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Do you think the new CX CPH-HKG route will hit SK's ARN to HKG severely?

Do you think the new CX CPH-HKG route will hit SK's ARN to HKG severely?

Old Aug 31, 17, 3:18 pm
  #1  
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Do you think the new CX CPH-HKG route will hit SK's ARN to HKG severely?

AFAIK, CX is using A350 = brand new aircraft. SK is using the same old same old A330 and SK Go service is just bad.

The only reasons to fly SK:

1. For those who are already EBD (upgrade perk, membership recognition);
2. Company policy preferring SK over other airlines;
3. *A elite benefits and status miles;
4. Those who based in or need to be in ARN rather than CPH/they need extra segment to re-qualify for EBG/EBD;
5. Someone who loves flying early from HKG ;
6. Price = right now CX is doing "crazy" sale and pushing out special offer - HKD 4650 all in from HKG to CPH. I have seen SK selling it at a much cheaper price especially during now or never.

Wonder if SK is going to do some more crazy sale to compete with CX - SK just had some crazy offer going from HKG to ARN return for something like HKD 3300. I don't mind if they are doing the DKK 2000 ticket to compete with DY.

This route makes me thinking about running for OW as the CX lounges at HKG are really nice.
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Old Aug 31, 17, 6:25 pm
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The new refurbished A330 of SK are fairly nice from a hardware perspective. Though except from the novelty effect of a single flight, I doubt the actual plane is of little concern to most flyers.

I would prefer CX any day over SK. Though I guess connection from Copenhagen will not be very good, unless they strike a deal with SK to deliver connecting flights. So yeah, for CPH based flyers or people going to CPH, great new flight. I might for the novelty if the prices are good test it ex Tokyo. Though I would hate the detour.

Since SK's connections in Hong Kong are not great either, my guess is that these two flights cater to different flyers, and maybe the AY flights are the ones that will suffer more in terms of getting to nd from Copenhagen and Hong Kong.
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Old Aug 31, 17, 11:08 pm
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The aircraft SAS roster on ARN-HKG are actually brand new A330NEO, very nice and new interiors. Certainly not a whole new aircraft model like A350, but I really do not think most people will factor this into the equation.

CX night flights to CPH is good news and a big improvement on the silly early morning SK departures that hog a whole workday and also opens up lots of connections.

However the 3 weekly schedule and so far only seasonal summer schedule is not very business travel friendly.

HKG CX lounges are great and among the best in the world if you hold Oneworld Emerald.

This will probably put SAS margins under more pressure on HKG.
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Old Aug 31, 17, 11:18 pm
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Originally Posted by view View Post
The aircraft SAS roster on ARN-HKG are actually brand new A330NEO, very nice and new interiors. Certainly not a whole new aircraft model like A350, but I really do not think most people will factor this into the equation.

CX night flights to CPH is good news and a big improvement on the silly early morning SK departures that hog a whole workday and also opens up lots of connections.

However the 3 weekly schedule and so far only seasonal summer schedule is not very business travel friendly.

HKG CX lounges are great and among the best in the world if you hold Oneworld Emerald.

This will probably put SAS margins under more pressure on HKG.
Yeah, I just noticed the 3 weekly seasonal part. That's kind of a dampner on the party....
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Old Sep 1, 17, 1:08 am
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It will definitely hit SK - and rightfully so.
HKG is by far the largest unserved destination from CPH -
It is a direct flight - you avoid all the trouble of a connecting flight.
The timing is so much better than SK silly timing.
Very nice connection options to the APAC region

What works in favour of SK is the power of EB, and daily operation vs 3/week - and that for CX CPH is very much a dead-end.

But even as EBD I would favour CX on the HKG route - due to above mentioned elements.

For now it is seasonal - but I would not be surprised to see this going to full year.
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Old Sep 1, 17, 1:12 am
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CX is also not aiming only for the HKG pax but will try to sell onward connections to SE Asia and Oz. This puts them in direct competition to EY/QR who are aiming for the same market. Good luck.
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Old Sep 1, 17, 8:39 am
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Hardly doubt it will have much impact, if I want to fly OW to get to HKG from ARN then I'll use the AY flight most likely. The SK flight timing is really great for people based in ARN because of Stockholm traffic congestion. I don't expect people to opt for an itinerary involving a connection in CPH if there is a direct.

While CX is vastly superior to SK in most ways, a seasonal non-daily route will only attract so much interest and OW travellers I assume are rare in CPH.

It wouldn't surprise me if the AI DEL route hits SK harder than this CX route.
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Old Sep 1, 17, 9:28 am
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Originally Posted by FlyingMoose View Post
Hardly doubt it will have much impact, if I want to fly OW to get to HKG from ARN then I'll use the AY flight most likely. The SK flight timing is really great for people based in ARN because of Stockholm traffic congestion. I don't expect people to opt for an itinerary involving a connection in CPH if there is a direct.

While CX is vastly superior to SK in most ways, a seasonal non-daily route will only attract so much interest and OW travellers I assume are rare in CPH.

It wouldn't surprise me if the AI DEL route hits SK harder than this CX route.
I dont think CX opens this route to capture early risers in Stockholm - but I could of course be wrong.
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Old Sep 2, 17, 2:40 am
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It's important to remember that SK has a hub in ARN, while CX has in HKG. Thus, the SK flight caters to people flying XXX-ARN-HKG, while the CX caters to CPH-HKG-XXX.

SO, I don't believe it will affect people flying ARN-HKG, OSL-ARN-HKG or LHR-ARN-HKG. But it will affect people flying CPH-ARN-HKG, CPH-SIN-SYD, CPH-BKK-DPS, or CPH-DXB-MNL. This will thus mainly be in competition with airlines like TG, SQ, EK and QR out of CPH, and only marginally the SK HKG-ARN route.

Come to think of it, CX also has great connections to places like PEK, PVG and TYO, so it may have some effect on SK's routes from CPH to those destinations.
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Old Sep 2, 17, 6:12 am
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CX has a great connection to down under and various Asian cities. I did fly CX to HKG once with a connection at LHR with BA, wonder if BA will be hit by this though. In theory CX could sell tickets HKG-CPH-HEL or HKG-CPH-LHR etc.

I think they might be doing the 3 times weekly to see if the route is successful (they are doing BRU and DUB at the same time so they might decide to cut one of them and focus on 1 or 2 routes). I saw that there's another airline that wants to do BRU to HKG (a new Belgian airline).

I haven't flown SK business class but for Y, hands down on CX on both catering and service (I know CX has a lot of cutbacks). Haven't tried CX Y+ so can't comment on that either.

I know that SK partner with KA which is now Cathay dragon for routes like CPH-PEK-HKG that Cathay Dragon will be flying PEK-HKG.

CX lounge is nice in HKG and I think the Pier is already very good, and OWS have access to it.
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Old Sep 2, 17, 11:30 am
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CX will open 3 routes

IMO, the damage to SK is minimal.
1. SK 963 964 is actually doing a portion of O&D and large portion of transit passengers, the 3 new destinations has only a small portion of transfer passengers
2. The price of CX is higher, although a better product in their A359. Ex-HKG leisure travellers are price sensitive
3. Connections of CX through HKG is not competing with SK


LH group, gulf carriers and AY are the competitors of CX in these 3 new destinations.
AF/KL group will have a smaller impact as it operates some SE Asia routes
SK will not be affected even though it has a hub in CPH

Last edited by cheung.chunyuenc; Sep 2, 17 at 12:32 pm
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Old Sep 2, 17, 12:28 pm
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Originally Posted by nacho View Post
CX has a great connection to down under and various Asian cities. I did fly CX to HKG once with a connection at LHR with BA, wonder if BA will be hit by this though. In theory CX could sell tickets HKG-CPH-HEL or HKG-CPH-LHR etc.
HKG-CPH-HEL, yes possible
HKG-CPH-LHR, less likely as CX sell HKG-LHR directly and have a high yield. 4 daily HKG-LHR and 1 daily HKG-LGW operated by CX, I don't see why travellers will do HKG-CPH-LHR

Originally Posted by nacho View Post
I know that SK partner with KA which is now Cathay dragon for routes like CPH-PEK-HKG that Cathay Dragon will be flying PEK-HKG.
The SK partner is CA (Air China) but not KA.
CPH-PEK-HKG flown by SK and CA.

It is true that CA hold shares of CX(KA) and CX hold shares of CA, and there are codeshares in HKG-PEK route operated by KA/CX and CA.

However, there is no partnership of SK with KA.
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Old Sep 3, 17, 10:41 am
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Originally Posted by cheung.chunyuenc View Post
HKG-CPH-HEL, yes possible
HKG-CPH-LHR, less likely as CX sell HKG-LHR directly and have a high yield. 4 daily HKG-LHR and 1 daily HKG-LGW operated by CX, I don't see why travellers will do HKG-CPH-LHR



The SK partner is CA (Air China) but not KA.
CPH-PEK-HKG flown by SK and CA.

It is true that CA hold shares of CX(KA) and CX hold shares of CA, and there are codeshares in HKG-PEK route operated by KA/CX and CA.

However, there is no partnership of SK with KA.
I think whether CX will sell LHR-CPH-HKG is entirely based on pricing and routing.

I don't know how CX prices their tickets, but this is what I got from SK that I can pay less by flying extra unnecessary segments :

MMX-ARN-CPH-IAD = 2000 DKK
CPH-IAD= 2500 DKK

MMX and CPH is a 45 minutes drive.

When I was looking for tickets to HKG, I saw that if I'm willing to pay more I can get something like CPH-PVG-HKG (the last segment flown by KA but not CX - somehow it's always KA not CA and not CX).

HK leisure travellers are price sensitive, but they have high time cost because 14 days annual paid leave is just too little. If they fly CX to CPH they will save 1 work day, they can work until 10:30pm and then head to the airport, but SK - they will have to take an extra day off.
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Old Sep 4, 17, 1:29 am
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Originally Posted by nacho View Post
I think whether CX will sell LHR-CPH-HKG is entirely based on pricing and routing.

I don't know how CX prices their tickets, but this is what I got from SK that I can pay less by flying extra unnecessary segments :




MMX-ARN-CPH-IAD = 2000 DKK
CPH-IAD= 2500 DKK

MMX and CPH is a 45 minutes drive.

When I was looking for tickets to HKG, I saw that if I'm willing to pay more I can get something like CPH-PVG-HKG (the last segment flown by KA but not CX - somehow it's always KA not CA and not CX).

HK leisure travellers are price sensitive, but they have high time cost because 14 days annual paid leave is just too little. If they fly CX to CPH they will save 1 work day, they can work until 10:30pm and then head to the airport, but SK - they will have to take an extra day off.
HKG-CPH-LHR
It depends on what type of fares in the BA codeshare do they give. Flying unnecessary segments in the Europe side, the price is somewhat same as direct flight.


For the codeshare part of KA, is the ticket issued by SAS or other OTAs? What will u earn for EB if the segment is not operated by *A partner?

When I attempt to book BRU-HKG flights, SAS website gave me 2 options,
1. BRU-ARN -HKG SK963 964
2. BRU - CPH-PEK-HKG

Perhaps originate from CPH is another sorry

It is true that HKG people has very few AL . Red eye flight is not the only reason for extra day of AL.
like arrival in day time for sightseeing in Europe and tuning jet lag is also another thing to consider. I believe SAS has a poor timing compared to CX AY BA AF LH LX TK . If SK is cheap enough, it is still worthwhile to travel with SK.

Another interesting thing is, the proportion of Chinese/HKG ethnic travelling business /SAS plus is not too much, whereas SAS Go has a lot of these passengers.
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Old Sep 4, 17, 4:02 am
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Originally Posted by cheung.chunyuenc View Post
HKG-CPH-LHR
It depends on what type of fares in the BA codeshare do they give. Flying unnecessary segments in the Europe side, the price is somewhat same as direct flight.


For the codeshare part of KA, is the ticket issued by SAS or other OTAs? What will u earn for EB if the segment is not operated by *A partner?

When I attempt to book BRU-HKG flights, SAS website gave me 2 options,
1. BRU-ARN -HKG SK963 964
2. BRU - CPH-PEK-HKG

Perhaps originate from CPH is another sorry

It is true that HKG people has very few AL . Red eye flight is not the only reason for extra day of AL.
like arrival in day time for sightseeing in Europe and tuning jet lag is also another thing to consider. I believe SAS has a poor timing compared to CX AY BA AF LH LX TK . If SK is cheap enough, it is still worthwhile to travel with SK.

Another interesting thing is, the proportion of Chinese/HKG ethnic travelling business /SAS plus is not too much, whereas SAS Go has a lot of these passengers.
I don't normally book direct with SK as the fare is usually HKG 300-500 more per ticket. It's from OTA and that might be the reason with the mixed KA/SK thing. According to *A you earn miles based on the actual carrier you fly, i.e. even if there's a SK code on the KA flight you will earn a big 0. I know OW is difference, it's based on the ticket bought.

From what I have seen with SK flights to China, there are a lot of Chinese in Plus. I haven't tried SK to Hong Kong (the awful flight time and the poor GO service).

Regarding tuning jetlag: It depends on your age, in my own experience it's impossible for small children to be able to sleep during day flights. I have had bad experience with my own and I have had shouting Japanese kids on LH J both ways from Germany to Japan.
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