APD refund refused - how to get reimbursed
Mar 12, 2019, 3:39 pm
#17
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: LON
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If the value of the original ticket was recovered by payment of a no show fee and change fee plus fare difference then by mymy understanding the unused APD would have been put towards the replacement ticket and hence no APD refund would be due.
However if a completely new ticket was purchased on a new PNR then there is probably some APD available for refund, but that will be subject to any fees leveraged by the travel agent who booked the ticket and has to administer the refund. Their costs would have been called out in their T&C's which I assume were accepted by the OP when booking. You will need to accept that £55 admin fee or give up.
As the OP ended up getting a new passport issued, the denied boarding angle is now very weak. The only possible path in my opinion would be to get a written statement from the Thai Embassy stating whether the blank page would have been acceptable for entry into Thailand by immigration (note: it's immigration not customs as discussed above). If the OP can be bothered to go through that they then potentially have a good case to pursue QR for denied boarding compensation at €600. In which case come back here and ask for more advice. The British Airways forum has a good thread that offers advice on EU261 claims which would be a good read for the OP, but as the query does not relate to BA don't post questions in that thread but come back here.
Good luck.
However if a completely new ticket was purchased on a new PNR then there is probably some APD available for refund, but that will be subject to any fees leveraged by the travel agent who booked the ticket and has to administer the refund. Their costs would have been called out in their T&C's which I assume were accepted by the OP when booking. You will need to accept that £55 admin fee or give up.
As the OP ended up getting a new passport issued, the denied boarding angle is now very weak. The only possible path in my opinion would be to get a written statement from the Thai Embassy stating whether the blank page would have been acceptable for entry into Thailand by immigration (note: it's immigration not customs as discussed above). If the OP can be bothered to go through that they then potentially have a good case to pursue QR for denied boarding compensation at €600. In which case come back here and ask for more advice. The British Airways forum has a good thread that offers advice on EU261 claims which would be a good read for the OP, but as the query does not relate to BA don't post questions in that thread but come back here.
Good luck.
Mar 12, 2019, 3:52 pm
#18
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If the value of the original ticket was recovered by payment of a no show fee and change fee plus fare difference then by mymy understanding the unused APD would have been put towards the replacement ticket and hence no APD refund would be due.
However if a completely new ticket was purchased on a new PNR then there is probably some APD available for refund, but that will be subject to any fees leveraged by the travel agent who booked the ticket and has to administer the refund. Their costs would have been called out in their T&C's which I assume were accepted by the OP when booking. You will need to accept that £55 admin fee or give up.
As the OP ended up getting a new passport issued, the denied boarding angle is now very weak. The only possible path in my opinion would be to get a written statement from the Thai Embassy stating whether the blank page would have been acceptable for entry into Thailand by immigration (note: it's immigration not customs as discussed above). If the OP can be bothered to go through that they then potentially have a good case to pursue QR for denied boarding compensation at €600. In which case come back here and ask for more advice. The British Airways forum has a good thread that offers advice on EU261 claims which would be a good read for the OP, but as the query does not relate to BA don't post questions in that thread but come back here.
Good luck.
However if a completely new ticket was purchased on a new PNR then there is probably some APD available for refund, but that will be subject to any fees leveraged by the travel agent who booked the ticket and has to administer the refund. Their costs would have been called out in their T&C's which I assume were accepted by the OP when booking. You will need to accept that £55 admin fee or give up.
As the OP ended up getting a new passport issued, the denied boarding angle is now very weak. The only possible path in my opinion would be to get a written statement from the Thai Embassy stating whether the blank page would have been acceptable for entry into Thailand by immigration (note: it's immigration not customs as discussed above). If the OP can be bothered to go through that they then potentially have a good case to pursue QR for denied boarding compensation at €600. In which case come back here and ask for more advice. The British Airways forum has a good thread that offers advice on EU261 claims which would be a good read for the OP, but as the query does not relate to BA don't post questions in that thread but come back here.
Good luck.
The language of EC 261/2004 makes this abundantly clear in its definition of "denied boarding" (Art. 2).
"'denied boarding' means a refusal to carry passengers on a flight, although they have presented themselves for boarding ... except where there are reasonable grounds to deny them boarding,"
There are many people who are admitted to many countries who are in possession of documents which do not meet the full requirements for entry. Those decisions are made at the border, but the carrier does not make discretionary decisions.
Mar 12, 2019, 4:08 pm
#19
Original Poster
Join Date: Mar 2019
Programs: bristish airways
Posts: 12
FROM QATAR AIRWAYS WEBSITE
CANCELLATION OR DENIED BOARDING
If your flight is cancelled, and you were informed less than 2 weeks prior to the scheduled date or you're denied boarding you're entitled to:
CANCELLATION OR DENIED BOARDING
If your flight is cancelled, and you were informed less than 2 weeks prior to the scheduled date or you're denied boarding you're entitled to:
- Transport to your final destination using comparable alternative transport means or
- A refund for your ticket or
- Transport free of charge to your initial departure point if you have connecting flights, and
- Financial compensation of EUR 250 to EUR 600 depending on the distance of your flight. If the carrier offers you an alternative flight, and you reach your final destination with a delay of 2, 3 or 4 hours depending on the length of the flight, the compensation may be reduced by 50% (see below).
- In cases of re-routing, you are also entitled to care (drinks, meals, communications) and, if necessary, hotel accommodation (including transfer) depending on the length of the delay.
Mar 12, 2019, 6:46 pm
#20
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Posts: 17,008
I'm not being nit-picky, but surely Thai immigration rather Thai customs is the authority that rules on admission requirements.
Timatic via UA suggests only a partially clear passport page is required for a UK passenger travelling on a UK passport
Important:
Visa exempt nationals (UK among 55 nationalities) must have passports and passport replacing documents with at least half an unused visa page for entry/departure endorsements by the Thai Immigration Service.
HOWEVER
The same source confirms that nationality/passport valid for a visa on arrival (there are twenty-odd of these) requires a free full page in his/her passport
So there's a strong possibility that the visa desk in QR Towers screwed up. The OP could approach the Thai embassy for clarification of the rules. If QR were in the wrong, they should at least make he OP whole in terms of the costs entailed in completing his journey.
It would be overkill to employ the services of His Majesty King Maha Vajiralongkorn, Descended by Flesh and Blood of the Divine Indra, Overlord of all Angels
Timatic via UA suggests only a partially clear passport page is required for a UK passenger travelling on a UK passport
Important:
Visa exempt nationals (UK among 55 nationalities) must have passports and passport replacing documents with at least half an unused visa page for entry/departure endorsements by the Thai Immigration Service.
HOWEVER
The same source confirms that nationality/passport valid for a visa on arrival (there are twenty-odd of these) requires a free full page in his/her passport
So there's a strong possibility that the visa desk in QR Towers screwed up. The OP could approach the Thai embassy for clarification of the rules. If QR were in the wrong, they should at least make he OP whole in terms of the costs entailed in completing his journey.
It would be overkill to employ the services of His Majesty King Maha Vajiralongkorn, Descended by Flesh and Blood of the Divine Indra, Overlord of all Angels
Mar 13, 2019, 1:24 am
#21
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Hong Kong, France
Programs: FB , BA Gold
Posts: 15,556
FROM QATAR AIRWAYS WEBSITE
CANCELLATION OR DENIED BOARDING
If your flight is cancelled, and you were informed less than 2 weeks prior to the scheduled date or you're denied boarding you're entitled to:
CANCELLATION OR DENIED BOARDING
If your flight is cancelled, and you were informed less than 2 weeks prior to the scheduled date or you're denied boarding you're entitled to:
- Transport to your final destination using comparable alternative transport means or
- A refund for your ticket or
- Transport free of charge to your initial departure point if you have connecting flights, and
- Financial compensation of EUR 250 to EUR 600 depending on the distance of your flight. If the carrier offers you an alternative flight, and you reach your final destination with a delay of 2, 3 or 4 hours depending on the length of the flight, the compensation may be reduced by 50% (see below).
- In cases of re-routing, you are also entitled to care (drinks, meals, communications) and, if necessary, hotel accommodation (including transfer) depending on the length of the delay.
As there's nothing specific regarding reason for denial of boarding, should I pursue this angle, rather than the compensation route, as it does appear to hinge on the 'reasonable grounds' clause. CAA, when I spoke to them on the phone thought I should pursue with them further down the 261/2004 road
You were denied boarding for lack of proper travel documents, you are entitled no compensation nor rebooking by EC261.
As stated by others, your discussion about APD is with your TA, not with QR. The TA issued the tickets and possibly used any reimbursement on the first one as credit on the second one.
Whatever a CAA agent told you on the phone based on your partial explanation of the case is probably of little value. Losing time in a procedure to possibly recover a few pounds seems to me like a waste of your time.
A more interesting avenue could be the single/half page issue mentioned by IAN-UK, assuming you are one of the nationals with visa exemption.
However, the fact that a visa was affixed on that page and you removed it leaving traces of glue make your case difficult to plead (even if you claim that it has simply fallen off, that page had been used). The fact that half an entry stamp appears on that page, the other half being probably on the torn visa, does not help. And going through the process of getting the Thai authorities to state in writing that they would have accepted your old passport seems a futile attempt.
My advice is to simply accept that you have been a bit careless and learn from it for your future travels.
Last edited by brunos; Mar 13, 2019 at 1:57 am
Mar 14, 2019, 4:55 am
#25
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