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Another Fight won against Krisflyer Centre....

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Another Fight won against Krisflyer Centre....

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Old Feb 25, 2006, 4:06 am
  #1  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: 7th planet on your right
Programs: BA[G], SQ[G], TK[G], DL[PM], EY[G], AF[S], IC[Amb], HH[G]
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Another Fight won against Krisflyer Centre....

Aftrer 2 weeks fighting hard i won the battle and i got my miles revert from PPS account to M&M account.

It's always the same story... their system does not work properly, then you ask to your PPS co-ordinator to ask for a miles revert.... KF refuses to do that and you have to send them an e-mail threating them harshly...



Originally Posted by message by italian pps coordinator to KF Centre
-----Original Message-----
From: XXX
Sent: Thursday, 9 February 2006 7:54 PM
To: sqstations
Subject: KF 800******* G*******/**** Mr

Hi,
Abv psgr is requesting to transfer his mileage for flt:
SQ11 LAXSIN P 18Jan06
to his LH account 2220*********** and at the same time retain status for requalification on SQ.
As yu can see fm his HATD enquiry all his flts were credited to LH only this one is missing.
Many thks coop, brgds

Originally Posted by Answer to italian pps coordinator

sqstations <[email protected]>
13-Feb-2006 01:54 AM
Sender Info:
No Sender Info found in the address Book

To: "'xxxx'"
Subject: RE: KF 800******* G*******/**** Mr



Hi ********,

Flight manifest shows that member's KF account number was quoted in the booking, and upon check-in. Hence, we regret to inform that we are unable to accede to mbr's request.
SQ11 18 Jan 2005 LAXSIN
Best Regards,
G***
KrisFlyer Membership Services
Originally Posted by My e-mail (i'm a very nasty boy... a real PITA this time!!)

Sender:
Luca ************ ***** **********
*** ********* ***
20100 Milano
Italy



To:
Krisflyer Membership Services
CC:
**** ****
c/o Singapore Airlines Rome

CC:
Singapore Airlines Rome

CC:
Singapore Airlines Los Angeles Airport Office
c/o Los Angeles Airport

CC:
Singapore Airlines Tokyo Narita Airport Office
c/o Tokyo Narita Airport
Japan

Milan, 20/02/06

Dear Sirs,
I'm a PPS member within KrisFlyer Program and I'm writing to you so that you could help me to solve a bad miles crediting procedure.
Firstly, I have to say that before writing this e-mail I contacted by phone Singapore Airlines offices in Rome (so that I could explain all the matter in my first language) and I found great co-operation by Mrs. *** **** who really tried to help me and make me feel a valued customer for SQ.
She wrote to KF centre in Singapore asking for a miles revert but the answer she received and forwarded to me has been absolutely NOT SATISFYING.

During the month of January 2006 I travelled a lot with SQ : CMB-SIN-xHKG-SFO / LAX-xNRT-SIN-CMB.
All these legs were in FIRST CLASS.
At the time of booking, I gave my PPS number in order to clear the waitlist on the SIN-CMB leg. Due to my previous experiences with “double dip” option and upon a specific suggestion by SQ clerks in Singapore, I didn’t provide my LH FFP number.
Everytime I checked-in for any of these flights, I provided both my KF PPS card AND my lufthansa Miles&More Senator Card, ASKING - WITHOUT ANY POSSIBLE MISUNDERSTANDING - to GET THE MILEAGE on Lufthansa Miles&more senator card, AND ONLY THE PPS MILES/SECTOR on my PPS KF Card.
This worked PERFECTLY in COLOMBO and IN SINGAPORE 2 times, probably because THEY PERFECTLY KNOW WHICH ARE THE PROCEDURES TO FILL IN two different FFP numbers in the same PNR (FQTS & FQTV).

I CANNOT SAY THE SAME FOR LOS ANGELES. When I arrived at Tom Bradley Int’l Airport on 18th JAN, I checked-in for my SQ11 flight (local time was 12.05PM) at First Class desk. I provided my passport together with both MY PPS KF CARD and My LH Miles&more Senator Card and I told to the SQ STAFF (not 1, but 2 persons!) to credit MILEAGE ON LH and PPS SECTOR on KF. I was travelling together with a friend of mine, and he was a witness of the facts. When we cleared immigration, we reached the SQ lounge and, looking at our boarding passes, we noticed that the LH number (usually it is quoted regularly on the boarding pass together with PPS number after a pax requests the double dip option) was missing.
SO I ASKED TO THE SQ LOUNGE STAFF IN L.A. TO CHECK IF MY LUFTHANSA MILES & MORE NUMBER was LOADED IN THE PNR. She answered the staff at check-in FORGOT to fill it in (by the way, we paid a lot of money… so even little forgetfulness/omission are not welcome!!!) but this could be done by her.
Due to some technical problems (systems shut down) she was not able to do this immediately but she granted us this would have been done as soon as possible. We could not remain in the lounge since SQ 11 was completing the boarding.
While WE WERE SEATED ON BOARD in our seat on B744 before push back, the SQ lounge lady we talked to in the lounge reached and approached us and SHE TOLD US EVERYTHING WAS SOLVED AND LUFTHANSA MILES & MORE NUMBER WAS LOADED NOW.

Once we landed in Tokyo Narita (due to en-route stopover), we proceeded to the lounge and, there, I ASKED to the SQ STAFF to check if my lufthansa MILES & MORE Number was loaded on my PNR. The SQ lady was really helpful and she printed me my PNR, WHERE, BEYOND ANY DOUBT, there was WRITTEN BOTH MY FFP NUMBERS, so IT SEEMS CLEAR THAT I DID EVERYTHING WAS NECESSARY TO GET THE DOUBLE DIP OPTION.

I attach to the present e-mail, the printout I got in Tokyo Narita.

Finally, some personal remarks:

1) Every time I fly SQ I ask for the double dip option, crediting the mileage on LH. You can verify this fact by checking my SQ account.
2) During THIS JOURNEY, my request worked correctly 3 times out of 4… WHY SHOULD I HAD TO REQUEST A DIFFERENT CREDITING OPTION ONLY FOR THIS LEG? Would it be a logic process? Could it be a problem generated in your system?
3) It’s not the first time this problem happens. I think that staff should be trained better in order to avoid these difficulties, don’t you think?
4) May I be RESPONSIBLE if SQ STAFF IS NOT ABLE TO SET THE DOUBLE DIP OPTION????
5) Italian office was really helpful and friendly. I explained them the matter and they did their best to help me, but they got an answer that seems AT MINIMUM disheartening. You can find attached the message history. Why didn’t KF office in Singapore consider that SOMETIMES the GUILTY IS NOT THE PASSENGER????
6) Mr. G*** (the man who answered Mrs. ******** by e-mail) said “Flight manifest shows that member's KF account number was quoted in the booking, and upon check-in.”. I HAVE ONLY ONE QUESTION: IF THIS IS TRUE ( and, naturally, I believe him) HOW IS IT POSSIBLE TOKYO NARITA LOUNGE STAFF WAS ABLE TO PRINT OUT AND GIVE ME A PAPER SHOWING BOTH MY LH NUMBER AND MY PPS NUMBER? DID THEY WRITE IT JUST TO MAKE ME HAPPY? DID THEY MAKE IT OUT?
7) “Flight manifest shows that member's KF account number was quoted in the booking, and upon check-in.”: MY PPS NUMBER WAS OBVIOUSLY QUOTED IN THE BOOKING SINCE I WANTED MY PPS SECTORS! Is it a crime? Is it against the law? Could not this be quoted in the booking together with LH??? Usually it is quoted together and everything works correctly.
8) I’m really concerned about Mr. G***’s answer because one thing is proved: NO ONE AT KRISFLYER COMPLETED ALL THE CHECKS NEEDED TO VERIFY THE SITUATION.
9) I suppose you can easily retrieve SQ staff working on that days both in LAX and in NRT. Why don’t you try to DOUBLECHECK FACTS before????
LAX: 18th JAN 2006 – 12.00 /13.00 (check-in staff AND lounge staff)
NRT: 19th JAN 2006 – 17.50 / 19.00 (lounge staff)
10) I encountered the same problems in Feb2005 where PPS sectors for a code-sharing flight YVR-SFO were missed. The same happened for a SQ flight HKG-SIN where mileage was erroneously credited. ARE YOU SURE I AM THE ONE AT FAULT?

I’d be pleased if you want to revert my miles, considering the FACTS I mentioned above.
Attached to this message, you’ll find:

- e-mail messages between Mrs. *** *** and KF services
- digital image of paper printout I got in NRT from SQ Lounge staff showing both FFP number were loaded
- digital image of ticket receipt
- digital image of boarding pass fro LAX-SIN flight.

I thank you in advance for this.

Please, let me know if you need other information from my side; you can find here my personal data:

[omissis]

Originally Posted by 'Last Answer by KF Centre'
Dear Mr *** *********

Thank you for your email to KrisFlyer Membership Services received on
21 February 2006.
We sincerely apologise for the delay in this reply.
We are unable to contact you due to the time difference.
We regret the inconvenience you had encountered and extend our
sincere apologies.
We understand that you wish to credit the base miles of the following
flight to your Lufthansa Miles and More account and the PPS miles to
your KrisFlyer account.
SQ11 18 Jan 06 Los Angeles to Singapore First Class
Please confirm once again before we proceed to forward your request
to the relevant department for their action.
Should you require further assistance, please feel free to contact
us.
We thank you for taking the time to write to us and look forward to
welcoming you on board our flights soon.
Yours sincerely,

**** ****
Programme Support
KrisFlyer Membership Services

WHY EVERYTIME SHOULD WE FIGHT TO GET THE CORRECT MILEAGE?????
Luke

Last edited by paffendorf; Feb 25, 2006 at 7:16 am
paffendorf is offline  
Old Feb 25, 2006, 4:19 am
  #2  
 
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Woaw...the f****ng hassle...amazing. If that last message is their final reply I would be even more upset as they haven't answered your questions at all, just corrected your mileage mis-credit. A few bottles of Dom Perignon for treating a F pax like this would be the least you should expect ;-)
Fliar is offline  
Old Feb 25, 2006, 4:23 am
  #3  
 
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Yes, it is a pain that problems with double-dipping occur so frequently. However, I am happy that you didn't give up until you got this (seemingly) sorted out. ^ Love your "PITA" email.
MovieMan is offline  
Old Feb 25, 2006, 5:41 am
  #4  
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
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Posts: 1,484
Paffendorf,

All I can say is good luck and I sincerely hope that it will get sorted. I have had this type of problems late last year and it was exceptionally frustrating with the incompetence of some check-in personnel hwich caused the whole chain of events.

It seems KF's last response is still non-commital but you cannot be clearer than what you have already stated.
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Old Feb 25, 2006, 6:36 am
  #5  
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
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Good on you for sending the PITA email, Luke. The message from KrisFlyer that triggered it was simply unacceptable.

When this gets sorted out, come visit us UK SIN Doers, and we'll celebrate your full victory.
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Old Feb 25, 2006, 8:22 am
  #6  
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Its a well documented case here on flyertalk and im not surprised. shame on SQ.

Nonetheless, its good to know that the op chose to fight this out. Most of us might just give up which i suspect is what krisflyer wants.Maybe it might be best to keep this documentation just in case SQ wants to play hardball on this issue in future.

Usually in similar situations on United and some other airlines, goodwill compensation is offered on several occasions. Im surprised this wasn't offered. And before i get criticised for this post, its a pretty reasonable request.
trekkie is offline  
Old Feb 25, 2006, 8:54 am
  #7  
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
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Programs: SQ PPS Solitaire - BA GGL - AF Plat - LH Senator - EK Gold
Posts: 387
what I have learned from the last few times is just simply to CALL the SINGAPOREAN PPS CC to ask them to enter my m&m number into the system BEFORE I check into the flights..
bchl is offline  
Old Feb 25, 2006, 9:37 am
  #8  
CGK
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Programs: UA MM
Posts: 6,984
Originally Posted by bchl
what I have learned from the last few times is just simply to CALL the SINGAPOREAN PPS CC to ask them to enter my m&m number into the system BEFORE I check into the flights..
You are very lucky then. My PNR with FQTV LH M&M this year, the BP had been printed showing miles to SQ. I suggest for everyone who does double dipping to make sure the BP is correctly printed:

1st line: SQ xxxxxxxxx QPPx
2nd line: LH*G (or just LH for no status)



Note: I am glad paffendorf is back from his break ... ^ Where is the Authentic Italian Ice Cream you promised? Hmm Fauchon is much better eh?
CGK is offline  
Old Feb 25, 2006, 11:36 am
  #9  
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Singapore
Posts: 2,317
From my experience, those of FTers and others, it is clear that KrisFlyer Membership Services is an abomination and the scourge of the SIA Group. Needless to say that in the area of FFP, SIA seems to have lost its way a long time ago.

I encourage FTers to band together!

No, not to fight SIA, but to set up a new KrisFlyer Membership Service Center.

http://www.singaporeair.com/saa/en_U...tactCentre.doc

Thankfully KMS will be replaced by October 2006.
Singapore_Air is offline  
Old Feb 25, 2006, 11:43 am
  #10  
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: DEN
Programs: UA, DL
Posts: 285
Frequent Flyer Programs.... What a hassle...

But I am curious, what is this "double dip" option, and how does it work?
UA9861 is offline  
Old Feb 25, 2006, 11:53 am
  #11  
CGK
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Programs: UA MM
Posts: 6,984
Originally Posted by UA9861
Frequent Flyer Programs.... What a hassle...

But I am curious, what is this "double dip" option, and how does it work?
We are here nice and gentle people here, so we will not say "do a search."
Basically when you fly SQ in C and F, the miles/sectors will be counted towards SQ elite level called PPS (Priority Passenger Service), and you can credit the miles flown to any other StarAlliance FFP. In general, many flyers will put the miles in LH Miles & More because of 2x and 3x redeemable miles. Thus, you will find many SQ PPS members who have the elite status as well in LH M&M, UA MP, AC AP, etc.
For further information, you can browse the sticky on top of this thread list, regarding SQ Q&A.
Enjoy the readings!
CGK is offline  
Old Feb 25, 2006, 12:29 pm
  #12  
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: DEN
Programs: UA, DL
Posts: 285
Originally Posted by CGK
We are here nice and gentle people here, so we will not say "do a search."
Basically when you fly SQ in C and F, the miles/sectors will be counted towards SQ elite level called PPS (Priority Passenger Service), and you can credit the miles flown to any other StarAlliance FFP. In general, many flyers will put the miles in LH Miles & More because of 2x and 3x redeemable miles. Thus, you will find many SQ PPS members who have the elite status as well in LH M&M, UA MP, AC AP, etc.
For further information, you can browse the sticky on top of this thread list, regarding SQ Q&A.
Enjoy the readings!
Thank you for your answer, I guess it doesnt apply to me since I dont have a KrisFlyer account, although I do have a UA MP.
UA9861 is offline  
Old Feb 25, 2006, 12:46 pm
  #13  
CGK
 
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Originally Posted by UA9861
Thank you for your answer, I guess it doesnt apply to me since I dont have a KrisFlyer account, although I do have a UA MP.
If you are travelling on SQ C and F, you can ask SQ to enroll you for the PPS program, which will give you the KF number (or you can do it on-line). So, anytime you fly SQ C/F, SQ will keep track your activities, eventhough you are earning the miles towards your UA MP. Then if you reach 25 PPS sectors (since most PPS qualified based on sectors), you will be SQ QPP1, which will give you Star Gold status. One of benefits would be, when flying SQ C, you can use the SKL F lounge (great if you are passing Changi). An yes, on SQ flight you will get double the allowance for checked bags. Also, one thing that I like, being SQ QPP (*G), when I fly UA domestic, I can use the RCC by showing my UA BP and SQ PPS card. I am sure you know that even when flying UA in C or F, strictly domestic, and you are 1P or 1K, you can not gain entry to RCC unless you pay for RCC membership.
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Old Feb 25, 2006, 12:51 pm
  #14  
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Now I thought that you can pre-programme your PPS card with another FF account - which I did.

When I make a reservation, I never have to quote any FFP as the SQ Kriscom system will automatically apend my PPS number (well when I still was a PPS member) to the reservation. When I call the res department to advise of my LH FFP, I am always told that the number is already there. Which therefore confirmed that the PPS number can store the FFP number of your choice.

I have never shown 2 cards at check in. In fact I only ask if there is a number at check in and they always say yes.. and the boarding pass shows the details CGK stated above.
Guy Betsy is offline  
Old Feb 25, 2006, 12:54 pm
  #15  
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Europe
Posts: 2,341
Originally Posted by Singapore_Air
Thankfully KMS will be replaced by October 2006.
Oooh, I hadn't heard of that. Can you share details?
jjpb3 is offline  


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