Had an accident with rented car. No insurance or CDW. Please help!!
Apr 2, 2019, 6:37 pm
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Apr 2019
Programs: What you think you become
Posts: 8
Had an accident with rented car. No insurance or CDW. Please help!!
Hi,
I know I have got myself in a big trouble all because of my stupidity. I understand I have no choice but to pay for the loss. But what I want to know is what are the troubles coming on my way, and should I hire a lawyer?
So I was in the left turn lane, turning left into the gas station. The road with the oncoming traffic has three lanes. And this is where I f'd up. I thought there were only two lanes, I couldnt see the third one. So what happened was the car on the first lane and the car on the second lane stopped infront of me to allow me to pass through into the gas station. And so I did. I was making the left turn I passed the first and the second lane but on the third I got hit my a speeding car (even though traffic was slow).
Now since I didnt purchase Damage waiver or have personal insurance (I dont own a Car) and on top of that I am not an american citizen, just a tourist, and this accident happened in California, I want to know whats coming my way. I feel I can afford to pay for the damages for both the car i rented and the other guy's car (the collision was not severe). And fortunately the other guy did not get hurt or injured in the accident, so I belive he is fine. And the only thing that I need to be concern about is the damage to the cars.
If its my fault and I am willing to completely pay for the damages, and the person is not injured, what's is the worst thing that can happen? Can I have my licensee suspended? Can I get into legal troubles for not having insurance? Should I hire a lawyer? Should I be worried about anything else apart from the car damage costs? Can i be deported and get my visa cancelled for not having insurance?
I know I sound crazy asking these questions, please forgive me. Its just that I have anxiety disorder and this is my first accident so this why my mind is creating all the worst case scenarios possible. Please help me. Any advise will be appreciated. Thanks
I know I have got myself in a big trouble all because of my stupidity. I understand I have no choice but to pay for the loss. But what I want to know is what are the troubles coming on my way, and should I hire a lawyer?
So I was in the left turn lane, turning left into the gas station. The road with the oncoming traffic has three lanes. And this is where I f'd up. I thought there were only two lanes, I couldnt see the third one. So what happened was the car on the first lane and the car on the second lane stopped infront of me to allow me to pass through into the gas station. And so I did. I was making the left turn I passed the first and the second lane but on the third I got hit my a speeding car (even though traffic was slow).
Now since I didnt purchase Damage waiver or have personal insurance (I dont own a Car) and on top of that I am not an american citizen, just a tourist, and this accident happened in California, I want to know whats coming my way. I feel I can afford to pay for the damages for both the car i rented and the other guy's car (the collision was not severe). And fortunately the other guy did not get hurt or injured in the accident, so I belive he is fine. And the only thing that I need to be concern about is the damage to the cars.
If its my fault and I am willing to completely pay for the damages, and the person is not injured, what's is the worst thing that can happen? Can I have my licensee suspended? Can I get into legal troubles for not having insurance? Should I hire a lawyer? Should I be worried about anything else apart from the car damage costs? Can i be deported and get my visa cancelled for not having insurance?
I know I sound crazy asking these questions, please forgive me. Its just that I have anxiety disorder and this is my first accident so this why my mind is creating all the worst case scenarios possible. Please help me. Any advise will be appreciated. Thanks
Apr 2, 2019, 7:47 pm
#2
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Not here; there!
Programs: AA Lifetime Gold
Posts: 29,584
I'm sorry to learn of your misfortune.
How did you book the rental,? On a U.S. website? On a website based in your home country (or home continent)? In many cases, if a foreigner books a U.S. car rental on a foreign-based website, insurance coverage is included at no additional charge. What does your rental contract say?
Good luck!
How did you book the rental,? On a U.S. website? On a website based in your home country (or home continent)? In many cases, if a foreigner books a U.S. car rental on a foreign-based website, insurance coverage is included at no additional charge. What does your rental contract say?
Good luck!
Apr 2, 2019, 11:54 pm
#3
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 3,703
The company would not have rented to you if you weren't covered somehow. In this case the above post is probably correct that coverage was included in your rate.
In addition to the above, check if your credit card includes any rental car coverage.
In addition to the above, check if your credit card includes any rental car coverage.
Apr 3, 2019, 12:07 am
#4
Original Poster
Join Date: Apr 2019
Programs: What you think you become
Posts: 8
Thanks for the above replies. I am 100% sure that I dont have any coverage. I used the US website to book the car and I was in US when I made the reservation. I told the enterprise representative that I dont have any personal insurance since I dont own a car and I dont want the CDW either. He said its not a problem you can have the car without any coverage, its just that you will be responsible for all the damage even if its not my fault. He asked me to sign some kinda "exemption" form and thats it. I got the car. So I dont know what's going to happen next.
Apr 3, 2019, 1:24 am
#5
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 6,338
I don't understand why you said no to the CDW...but whats done is done. My biggest concern is not the cost of REPAIRS so much as the possible other charges from the car rental company... A nasty little thing gets talked about called "loss of use" where they try to hold you liable for missed rental income while the car is off the road...
Apr 3, 2019, 2:07 am
#6
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: ZOA, SFO, HKG
Programs: UA 1K 0.9MM, Marriott Gold, HHonors Gold, Hertz PC, SBux Gold, TSA Pre✓
Posts: 13,811
Declaimer - IANAL.
A infraction (traffic ticket) for driving without insurance - About $490.
CA DMV can't, as a matter of facts/law/reality, suspends a license issued outside California.
So your license is definitely safe.
Yes. As above.
It is always your right to consult a lawyer. Nevertheless, in this case, I would say no both for the traffic violation and the civil matter.
Driving without insurance is a matter of yes and no - i.e. you either had or had not. So if you have been ticketed, simply pay the fine and move on.
(Some people may choose to go to the court and ask for leniency. Some judge may reduce the fine in light of a guilty plea.)
I will discuss more on the civil matter later.
Personal injury damages.
No.
My 2 cents on this incident:
It does not sound like you are at fault.
I was once told by an insurance adjuster that the rule of thumb is, in most of the case, the car bumping another one is always the one responsible. In this case, when 2 cars saw you and blocked off the roads for your access, it was clear that the 3rd car (the one bumped you) was careless.
Even assuming you made an illegal turn, the 3rd car driver's best chance is to argue the responsibility as 50/50 (each of you responsible for your own damage).
In term of litigation, it costs to sue. In traffic incidents, unless the plaintiffs clearly know there is a chance of recovery (usually from insurance), usually people won't bother suing. So given your "lack" of insurance, your chance of being sued is low. But the rental company can be sued.
In this case, you should discuss with the 3rd car driver/owner on how you should proceed, without admitting liabilities. The chance is the 3rd car driver/owner may ask you to file with their insurance.
You never know.
CA DMV can't, as a matter of facts/law/reality, suspends a license issued outside California.
So your license is definitely safe.
Yes. As above.
It is always your right to consult a lawyer. Nevertheless, in this case, I would say no both for the traffic violation and the civil matter.
Driving without insurance is a matter of yes and no - i.e. you either had or had not. So if you have been ticketed, simply pay the fine and move on.
(Some people may choose to go to the court and ask for leniency. Some judge may reduce the fine in light of a guilty plea.)
I will discuss more on the civil matter later.
My 2 cents on this incident:
It does not sound like you are at fault.
I was once told by an insurance adjuster that the rule of thumb is, in most of the case, the car bumping another one is always the one responsible. In this case, when 2 cars saw you and blocked off the roads for your access, it was clear that the 3rd car (the one bumped you) was careless.
Even assuming you made an illegal turn, the 3rd car driver's best chance is to argue the responsibility as 50/50 (each of you responsible for your own damage).
In term of litigation, it costs to sue. In traffic incidents, unless the plaintiffs clearly know there is a chance of recovery (usually from insurance), usually people won't bother suing. So given your "lack" of insurance, your chance of being sued is low. But the rental company can be sued.
In this case, you should discuss with the 3rd car driver/owner on how you should proceed, without admitting liabilities. The chance is the 3rd car driver/owner may ask you to file with their insurance.
You never know.
Apr 3, 2019, 8:45 am
#7
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: IND
Programs: LT Marriott Uber Titanium; From US CP to dirt (Its been a while)
Posts: 292
If you turn left into someone who is driving appropriately (sober / not speeding / driving reckless) liability is almost always on the guy that turned left. See CA code below.
When someone waves you through an intersection they may owe you a duty of care to ensure the roadway is safe to turn across. Though I'm guessing you don't know who those folks are. An ex-gf who practiced in this area always scolded me for waving to someone to turn. Read the link below to see why.
https://www.claimsjournal.com/news/n.../06/244965.htm
CHAPTER 4. Right-of-Way [21800 - 21809]
( Chapter 4 enacted by Stats. 1959, Ch. 3. )
When someone waves you through an intersection they may owe you a duty of care to ensure the roadway is safe to turn across. Though I'm guessing you don't know who those folks are. An ex-gf who practiced in this area always scolded me for waving to someone to turn. Read the link below to see why.
https://www.claimsjournal.com/news/n.../06/244965.htm
CHAPTER 4. Right-of-Way [21800 - 21809]
( Chapter 4 enacted by Stats. 1959, Ch. 3. )
21801.
(a) The driver of a vehicle intending to turn to the left or to complete a U-turn upon a highway, or to turn left into public or private property, or an alley, shall yield the right-of-way to all vehicles approaching from the opposite direction which are close enough to constitute a hazard at any time during the turning movement, and shall continue to yield the right-of-way to the approaching vehicles until the left turn or U-turn can be made with reasonable safety.(b) A driver having yielded as prescribed in subdivision (a), and having given a signal when and as required by this code, may turn left or complete a U-turn, and the drivers of vehicles approaching the intersection or the entrance to the property or alley from the opposite direction shall yield the right-of-way to the turning vehicle.
(a) The driver of a vehicle intending to turn to the left or to complete a U-turn upon a highway, or to turn left into public or private property, or an alley, shall yield the right-of-way to all vehicles approaching from the opposite direction which are close enough to constitute a hazard at any time during the turning movement, and shall continue to yield the right-of-way to the approaching vehicles until the left turn or U-turn can be made with reasonable safety.(b) A driver having yielded as prescribed in subdivision (a), and having given a signal when and as required by this code, may turn left or complete a U-turn, and the drivers of vehicles approaching the intersection or the entrance to the property or alley from the opposite direction shall yield the right-of-way to the turning vehicle.
https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=VEH§ionNum= 21801
Other car probably has uninsured motorist coverage. Can offer to pay their deductible.
Didn't you pay with a Credit card that has secondary coverage? That would likely default to your primary coverage.
Last edited by ackpfft; Apr 3, 2019 at 9:09 am
Apr 3, 2019, 9:12 am
#8
Suspended
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: DCA
Programs: UA US CO AA DL FL
Posts: 50,262
You need some basic facts here:
1. What is the approximate dollar value of the damage to the Enterprise vehicle?
2. What is the approximate dollar value of the other vehicle?
3. Was anyone injured?
4. Was law enforcement notified or otherwise involved and have you been issued a summons, citation or other document (even possibly arrested)?
All of the above should calibrate your next steps. In particular, you should understand that while California cannot suspend a non-California drivers license, it most certainly can suspend your privilege to operate in California. Whether that matters to you depends on whether you may need to return to California and drive.
If you are not from the US, are unfamiliar with the system, and have the resources, this is where a lawyer can be of assistance. While you will have to pay for the lawyer's services, it is also easy to underestimate the risks here.
1. What is the approximate dollar value of the damage to the Enterprise vehicle?
2. What is the approximate dollar value of the other vehicle?
3. Was anyone injured?
4. Was law enforcement notified or otherwise involved and have you been issued a summons, citation or other document (even possibly arrested)?
All of the above should calibrate your next steps. In particular, you should understand that while California cannot suspend a non-California drivers license, it most certainly can suspend your privilege to operate in California. Whether that matters to you depends on whether you may need to return to California and drive.
If you are not from the US, are unfamiliar with the system, and have the resources, this is where a lawyer can be of assistance. While you will have to pay for the lawyer's services, it is also easy to underestimate the risks here.
Apr 3, 2019, 5:57 pm
#9
Original Poster
Join Date: Apr 2019
Programs: What you think you become
Posts: 8
My 2 cents on this incident:
It does not sound like you are at fault.
I was once told by an insurance adjuster that the rule of thumb is, in most of the case, the car bumping another one is always the one responsible. In this case, when 2 cars saw you and blocked off the roads for your access, it was clear that the 3rd car (the one bumped you) was careless.
Even assuming you made an illegal turn, the 3rd car driver's best chance is to argue the responsibility as 50/50 (each of you responsible for your own damage).
In term of litigation, it costs to sue. In traffic incidents, unless the plaintiffs clearly know there is a chance of recovery (usually from insurance), usually people won't bother suing. So given your "lack" of insurance, your chance of being sued is low. But the rental company can be sued.
In this case, you should discuss with the 3rd car driver/owner on how you should proceed, without admitting liabilities. The chance is the 3rd car driver/owner may ask you to file with their insurance.
You never know.
Hey, Thank you so much for clarifying my confusion. I am just waiting to get a response from the other person. I have been contacted by the car rental claims services. They have so far asked me to provide details of the other party involved in accident. Ill see where it goes from here.
Apr 3, 2019, 6:03 pm
#10
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Orange County, CA (SNA)
Programs: Delta - PM , MM; Hilton - Diamond, Marriott - Peon
Posts: 911
Thanks for the above replies. I am 100% sure that I dont have any coverage. I used the US website to book the car and I was in US when I made the reservation. I told the enterprise representative that I dont have any personal insurance since I dont own a car and I dont want the CDW either. He said its not a problem you can have the car without any coverage, its just that you will be responsible for all the damage even if its not my fault. He asked me to sign some kinda "exemption" form and thats it. I got the car. So I dont know what's going to happen next.
Mind you, IANAL...
(Welcome to FlyerTalk!)
Last edited by tanglin; Apr 3, 2019 at 6:04 pm Reason: Typo
Apr 3, 2019, 6:07 pm
#11
Original Poster
Join Date: Apr 2019
Programs: What you think you become
Posts: 8
If you turn left into someone who is driving appropriately (sober / not speeding / driving reckless) liability is almost always on the guy that turned left. See CA code below.
When someone waves you through an intersection they may owe you a duty of care to ensure the roadway is safe to turn across. Though I'm guessing you don't know who those folks are. An ex-gf who practiced in this area always scolded me for waving to someone to turn. Read the link below to see why.
CHAPTER 4. Right-of-Way [21800 - 21809]
( Chapter 4 enacted by Stats. 1959, Ch. 3. )
Other car probably has uninsured motorist coverage. Can offer to pay their deductible.When someone waves you through an intersection they may owe you a duty of care to ensure the roadway is safe to turn across. Though I'm guessing you don't know who those folks are. An ex-gf who practiced in this area always scolded me for waving to someone to turn. Read the link below to see why.
CHAPTER 4. Right-of-Way [21800 - 21809]
( Chapter 4 enacted by Stats. 1959, Ch. 3. )
21801.
(a) The driver of a vehicle intending to turn to the left or to complete a U-turn upon a highway, or to turn left into public or private property, or an alley, shall yield the right-of-way to all vehicles approaching from the opposite direction which are close enough to constitute a hazard at any time during the turning movement, and shall continue to yield the right-of-way to the approaching vehicles until the left turn or U-turn can be made with reasonable safety.(b) A driver having yielded as prescribed in subdivision (a), and having given a signal when and as required by this code, may turn left or complete a U-turn, and the drivers of vehicles approaching the intersection or the entrance to the property or alley from the opposite direction shall yield the right-of-way to the turning vehicle.
(a) The driver of a vehicle intending to turn to the left or to complete a U-turn upon a highway, or to turn left into public or private property, or an alley, shall yield the right-of-way to all vehicles approaching from the opposite direction which are close enough to constitute a hazard at any time during the turning movement, and shall continue to yield the right-of-way to the approaching vehicles until the left turn or U-turn can be made with reasonable safety.(b) A driver having yielded as prescribed in subdivision (a), and having given a signal when and as required by this code, may turn left or complete a U-turn, and the drivers of vehicles approaching the intersection or the entrance to the property or alley from the opposite direction shall yield the right-of-way to the turning vehicle.
Didn't you pay with a Credit card that has secondary coverage? That would likely default to your primary coverage.
So I guess if am at fault then I'd have to pay for the damage surely. But could there be any reason for other party to be at fault as well? Like being careless and speeding? I feel if I was on his lane going straight and see two cars blocking the traffic, I would be careful and move slowly in a already slow traffic road. But honestly, Idk.
Apr 3, 2019, 6:22 pm
#12
Original Poster
Join Date: Apr 2019
Programs: What you think you become
Posts: 8
You need some basic facts here:
1. What is the approximate dollar value of the damage to the Enterprise vehicle?
2. What is the approximate dollar value of the other vehicle?
3. Was anyone injured?
4. Was law enforcement notified or otherwise involved and have you been issued a summons, citation or other document (even possibly arrested)?
All of the above should calibrate your next steps. In particular, you should understand that while California cannot suspend a non-California drivers license, it most certainly can suspend your privilege to operate in California. Whether that matters to you depends on whether you may need to return to California and drive.
If you are not from the US, are unfamiliar with the system, and have the resources, this is where a lawyer can be of assistance. While you will have to pay for the lawyer's services, it is also easy to underestimate the risks here.
1. What is the approximate dollar value of the damage to the Enterprise vehicle?
2. What is the approximate dollar value of the other vehicle?
3. Was anyone injured?
4. Was law enforcement notified or otherwise involved and have you been issued a summons, citation or other document (even possibly arrested)?
All of the above should calibrate your next steps. In particular, you should understand that while California cannot suspend a non-California drivers license, it most certainly can suspend your privilege to operate in California. Whether that matters to you depends on whether you may need to return to California and drive.
If you are not from the US, are unfamiliar with the system, and have the resources, this is where a lawyer can be of assistance. While you will have to pay for the lawyer's services, it is also easy to underestimate the risks here.
Apr 3, 2019, 6:29 pm
#13
Suspended
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: DCA
Programs: UA US CO AA DL FL
Posts: 50,262
This is plain and simply wrong.
Apr 3, 2019, 7:30 pm
#15
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Montreal
Posts: 586
Looks like your concerns are 2 separate issues: liability coverage and collision damage coverage.
Unlike most states, California does not require rental agencies to include the minimum liability insurance required by law for rentals. However, Hertz's website states that: "Hertz provides no liability protection under the terms of the Rental Agreement to the renter from claims of injury by others against you resulting from an accident. Your personal/business insurance may cover your liability. Exceptions: Hertz will provide primary liability protection up to the statutory minimum limits to international customers (driver's license indicates an address outside the USA) renting in California."
Therefore, it looks like your rental should've been covered by the state's minimum liability insurance even if you didn't book on an international site as you presumably had a foreign licence as per the Hertz terms. While woefully inadequate, it should be fine as you said there were no injuries to the other party. The minimum insurance coverage keeps you kosher with regards to driving lawfully as you only need liability insurance when driving, collision/comprehensive is optional. IANAL, but the liability insurance could even cover the deductible or repairs for the other vehicle.
If you're sure that you do not have collision damage coverage from a credit card or personal insurance, then you will be responsible for the repairs and loss of use for the Hertz vehicle. Be sure to ask for a summary of repair and loss of use charges.
Unlike most states, California does not require rental agencies to include the minimum liability insurance required by law for rentals. However, Hertz's website states that: "Hertz provides no liability protection under the terms of the Rental Agreement to the renter from claims of injury by others against you resulting from an accident. Your personal/business insurance may cover your liability. Exceptions: Hertz will provide primary liability protection up to the statutory minimum limits to international customers (driver's license indicates an address outside the USA) renting in California."
Therefore, it looks like your rental should've been covered by the state's minimum liability insurance even if you didn't book on an international site as you presumably had a foreign licence as per the Hertz terms. While woefully inadequate, it should be fine as you said there were no injuries to the other party. The minimum insurance coverage keeps you kosher with regards to driving lawfully as you only need liability insurance when driving, collision/comprehensive is optional. IANAL, but the liability insurance could even cover the deductible or repairs for the other vehicle.
If you're sure that you do not have collision damage coverage from a credit card or personal insurance, then you will be responsible for the repairs and loss of use for the Hertz vehicle. Be sure to ask for a summary of repair and loss of use charges.