Changes to Avios / TP credit for Gold Upgrades via travel agents
Mar 25, 2019, 9:34 am
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Munich, Germany
Programs: LH HON, DL FO/MM, Marriott Lifetime Platinum, Accor Lifetime Platinum, Sixt Diamond
Posts: 6,174
Changes to Avios / TP credit for Gold Upgrades via travel agents
As many of you know, booking a revenue ticket in conjunction with a BA Gold Upgrade voucher had two key advantages:
1) Upgraded cabin booking into revenue inventory (T/I/A) with better availability
2) Credit of Avios / Tier Points based on the upgraded class of service
Apparently BA is in the process of changing the internal procedure to ensure credit is only given based on the paid class of service, and not the upgraded class of service anymore.
I first noticed this today with one of the bookings involving a GUV for one of my travel agency customers, who questioned the reduced amount of Avios when pulling up the booking on ba.com.
The PNR now has SSRs added for each upgraded segment as follows, using the FFTJ keyword:
SSR FFTJ BA HK1 BA12345678......../JI FA/00000000/S1
I had a look at other PNRs from other customers, and it seems like BA staff in BOM is in the process of going through all existing bookings involving a Gold Upgrade Voucher, retroactively adding the keyword to all existing bookings they can catch.
So FFTJ is now not only used to make sure revenue bookings upgraded with Avios / vouchers through BA directly earn credit (rather than showing up as a redemption), FFTJ is now also being used to reduce the credit where upgrades go into higher revenue booking classes.
1) Upgraded cabin booking into revenue inventory (T/I/A) with better availability
2) Credit of Avios / Tier Points based on the upgraded class of service
Apparently BA is in the process of changing the internal procedure to ensure credit is only given based on the paid class of service, and not the upgraded class of service anymore.
I first noticed this today with one of the bookings involving a GUV for one of my travel agency customers, who questioned the reduced amount of Avios when pulling up the booking on ba.com.
The PNR now has SSRs added for each upgraded segment as follows, using the FFTJ keyword:
SSR FFTJ BA HK1 BA12345678......../JI FA/00000000/S1
I had a look at other PNRs from other customers, and it seems like BA staff in BOM is in the process of going through all existing bookings involving a Gold Upgrade Voucher, retroactively adding the keyword to all existing bookings they can catch.
So FFTJ is now not only used to make sure revenue bookings upgraded with Avios / vouchers through BA directly earn credit (rather than showing up as a redemption), FFTJ is now also being used to reduce the credit where upgrades go into higher revenue booking classes.
Mar 25, 2019, 10:49 am
#2
Join Date: Jul 2017
Programs: ExecutiveClub GGL/CCR MileagePlus 1K FLyingBlue GOld
Posts: 231
OMG, is terrible, everybody go and check your bookings because in my case even the legs that are not upgraded, are showing TP's as a lower cabin, I had a segment that I did not upgrade and now it shows as booked in WT+
Mar 25, 2019, 11:13 am
#3
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 7,464
All seems rather petty of BA to retroactively go back to amend existing bookings, but under the current management it is not unsurprising.
There will be a few TAs who will lose some business for this change, since it makes less sense to use a TA if there is reward availability (of course, using a TA to open up revenue availability on a GUF still exists, for now).
There will be a few TAs who will lose some business for this change, since it makes less sense to use a TA if there is reward availability (of course, using a TA to open up revenue availability on a GUF still exists, for now).
Mar 25, 2019, 11:36 am
#6
Ambassador, British Airways; FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Leeds, UK
Programs: BA GGL/CCR, GfL, HH Diamond
Posts: 42,949
Mar 25, 2019, 2:19 pm
#7
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Paynesville, Vic
Programs: BA Gold AVIS Presidents Club
Posts: 356
Hi yes I noticed today that for the first time my GUF has only earned the lowly TPs that the original cabin was booked in WT+ inbound Syd Sin Lhr in my case = 90 +100 instead of J cabin flown (although upgraded to F the gate) 140/160 and of course fewer avios. The outbound leg however booked J and upgraded to F (A) resulted in F (A) TPs and Avios as advertised in F . So in future F (A) it will be then.. no more J business and sliding screens for me! And I was trying soooo hard for a GGL this year...maybe next year .....
OF
OF
Mar 25, 2019, 9:38 pm
#9
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: East Cheam
Programs: QF, BA, VA
Posts: 198
It is not really a benefit though, more like a loophole, that BA has now closed.
As a datapoint I noticed that my points earn at the weekend credited as J instead of the usual F, and the suggested points earn in a booking I made some time ago is now at the original booking rate rather than the upgraded cabin rate. As it happens my travel agent is now on their third attempt to book my regular routing and apply a GUF1. Fingers crossed things haven't changed on that front.
As a datapoint I noticed that my points earn at the weekend credited as J instead of the usual F, and the suggested points earn in a booking I made some time ago is now at the original booking rate rather than the upgraded cabin rate. As it happens my travel agent is now on their third attempt to book my regular routing and apply a GUF1. Fingers crossed things haven't changed on that front.
Mar 25, 2019, 9:45 pm
#10
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Effectively grounded
Programs: BA GGL for a little while longer
Posts: 844
On the one hand, I understand where BA is coming from (even though retro-adjustment does seem rather petty and guaranteed to P people off...)
On the other hand, they havve in practice devalued the GUF by quite a bit, so from now on I simply won't bother spending any extra to obtain them.
Indeed, next year (from 09/03/20) is currently completely unbooked and I doubt I'll be doing any TP runs at all now...
It actually makes sense for me to only fly where I actually want to go 😀
On the other hand, they havve in practice devalued the GUF by quite a bit, so from now on I simply won't bother spending any extra to obtain them.
Indeed, next year (from 09/03/20) is currently completely unbooked and I doubt I'll be doing any TP runs at all now...
It actually makes sense for me to only fly where I actually want to go 😀
Mar 25, 2019, 11:26 pm
#11
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Thailand
Programs: BA Silver (OWS), OZ Diamond (*G), TK Elite (*G), HH Diamond, Marriott Gold
Posts: 361
Darn, this really devalues GUFs in my eyes and probably makes me opt for QR or AY J instead of BA GUFfed F more often for EU-Asia travel at least.
But then again it indeed was a loophole so can’t be mad at BA and luckily it seems they don’t seem to touch bookings with legs already flown on them so my return still seems to be giving me F TPs and Avios. Sadly all upcoming trips after that have indeed be adjusted to J level earning.
But then again it indeed was a loophole so can’t be mad at BA and luckily it seems they don’t seem to touch bookings with legs already flown on them so my return still seems to be giving me F TPs and Avios. Sadly all upcoming trips after that have indeed be adjusted to J level earning.
Mar 25, 2019, 11:41 pm
#12
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Berkshire
Programs: BAEC GGL/CCR/LTG
Posts: 684
I've been caught by this mid trip it seems? Outbound credited at the higher value. Total expected TP in MMB now for the trip implies that I will be on correct TP for the cabin booked rather than the cabin flown. It was nice whilst it lasted.
Mar 26, 2019, 12:24 am
#13
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Kyiv, Ukraine
Programs: Mucci, BA Gold, TK Elite, HHonors Lifetime Diamond
Posts: 7,691
BA is not retroactively adjusting TPs/Avios but simply adding notes to PNRs so that future flights will accrue based on the original cabin (as they should). Nothing's really happening here.
Mar 26, 2019, 12:30 am
#14
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: ±38,000 feet
Programs: LH HON, BA GGL, AF Plat, EK Plat
Posts: 6,428
I find this statement inaccurate at best and misleading at worst.
things are happening, and whilst I believe BA is doing to tps what it intended originally, in other areas, specifically finance, there is a term for implied t&cs where even if rules stipulate otherwise, if the company has been doing something different to greater benefit of customer it can’t just change to align to letter of t&cs (eg on a way it charges credit card interest for months that are not fully paid off)
things are happening, and whilst I believe BA is doing to tps what it intended originally, in other areas, specifically finance, there is a term for implied t&cs where even if rules stipulate otherwise, if the company has been doing something different to greater benefit of customer it can’t just change to align to letter of t&cs (eg on a way it charges credit card interest for months that are not fully paid off)
Mar 26, 2019, 12:36 am
#15
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Kyiv, Ukraine
Programs: Mucci, BA Gold, TK Elite, HHonors Lifetime Diamond
Posts: 7,691
It is neither. We all know how TPs and Avios should be awarded for upgraded flights. Just because sometimes a higher number of TPs/amount of Avios is awarded does not make anyone entitled to that. Nothing is being taken away from BAEC members that they were entitled to before. Comparisons to the world of finance are misplaced here.