 3 banks that there is nothing they can do about it, and while you are welcome to dispute the charges, the possibility of success is extremely low.