My EK Business Class booking with my QF points Cancelled. What are my rights?
Jan 13, 2019, 12:10 pm
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 55
My EK Business Class booking with my QF points Cancelled. What are my rights?
Dear all
I made a business class classic rewards booking using my Qantas points (600000 points each way) for my trip for May (SYD-BKK) and June (BKK-SYD).
Now EK made an announcement yesterday saying that EK is no longer flying between BKK and SYD starting in June. I checked my booking on QF and EK and sure enough, my return leg (BKK-SYD) is canceled now. I called Qantas yesterday and I was told that No Business class seats available on QF24 (Direct BKK-SYD). Since I have no interests in flying in economy, I have asked if there are any business class seats flying through any other cities (SIN/HKG/NRT etc). QF operator checked the availability and finally found the business seats on JL via NRT but asked me to couch up with 45000 additional points and AUD 900 extra tax and 5000 points for service charge... I do understand that It is not QF's fault canceling this EK flight but Can QF reroute me with another OneWorld carrier with involuntary reroute reticketing without charging me anything? Or is my option just to take an economy seat on QF 24?? It would be great if you can help me with this matter.
Thanks guys!
I made a business class classic rewards booking using my Qantas points (600000 points each way) for my trip for May (SYD-BKK) and June (BKK-SYD).
Now EK made an announcement yesterday saying that EK is no longer flying between BKK and SYD starting in June. I checked my booking on QF and EK and sure enough, my return leg (BKK-SYD) is canceled now. I called Qantas yesterday and I was told that No Business class seats available on QF24 (Direct BKK-SYD). Since I have no interests in flying in economy, I have asked if there are any business class seats flying through any other cities (SIN/HKG/NRT etc). QF operator checked the availability and finally found the business seats on JL via NRT but asked me to couch up with 45000 additional points and AUD 900 extra tax and 5000 points for service charge... I do understand that It is not QF's fault canceling this EK flight but Can QF reroute me with another OneWorld carrier with involuntary reroute reticketing without charging me anything? Or is my option just to take an economy seat on QF 24?? It would be great if you can help me with this matter.
Thanks guys!
Last edited by cdgbear; Jan 14, 2019 at 5:35 am Reason: wrong quote
Jan 13, 2019, 3:34 pm
#2
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 44,571
Qantas is just a travel agent in this , so would not expect it to open up space on its flights - it would be down to EK to organise any rebooking if it is going to do so
Beyond that you are entitled to a refund without penalty, so should be able to rebook without incurring a service fee
I would start by talking to EK about it rebooking onto another service from BKK-SYD
Beyond that you are entitled to a refund without penalty, so should be able to rebook without incurring a service fee
I would start by talking to EK about it rebooking onto another service from BKK-SYD
Jan 13, 2019, 3:35 pm
#3
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Melbourne
Programs: ►QFWP/LTG►VA WP►HyattExpl.►HiltonGold►ALL Silver
Posts: 21,991
@cdgbear To put it bluntly, the agent you spoke to was incorrect. Their guidance was not in line with Qantas Policy in such situations. (note the Emirates part is very important.)
Please see here for Qantas policy on OA (other Airline) changes to an 081- ticket:
https://www.qantas.com/agencyconnect...qantas-tickets
This change should be done at no cost to you @cdgbear.
Please see here for Qantas policy on OA (other Airline) changes to an 081- ticket:
https://www.qantas.com/agencyconnect...qantas-tickets
Process for Qantas Tickets (081) using Qantas Through Fares
This policy can be applied without reference or authority from the Qantas Agency Connect Team or Qantas Contact Centres.
If the new or changed flight is not acceptable or causes a misconnection to the ticketed stopover point or destination this policy applies.
Rebooking Options
Qantas permits the following:
New Flights Must:
This policy can be applied without reference or authority from the Qantas Agency Connect Team or Qantas Contact Centres.
If the new or changed flight is not acceptable or causes a misconnection to the ticketed stopover point or destination this policy applies.
Rebooking Options
Qantas permits the following:
- Rebook the other airline’s affected flight to an alternative flight operated by the same airline
- Rebook the other airline’s affected flight to another airline’s flight in accordance with the ticketed Qantas fare rule and route map in the applicable class of travel
- Rebook to an alternative Qantas connecting flight
- Reroute through an alternative Qantas gateway city as per the applicable fare rule and route map
New Flights Must:
- Be on the same day or a day either side of the ticketed flights
- Maintain the origin and destination of the ticket
- Be in the same class as originally ticketed EXCEPT for Qantas, Emirates or oneworld flights which can be rebooked to the lowest available class in the same cabin IF the original ticketed class is not available
Last edited by serfty; Jan 13, 2019 at 3:41 pm
Jan 13, 2019, 3:40 pm
#4
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Melbourne
Programs: ►QFWP/LTG►VA WP►HyattExpl.►HiltonGold►ALL Silver
Posts: 21,991
Qantas is just a travel agent in this , so would not expect it to open up space on its flights - it would be down to EK to organise any rebooking if it is going to do so
Beyond that you are entitled to a refund without penalty, so should be able to rebook without incurring a service fee
I would start by talking to EK about it rebooking onto another service from BKK-SYD
Beyond that you are entitled to a refund without penalty, so should be able to rebook without incurring a service fee
I would start by talking to EK about it rebooking onto another service from BKK-SYD
Jan 13, 2019, 3:42 pm
#5
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 44,571
That policy document is for travel agents and so can only be applicable to cash bookings since agencies cannot issue award tickets
I don't see how a guidance for a travel agent on rebooking paid tickets can be forced to a qantas direct booking for an award ticket , but can try asking
If this was a paid booking, then definitely would be in a stronger position
I don't see how a guidance for a travel agent on rebooking paid tickets can be forced to a qantas direct booking for an award ticket , but can try asking
If this was a paid booking, then definitely would be in a stronger position
Jan 13, 2019, 4:08 pm
#6
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Melbourne
Programs: ►QFWP/LTG►VA WP►HyattExpl.►HiltonGold►ALL Silver
Posts: 21,991
That policy document is for travel agents and so can only be applicable to cash bookings since agencies cannot issue award tickets
I don't see how a guidance for a travel agent on rebooking paid tickets can be forced to a qantas direct booking for an award ticket , but can try asking
If this was a paid booking, then definitely would be in a stronger position
I don't see how a guidance for a travel agent on rebooking paid tickets can be forced to a qantas direct booking for an award ticket , but can try asking
If this was a paid booking, then definitely would be in a stronger position
In any case, I am aware of recent success with such distressed Qantas award bookings when citing that policy web page in situations where the remedy had been initially denied.
Last edited by serfty; Jan 13, 2019 at 4:16 pm
Jan 13, 2019, 4:55 pm
#7
Original Poster
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 55
Thanks guys. I have spoken to Emirates agent and they said since this is Qantas issued award ticked (using Qantas points), I need to speak to Qantas agent to sort out the problem even though the flight cancellation was made by Emirates. I have been on the phone with Qantas now. They said there is no award space for a direct flight back from BKK to Sydney (QF24). So If I wants to be on that flight, I get 32000 points back plus AUD 160 refund. They also suggested to take JL to NRT then to SYD (Business) but to take these flight I need to spend 45000 points plus AUD 95 extra for tax plus 5000ponts for service fee!!! I know QF is not the one who cancelled the flight but I do not think it is fair! What do you think guys? Do I need to cough up more points for involanary reroute???
Jan 13, 2019, 5:59 pm
#8
Original Member
Join Date: May 1998
Location: Portland OR Double Emerald (QF and AA), DL PM/MM, Starwood Plat
Posts: 19,589
All QF has to do is refund the BKK-SYD lfight legally or by QFF policy, so anything better than that is by goodwill or your good luck. The rules are different if travel had commenced (yours had not) or for paid tickets. My advice would be to ask nicely for award space to be opened, perhaps on a different date, and maybe accept via SIN. Going via NRT is not worth it unless you want to holiday in Japan too.
Frustrating that award seats have so few rights, but the airlines write the rules for their benefit. Sometimes having FF status helps with the goodwill, but you dont show any status.
Frustrating that award seats have so few rights, but the airlines write the rules for their benefit. Sometimes having FF status helps with the goodwill, but you dont show any status.
Jan 13, 2019, 6:16 pm
#9
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Melbourne
Programs: ►QFWP/LTG►VA WP►HyattExpl.►HiltonGold►ALL Silver
Posts: 21,991
Thanks guys. I have spoken to Emirates agent and they said since this is Qantas issued award ticked (using Qantas points), I need to speak to Qantas agent to sort out the problem even though the flight cancellation was made by Emirates. I have been on the phone with Qantas now. They said there is no award space for a direct flight back from BKK to Sydney (QF24). So If I wants to be on that flight, I get 32000 points back plus AUD 160 refund. They also suggested to take JL to NRT then to SYD (Business) but to take these flight I need to spend 45000 points plus AUD 95 extra for tax plus 5000ponts for service fee!!! I know QF is not the one who cancelled the flight but I do not think it is fair! What do you think guys? Do I need to cough up more points for involanary reroute???
Did you ask them to refer to the policy for "Qantas and Other Airline Schedule Change" in relation to changes by Other Airlines when the other airline is EK or a oneworld member. They can make space for you.
Here is a recent example when previously denied with a CX change resulted on an award flight on QF metal being made available.
From The Australian Frequent Flyer: Rebooked - what can/should I do?
Jan 13, 2019, 6:41 pm
#10
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: SYD
Programs: QF WP/LTG | UA P
Posts: 13,530
If date flexible, check which QF flights have I class space abailable ( ie I > 0 ). For WPs these can sometimes be converted to award seats (normally U). This might help when speaking with QF if you can suggest a date with I class. Some days in (for example) September are J9 C9 D0 I0 - I expect QF wont be interested in helping on these such dates.
Jan 13, 2019, 8:14 pm
#11
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Singapore
Programs: QF LTG, SQ EGTP, Bonvoy LTG
Posts: 4,846
What is your date of travel? Did they look for/would you accept short haul economy (eg on CX or Jetstar Asia) to get to medium haul port for business class flight from there to home?
Ask them to ask EK to reroute you on EK via DXB
Ask them to ask EK to reroute you on EK via DXB
Jan 13, 2019, 8:22 pm
#12
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: MEL CHC
Posts: 21,006
If date flexible, check which QF flights have I class space available ( ie I > 0 ). For WPs these can sometimes be converted to award seats (normally U). This might help when speaking with QF if you can suggest a date with I class. Some days in (for example) September are J9 C9 D0 I0 - I expect QF wont be interested in helping on these such dates.
Request they put you on the QF flight
Jan 14, 2019, 12:08 am
#13
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Singapore
Programs: QF LTG, SQ EGTP, Bonvoy LTG
Posts: 4,846
Some reports on AFF of people being told:
To wait until Qantas have organised an alternative, and if you are unhappy with it, then to ring and see what the options are. The second agent told me they have been instructed NOT to rebook anyone at this stage.
Jan 14, 2019, 3:43 am
#14
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 905
I know nothing about the rules/regulations but have observed that seeing J award availability on QF24 and return is hens’ teeth stuff. It’s a sector I fly very often and can only recall getting a seat once in the past 10 or 15 years. Qantas has always flogged Emirates on this sector or Jetstar vis Singapore. More than once I’ve taken a cheap o/w to Singapore or Hong Kong , from where QF J award has greater availability.
Is it surprising that EK drop this flight? I take it Often and it always seems full ( just last week my sequence number on the boarding pass was 614...I didn’t know there are that many seats).
Is it surprising that EK drop this flight? I take it Often and it always seems full ( just last week my sequence number on the boarding pass was 614...I didn’t know there are that many seats).