jomala05

Where in the T&C does it say they impose rules of their own irrespective of the country's requirements?

ovacikar

How do you plan to return to Switzerland without a passport?

jomala05

I don't live in Switzerland, but all EU/Schengen states accept the same ID I use to fly to and enter the UK.

LondonElite

Within the EU/Schengen a national ID card is sufficient for travel.

Silver Fox

One day this approach will bite you on the backside when you least need it. Just get a passport and fight the good fight if you must, but it really seems a case of cutting off your nose to spite your face.

MB_again

How would they track time spent in the UK without a passport and (physical/digital) stamp, which is limited post-Brexit for non-residents in the UK?

jomala05

Entries and exits are recorded through API or TDI depending on mode of transport (entries by Eurostar currently aren't recorded, but a fix is due sometime this year), with in-country checks mainly taking place on travel NI <-> GB.
EU/Schengen passports aren't stamped in the UK anyway for Standard Visitors (except possibly - not sure - if there are doubts about the visitor insufficient to refuse entry, i.e. where the now-abolished landing card would've been retained)

MB_again

That's interesting to hear, seeing as UK passports are stamped on entry into the EU... unless they have secured residency rights under the withdrawal agreement...

jomala05

Or unless clearing immigration in a member state that doesn't stamp ordinary residence permit holders per national policy, which is almost half of them e.g. Germany, Poland, Sweden and Switzerland
The UK doesn't stamp AU/CA/JP/KR/NZ/SG/US passports either btw (again, that goes for Standard Visitors), and they may use the eGates.

MB_again

I know Greece shouldn't stamp UK passports if the holder has a specific residence permit (or other proof) covering them under the withdrawal agreement, but for everyone else, be it a tourist or someone coming under another status post-Brexit (same treatment as non-EU nationals pre-Brexit a.k.a. third country nationals), I understand they stamp the UK passport on both entry and exit - for tourists there is a fine if they exceed 90 days' stay in any rolling 180-day period and for post-Brexit permit holders they have always stamped third country nationals, so no reason to expect them to treat UK passports different. It remains visa-free but not restriction (and therefore tracking) free.

As I said, physical or digital stamps, but all linked to passports (not IDs). UK's rules are also restricted for non-resident visitors, allowing no more than 6 months' continuous stay, so again need to track this reliably. I'm not sure I believe immigration rely on API data (except maybe for exit data since UK doesn't have exit border controls), otherwise I think border control gates (electronic or manual) are their most reliable source of entry data and whether they can "tag" these records (especially for non-citizens/residents) against an ID rather than a passport sounds highly doubtful.

Maybe you are onto a very unique loophole that sidesteps my understanding above, in which case, all the best pursuing it. Maybe check with a more established airline if they allow travel between UK and EU post-Brexit with just IDs, maybe you'll get a better steer of whether to pursue your point with Ryanair or invest in a passport...

jomala05

Never heard of "digital stamps" in the UK; in any case entries on IDs are recorded the same way as on passports.

When I requested a full entry/exit record, I got a Semaphore extract, which is all about API and TDI. For non-API/TDI entries, entry stamps fill the gap, which is why they've only dropped stamping for Standard Visitors of low-risk nationalities (EEA/AU/CA/CH/KO/JP/NZ/SG/US)[/QUOTE]

Again, it's not chiefly down to Ryanair, but handling agents across the board being uninformed of carrier regulations in this respect. As I said an Aviator manager at ARN knows the deal perfectly (yet the field workers don't...), so I had a smooth experience with them (and that was for Ryanair). My problem with Ryanair is that their docs control unit (Immigration Department) ignore when errors on the field are pointed out to them in detail with proof.

Flew BEG-LTN on WIZZ today; both Sky Partner (handling agent) and the Air Serbia Ground Handling's docs control unit were clueless, so had to email them the share code normally meant for employers/landlords.

I think I'll use this approach whenever I can locate the email address to the handling agent: email them 1-2 days before departure with the link and share code and a brief explanation as to the purpose. With one handling agent that really did the trick, even though I keep emphasising that I'm under no obligation to provide this in actuality and they still are supposed to let me board.

ft101

That's fine on Wizz etc but as before if Ryanair choose to have stricter rules than immigration require they are quite entitled to.

Tobias-UK

Here are the Ryanair travel document requirements: https://www.ryanair.com/gb/en/useful...nsse_579117795

jomala05

You keep biting onto that "Ryanair just has their own stricter policy" rhetoric. That's NOT where it's at, it's about handling staff being uninformed as to what the regulations are, and Ryanair not caring to deal with it when served with proof, just because it's provided by a passenger.
Nowhere in the T&C or on ryanair.com in general does it say they override immigration regulations in any respect (but one, which is out of scope), PLUS again, all customer service ever tells me is to check the entry regulations myself, explicitly denying having any deviant policies of their own. Besides, if they did, how was I allowed on board at ARN with such ease (again, just had to drop the name of the handling TC, one of the few people in the industry who do get the rules correctly)?

After many reminders, I just got the following response to my complaint:
Might just be me, but I think that's mere BS to make me go away, and I'm calling that bluff, so I asked them to follow up on it.

Which points to no airline-specific policy overriding immigration regulations. In any case, I think Customer service told me once years ago that document requirements set out in the T&C are merely guidelines and that the onus is on pax to check immigration regulations. Again, I know of a single exception, which concerns travel UK <-> ROI for British/Irish citizens, and is pointed out at https://help.ryanair.com/hc/en-ba/ar...rts-and-Visas-
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jjbiv

You seem to be willfully ignoring this statement on the same page:
This is your right of course. However, I don't think there is anything anyone on this site can tell you to change your mind. Best of luck with your crusade.