7hrs+ delay - Entitled to compensation (EU261/2004)?
Jan 27, 2008, 2:59 pm
#1
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7hrs+ delay - Entitled to compensation (EU261/2004)?
Apologies if this question has been asked before but every case is somewhat different so I wanted to solicit some opinions on what I can reasonably expect.
I just came in on SK976 BKK-ARN (Eco Extra booking SIN-HEL-SIN) and due to delayed departure from BKK we got into ARN around 20:55 which meant I missed my onward connection to CPH at 20:45 and then on to HEL. (Yes it is a strange routing but it was the only way to get into HEL the same night.)
SK initially rebooked me onto some domestic flight to Malmo and then via bus to CPH ignoring that my final destination was actually HEL. I went to a SK transfer desk and asked if this rebooking made sense to them and if it wouldn't be better to accomodate me in ARN and then get me onto ARN-HEL directly as a hotel stay was kind of unavoidable either in ARN or CPH.
They called some supervisor and after some polite "persistence" rebooked me and even arranged for a room at the Radisson SAS SkyCity and an overnight kit. I will now be reaching HEL at 08:40am instead of 1:00am (7hrs ++ delay) and have to get up in the middle of the night instead of getting 8hrs of sleep. Yes I'm whining
.
Do you think this case qualifies for compensation under EU261/2004? I had a quick scan through it and am not quite certain. As the Customer Service desk in ARN only opens at 9am and I'm departing at 6:45am would it be possible for me to go to one in HEL after arriving (if there is one)?
Just to add, at no point was anything volunteered nor was I informed of any passenger rights I have. At the arrival service desk I even had to ask repeadetly for information on the Customer Service department that could possibly deal with any compensation claims. The actual reply I got was "You have a room, what else do you want."
There is no display of EU261/2004 passenger rights and not even a meal voucher and telephone call was offered. I have a hotel booking which could only be cancelled until 6pm today so I will have to pay that one too whether I stayed there or not.
Any advice is appreciated. Thanks ....
I just came in on SK976 BKK-ARN (Eco Extra booking SIN-HEL-SIN) and due to delayed departure from BKK we got into ARN around 20:55 which meant I missed my onward connection to CPH at 20:45 and then on to HEL. (Yes it is a strange routing but it was the only way to get into HEL the same night.)
SK initially rebooked me onto some domestic flight to Malmo and then via bus to CPH ignoring that my final destination was actually HEL. I went to a SK transfer desk and asked if this rebooking made sense to them and if it wouldn't be better to accomodate me in ARN and then get me onto ARN-HEL directly as a hotel stay was kind of unavoidable either in ARN or CPH.
They called some supervisor and after some polite "persistence" rebooked me and even arranged for a room at the Radisson SAS SkyCity and an overnight kit. I will now be reaching HEL at 08:40am instead of 1:00am (7hrs ++ delay) and have to get up in the middle of the night instead of getting 8hrs of sleep. Yes I'm whining
.Do you think this case qualifies for compensation under EU261/2004? I had a quick scan through it and am not quite certain. As the Customer Service desk in ARN only opens at 9am and I'm departing at 6:45am would it be possible for me to go to one in HEL after arriving (if there is one)?
Just to add, at no point was anything volunteered nor was I informed of any passenger rights I have. At the arrival service desk I even had to ask repeadetly for information on the Customer Service department that could possibly deal with any compensation claims. The actual reply I got was "You have a room, what else do you want."
There is no display of EU261/2004 passenger rights and not even a meal voucher and telephone call was offered. I have a hotel booking which could only be cancelled until 6pm today so I will have to pay that one too whether I stayed there or not.
Any advice is appreciated. Thanks ....
Jan 27, 2008, 5:40 pm
#2
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I'm not a lawyer so I might be wrong, but does't the EU rules only applies for intra-European travels, which means your flight which was BKK-HEL (via ARN and HEL) and hence not applies to EU261/2004?
Jan 27, 2008, 7:53 pm
#3
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I'm not a lawyer ... yet (I'll hopefully become a lawyer in a couple of years, if I'm able to finish law school 
), but AFIK EU261/2004 does indeed apply to your BKK-HEL flight.
The above mentioned directive applies to all carriers departing from EU-airports, and all carriers flying to EU destinations, provided that the actual aircraft is registered in the EU.
), but AFIK EU261/2004 does indeed apply to your BKK-HEL flight. The above mentioned directive applies to all carriers departing from EU-airports, and all carriers flying to EU destinations, provided that the actual aircraft is registered in the EU.
Jan 28, 2008, 1:11 am
#4
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I am not a lawyer either, and will probably never be one, but what if the plane flying BKK-ARN happens to be registered in Norway, which is not part of the EU?
Jan 28, 2008, 1:41 am
#5
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Whatever the applicability of the regulation, there is no compensation for delays in this EU regulations.
However, you can claim reimbursement of damages due to delay with some restrictions, as stated in the general conditions of carriage of SAS. Note this is not a compensation, it is just a claim on damages.
And as a side note, SAS intercontinental flights are registered in EU i think => the EU directive should apply. And moreover, I am almost sure it applies in EEA, which includes Norway. If SAS did not pay for any hotel/food/phone, you could claim it as per the regulation however.
However, you can claim reimbursement of damages due to delay with some restrictions, as stated in the general conditions of carriage of SAS. Note this is not a compensation, it is just a claim on damages.
And as a side note, SAS intercontinental flights are registered in EU i think => the EU directive should apply. And moreover, I am almost sure it applies in EEA, which includes Norway. If SAS did not pay for any hotel/food/phone, you could claim it as per the regulation however.
Jan 28, 2008, 2:23 am
#6
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Jan 28, 2008, 2:50 am
#7
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I think the EU really messed this up, in terms of making it easy for passengers to understand their rights. They now have a nice "info portal" about your air passenger rights at http://apr.europa.eu
They even tout their nice new posters and brochures for passengers, explaining their rights.
However, if you read them, nothing is stated clearly. It's text like "if your flight is delayed, you may be entitled to..."
The previous version of this brochure (1-2 years old) was very clear. For example, one of the rules is based on the length of the flight, so if the flight is more than X km and is delayed by more than Y hours, then you are entitled to food compensation and may cancel your booking, etc. I used this more than once to request food compensation during a delay, when the handling agent wasn't aware of the rules, especially as they change once X is larger than a certain number.
They also have nice posters up in TLL, in both English and Estonian listing a toll-free number you can call from anywhere in Europe to inquire about your rights. Of course, this toll-free number doesn't work when in Estonia and calling from an Estonian mobile -- good job EU! I wrote to both Tallinn Airport and the EU Air Transport Commission, and no responses from either in more than a week, of course.
Anyway, the EU has made their passenger portal incredibly difficult for the average person to understand, because they don't clearly state what compensation, when, etc you are entitled to. You're going to have to read the actual directive, which can be found elsewhere on their site.
Hmm, now that I think about it, I have yet to see any page on the EU portal (Europa.eu) that was easy for the average person to navigate. I've found US government websites to be much easier for average people to use.
They even tout their nice new posters and brochures for passengers, explaining their rights.
However, if you read them, nothing is stated clearly. It's text like "if your flight is delayed, you may be entitled to..."
The previous version of this brochure (1-2 years old) was very clear. For example, one of the rules is based on the length of the flight, so if the flight is more than X km and is delayed by more than Y hours, then you are entitled to food compensation and may cancel your booking, etc. I used this more than once to request food compensation during a delay, when the handling agent wasn't aware of the rules, especially as they change once X is larger than a certain number.
They also have nice posters up in TLL, in both English and Estonian listing a toll-free number you can call from anywhere in Europe to inquire about your rights. Of course, this toll-free number doesn't work when in Estonia and calling from an Estonian mobile -- good job EU! I wrote to both Tallinn Airport and the EU Air Transport Commission, and no responses from either in more than a week, of course.
Anyway, the EU has made their passenger portal incredibly difficult for the average person to understand, because they don't clearly state what compensation, when, etc you are entitled to. You're going to have to read the actual directive, which can be found elsewhere on their site.
Hmm, now that I think about it, I have yet to see any page on the EU portal (Europa.eu) that was easy for the average person to navigate. I've found US government websites to be much easier for average people to use.
Jan 28, 2008, 9:54 am
#8
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I'm not a lawyer ... yet (I'll hopefully become a lawyer in a couple of years, if I'm able to finish law school ), but AFIK EU261/2004 does indeed apply to your BKK-HEL flight.
The above mentioned directive applies to all carriers departing from EU-airports, and all carriers flying to EU destinations, provided that the actual aircraft is registered in the EU.
), but AFIK EU261/2004 does indeed apply to your BKK-HEL flight. The above mentioned directive applies to all carriers departing from EU-airports, and all carriers flying to EU destinations, provided that the actual aircraft is registered in the EU.
Doh
I think I'll stick to my business/finance studies
Jan 28, 2008, 11:28 am
#9
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: in a cabin
Posts: 6,515
As with any Airline screwing up they will always try and aviod to compensate you. The key is to not give up.
They did re-route you and offer a night at the Radisson, so they honoured parts of the contract.
You can go ahead and claim for incurred expenses for food and drinks, but 100% you will get a negative back.
I flew on a Sterling flight last summer from CPH in July.
Flight got cancelled and all other carriers where full that day.
Sterling did nothing and left 200 PAX stranded at CPH.
I had a LHR - NYC flight the next day, luckily, so had to fly on the Sunday.
Hilton was only hotel near the airport, and only suites available. Only seats left to London next day was BA J and SK J.
Total cost 8000DKK
After 3 months I managed to claim back 6300DKK.
Initially Sterling would not offer any compensation. They claimed extraordinary circumstances (Technical Problems). However not having enough AC due to Tech. does not fall in that category, so it was a lie.
Cue a few emails back and forth and eventually got most of the money back.
EU Legislation states PAX should be compensated within 7 days.
My advice, keep sending those letters and tell them you will involve your lawyer if needed.
They did re-route you and offer a night at the Radisson, so they honoured parts of the contract.
You can go ahead and claim for incurred expenses for food and drinks, but 100% you will get a negative back.
I flew on a Sterling flight last summer from CPH in July.
Flight got cancelled and all other carriers where full that day.
Sterling did nothing and left 200 PAX stranded at CPH.
I had a LHR - NYC flight the next day, luckily, so had to fly on the Sunday.
Hilton was only hotel near the airport, and only suites available. Only seats left to London next day was BA J and SK J.
Total cost 8000DKK
After 3 months I managed to claim back 6300DKK.
Initially Sterling would not offer any compensation. They claimed extraordinary circumstances (Technical Problems). However not having enough AC due to Tech. does not fall in that category, so it was a lie.
Cue a few emails back and forth and eventually got most of the money back.
EU Legislation states PAX should be compensated within 7 days.
My advice, keep sending those letters and tell them you will involve your lawyer if needed.