Rant: QF seating allocation for international
 

Ok, so I do Australia to the US between 3 and 5 times a year. Generally I book between 4 and 8 weeks out and on a K class fare or higher. Yet in the last 3yrs, or 12 trips to be more specific, or 24 flights to be precise, I have only been able to secure an exit row once, a bulkhead never and always end up with a seat number 49 or higher.

I have been platinum now for 4 years and had partner gold for three of those. So, what on earth is going on? Are there really that many Platinums flying down the back, booking 4-8 weeks or more before travel?

Or is the QF seating system for international both wrong and/ or broken?

How can I book a flight to WLG 2 days before travel and manage seat 3C (first row of economy) but have a 1 in 24 chance of getting a decent seat going to the US?

I have tried calling QF premium desk and occasionally they have called seat management and moved me forward a few rows. Then you get on the plane to find some backpacker or retired couple sitting in the good seats with no idea how to operate the PTV or that you can't leave your bags on the floor for take off when seated at a bulkhead. You don't deserve the good seats people!

Now, just to demonstrate how broken QF is, I booked a codeshare flight with AA, on AA metal. On the QF code, the best I could do with a seat was 25D on a 757 (starts at 9) yet on the AA code, I got 16C. On an AS operated service, it was 23D on a 737, yet seatmap shows the plane is pretty much empty. Quick call to QF premium, they can't (wont) even request a more forward seat for me.

Now, what's the point of offering a benefit as part of a FF program if you can't deliver on it? Seat 54D on a 747 is not aisle forward Qantas. It's the middle!

/rant

It seems like you've been given the rough end of the pineapple.

On booking, I've always been able to score forward seats in Y on the aisle. But, like you, in my time as a WP, I cannot get exit rows or bulkheads. Sure, I can't get these seats at the time of booking as I don't have a special need, but I request these seats if they remain available. Upon check in, I haven't been able to score these seats. Whilst one should never judge a book by its cover, I'm ofter surprised to find just who is sitting in these seats.

I have to agree - I have gotten worse seats as an SG than as a boring QP Bronze.

Last time I tried to get a bulkhead about 2 months before. The elite line says "no, bulkheads are held for couples with babies" and we got on to find 3 teenagers sitting there. And exit rows were filled with what looked like backpackers wih little clue.

I'd prefer if they let higher elites book ahead of time, but save some good seats for last-minute elite bookings. I've been getting better seats in WT+ on BA with my QF number than on QF...

"I've been getting better seats in WT+ on BA with my QF number than on QF"

There are hardly any seats in WT+ though and there is v little difference between the rows ( other than seats like the single seat )

Personally, as a WP I find I get exemplorary service in seat selections when travelling back in the WHY cabin on international services

Dave

Some backpackers fly Concorde - at least Mrs og and I did so - both as SG on QF FF points (not SPG points!) - and we got row 5 each way. Nothing wrong with backpackers!

We booked a $150 cheapie three months before travel SIN-BKK on AY and got row 24 (almost the best WHY seats in the house - but I did notice that a huge "square" block of seats way down back in WHY were "taken" - me thinks they were allocated to lesser carriers which code shared on AY (eg QF).

More to the point, we booked B class QF SYD-SIN and were allocated 26 AB on a 744. I wanted forward aisle for us both and could only get row thirty something C&D (just fine by us). The 26 AB when relinquished did not become avbailable on ITN seat map checker (but the new seats then were taken). Therefore, I suspect that if you really want forward something seats, then a call to QF might do some good. But, I suspect the computer has total control of seating and the staff on the phone only get what the computer says is available.

Really, a month out from flight does give many people with FF profiles the jump in getting what they want before you book something. I think we all might be surprised how many passengers have status - horrible as it may seem.

"Then you get on the plane to find some backpacker or retired couple sitting in the good seats with no idea how to operate the PTV or that you can't leave your bags on the floor for take off when seated at a bulkhead. You don't deserve the good seats people!"


Why the hell don't they deserve good seats? They have paid for their ticket. Gee, so an irregular flyer might not realise that they cannot leave bags on the floor or , heaven forbid, are not experts in use of PTVs. Seats that are not pre-assigned are fair game for anyone at the airport. Perhaps they got there nice n early and managed to snag ( as is only fair ) the best seats available. How long before the flight did you roll up to the airport and did you actually ask for one of teh exit/bulkheads etc at check in time?

WNow, just to demonstrate how broken QF is, I booked a codeshare flight with AA, on AA metal. On the QF code, the best I could do with a seat was 25D on a 757 (starts at 9) yet on the AA code, I got 16C. On an AS operated service, it was 23D on a 737, yet seatmap shows the plane is pretty much empty. Quick call to QF premium, they can't (wont) even request a more forward seat for me."

That is because you are on a QF flight. QF only have a limited number of seats which they can pre-select on the codeshare. Just book the flight on the AA flight number and you will have access via QF to all non "premium" y seats. To get the premium seats ( such a exit row / front 5 rows of the MAN-BOS run ( 1st seats sold as economy )) you can get them by contacting AA as long as you have a FF card with OW status in the booking.

The QF Premium desk is , ime, v good at obtaining good seats in advance. Sometimes they have had to speak to seating to get a seat unblocked, but have always got me something good

Dave

Don't know whether QF have seats reserved just for WPs, but the only recent time I (as an SG) have not been pretty close to the front of the Y cabin was when I was rebooked ex-LHR at 8 hours' notice. I would have thought that there are lots of higher tier FFs flying the long routes who book considerably earlier than 4 to 8 weeks out. I do Aus about 3 time a year at the moment, and 8 weeks out would be a last-minute booking from my point of view. I can't be the only one.

Better seats can add complications also. Because I am Gold and my wife is Silver, I get a seat assigned and she doesn't. As a result, we have to get there early to make sure we even sit together.

We just accept it (along with the devaluaton of points) and use the club to have a shower. I know that the showers are sometimes not available and the computers can be all used - then we are stuck as I can't drink very much.

I do feel spoiled over in the land of the evil empire where UA lets elites (1P and 1K) pre-assign exit rows. Almost always I am able to get row 35 on a 744 (first exit row in Y) on UA longhauls. Of course, I almost never sit there thanks to upgrades, but it *is* a nice perk and takes a lot of angst out of it when I know I will get seat X.

Having just had some QF agents nicely assign exit rows and block seats next to me (as a humble NB) - OK, domestic, but long-haul domestic, I wonder if its as much about luck and attitude as it is about status...

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RichardMEL, UA 1P (It's Time to Fly)
A Star Alliance Member.

If I'll get better seats by NOT being a FF, then fine... ill stop flying oneworld altogether... how much on average does a QFWP spend in a year to keep status? I'm guessing 12-20k .. if qantas can't give preference to someone who clearly deserves it then there is problems!

I've had the same experience with finding young people in bulkhead/exits and it really really sucks.

Also ive found everytime ive booked through flight centre (for AA domestic flights) my alocated seat has ALWAYS been in the first 2 rows of coach. However when i booked through QF for those AA flights.. they are way way back in the mosh pit.

Of course they have paid for their tickets, so they are entitled to "a seat". Your top tire FF's - WP mainly, but also SG - have paid to get the good seats, mainly by travelling extensively on QF and sending quite a lot of revenue their way.

Pretty simple really.

Dave

Is there any sort of rule about exit rows only being allocated at the airport because the check-in staff have to see that you're able-bodied?

Having accompanied some (other) "young people" to the airport who really really wanted the exit row seats, I can tell you what you have to do:- Arrive at the airport about 4.5 hours before the flight departs. Find where check-in for your flight is likely to be and where the queue is forming. Sweet talk the security people manning and managing the queues (this was for a US flight). Spend the next 90 minutes managing an amorphous queue yourself, as everyone is just sitting around on whatever seats there are in the area, or on the floor. Organise it so that the people in the amorphous queue get to the check-in desk before the people who have turned up bang on the dot of 3 hours and who think that they can march straight up to the check-in desk ahead of the people who've been queueing for longer.

Then see if there are any exit row seats left.

If there's a policy of airport allocation only, how many very frequent flyers are prepared to play this game?

I tend to agree with Dave N’s points. I’ve flown many international miles as that “young backpacker” type. It’s only now I’ve been working for a few years that I’m chasing down the WP status and get to sit up the front (occasionally). I’ve been categorically told by airline staff that exits can’t be pre-allocated because they need to make sure you’re up to the task of chucking a 20kg door aside. I’m a big believer in asking nicely for those good seats and it just about always seems to work, even with no status and no pre-allocation I’ve just about always score them.

I think this really is a big problem for Qantas. After all in business it is your consistent, loyal customers who are a backbone if you wish to make yourself into a business with service.
On the other hand if you want to run an airline like Ryanair where it is every man for himself then that is fine.
The problem is Qantas makes itself out to be full service and so it should deliver to those who fork out regularly, especially with something as easy to fix as seat allocation.
I too experienced on AA many times getting very good seats that I have never been able to score on Qantas.

I agree entirely with nonce: the system is a shambles. As for the "good" seats (ie front/exit rows) it seems they are held until checkin for the benefit of any pax who may be very tall or have mobility problems; unfortunately in practice this means they usually get allocated to any old person who gets lucky.

As for the other seats, apparently anyone, regardless of status, can get allocation up to a certain percantage of the cabin, after which they stop pre-allocating; which means that the people who book earliest (and probably pay least) get the pick of seats!

But what is particularly annoying is that often even the checkin staff don't seem to have accurate info available to them: on several occasions I have been vehemently assured that NO aisle seats were available, only to find on boarding that empty aisle seats are all over the place (even next to me on one bizarre occasion!)

I don't think it is a matter of lots of elites crowding things out: to my observation, elites of any kind are relatively uncommon in international Y.