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AF La Premiere Mex-Bom $2904 RT

AF La Premiere Mex-Bom $2904 RT

Old Apr 22, 20, 5:33 pm
  #1  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: GDL
Programs: Alaska, Aeromexico, Delta
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AF La Premiere Mex-Bom $2904 RT

Available from other cities of mexico as well, many dates available

https://bit.ly/2RZqzY0

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Old Apr 22, 20, 5:39 pm
  #2  
formerly Guanran Wang
 
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Location: HKG, PEK, IAD/DCA, LON, BHX,
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/VIA THE ATLANTIC/ MPM 12266
You can route via LAX/SFO for a longer LP flight
MEX LAX CDG BOM = 11,573miles
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Old Apr 22, 20, 5:40 pm
  #3  
formerly Guanran Wang
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: HKG, PEK, IAD/DCA, LON, BHX,
Programs: Alaska, BAEC, Asiana, Aegean, Enrich, Marriott/SPG, Hilton
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Also available for AF code using same fare basis.
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Old Apr 22, 20, 6:02 pm
  #4  
 
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: PRG
Programs: FB Platinum, A3 Gold, BA Silver
Posts: 992
No luck to buy it - price goes up and F goes to J class. (B/M - Delta)

Maybe lucky, sending 3k to airline now....
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Old Apr 22, 20, 6:13 pm
  #5  
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: DCA
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I haven't done the math but I'm pretty sure you'd have a better shot of flying LP by buying $3K of lottery tickets.
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Old Apr 22, 20, 6:14 pm
  #6  
 
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nothing
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Old Apr 22, 20, 6:35 pm
  #7  
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
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Is it bookable? Just for kicks tried BookWithMatrix but repices to 5000+ on Delta.com and errors out on Flight Network and Priceline
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Old Apr 23, 20, 12:45 am
  #8  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: MOW, RU
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Normally if it works on Matrix it shall work on DL.com too as DL uses ITA. Some ITA coding issues usually.
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Old Apr 23, 20, 3:51 am
  #9  
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Programs: AF/KL FB Plat ; A3 Gold ; HH Gold ; IHG Plat Amb
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This special Z fare MEX BOM is filled as a business class unrestricted fare and then ITA Matrix applies a differential on ATL CDG to upgrade this sector to first class.
In order to calculate this differential, ITA is looking for the cheapest unrestricted business class fare on ATL CDG and the cheapest unrestricted first class fare on ATL CDG. It then adds the difference to the fare component of the MEX BOM unrestricted through fare.

What happens here is that for weekend travel, many business class fares from the US to Paris seem to cost 150 USD more per direction than the fare for week day travel.
If you try the same routing on weekdays (like Tuesday-Tuesday MEX BOM MEX), you'll get a fare differential of 147 USD in the fare calculation: the ATL CDG F is the same but ATL CDG lowest unrestricted business class is 150 USD lower than during the week-end, so you need to pay a 147 USD difference to upgrade to F. On weekend, this difference is -3 USD so it does not apply and you get to fly this sector in First class. So this is not a booking code mistake.

If you want to fly via LAX for a longer and nicer F experience, then unfortunately, the fare differential is 1207.50 USD on weekend and 1357.50 USD on weedays for LAX CDG, so you won't be able to do that on the "cheap" although I don't consider 3000 USD very cheap.

ITA is not always reliable to price fare differentials and online booking sites even less, your only chance to get booked in F is to try your luck with a reliable human travel agent that uses the right GDS: in situations like this one, Amadeus and Sabre might have different pricing. You could also possibly call Delta and spoonfeed them the itinerary flight by flight with the correct booking class and see what happens.

FYI AF has the same fare thanks to the joint venture but they include the following rule (unlike Delta) on all its fares which does not allow for the fare differential logic.

Category 23: Miscellaneous Fare TagsTHIS FARE MUST NOT BE USED AS THE HIGH OR THE LOW FARE WHEN CALCULATING A DIFFERENTIAL. THIS FARE MUST NOT BE USED AS THE THROUGH FARE WHEN PRICING A FARE COMPONENT WITH A DIFFERENTIAL. NOTE - IN CASE OF CHANGE OF POINT OF DEPARTURE OR PARTIAL USE OF THE TICKET BY THE PASSENGER FOR THE ABOVE-MENTIONED CHANGE THE PASSENGER WILL BE CHARGED A FIXED FARE COMPLEMENT OF 1500EUR ALL TAXES INCLUDED. THIS APPLIES ONLY ON DAY OF TRAVEL AT THE AIRPORT.
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Old Apr 23, 20, 8:27 am
  #10  
 
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Originally Posted by ranskis View Post
This special Z fare MEX BOM is filled as a business class unrestricted fare and then ITA Matrix applies a differential on ATL CDG to upgrade this sector to first class.
In order to calculate this differential, ITA is looking for the cheapest unrestricted business class fare on ATL CDG and the cheapest unrestricted first class fare on ATL CDG. It then adds the difference to the fare component of the MEX BOM unrestricted through fare.

What happens here is that for weekend travel, many business class fares from the US to Paris seem to cost 150 USD more per direction than the fare for week day travel.
If you try the same routing on weekdays (like Tuesday-Tuesday MEX BOM MEX), you'll get a fare differential of 147 USD in the fare calculation: the ATL CDG F is the same but ATL CDG lowest unrestricted business class is 150 USD lower than during the week-end, so you need to pay a 147 USD difference to upgrade to F. On weekend, this difference is -3 USD so it does not apply and you get to fly this sector in First class. So this is not a booking code mistake.
Thanks, but where do we actually see that F fares are USD 150 higher or even lower than J fares? I do not see anything near for ATL-PAR or MEX-BOM fares.

And the bug is still there - this fare for sure was not supposed to be filed as 'business unrestricted', we have seen this several times already with DL Z fares. The industry fare type (business unrestricted) dictates booking classes on secondary airlines, however, within JV this is not an issue since the fares are unified and instead of generic restrictions they use same (or similar) booking classes for each partner fare primary booking class.
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Old Apr 23, 20, 1:00 pm
  #11  
 
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Originally Posted by Keter View Post
Thanks, but where do we actually see that F fares are USD 150 higher or even lower than J fares? I do not see anything near for ATL-PAR or MEX-BOM fares.

And the bug is still there - this fare for sure was not supposed to be filed as 'business unrestricted', we have seen this several times already with DL Z fares. The industry fare type (business unrestricted) dictates booking classes on secondary airlines, however, within JV this is not an issue since the fares are unified and instead of generic restrictions they use same (or similar) booking classes for each partner fare primary booking class.
The F fares ATL CDG don't depend on the day of the week as far as I can see.
However, check ATL CDG in all classes for business (apart from the full interlinable J unrestricted possibly) and you should find each fare to be filled twice: one for weekday travel and one for weekend travel at 150 USD extra per direction.
Not sure if the fare type dictates the booking class of secondary airlines, to me it's more the prime fare code that is linked to the booking class of secondary airlines.
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Old Apr 23, 20, 1:40 pm
  #12  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
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Originally Posted by ranskis View Post
The F fares ATL CDG don't depend on the day of the week as far as I can see.
However, check ATL CDG in all classes for business (apart from the full interlinable J unrestricted possibly) and you should find each fare to be filled twice: one for weekday travel and one for weekend travel at 150 USD extra per direction.
I think i am missing something - what the day of week fare level difference has to do with the diffference between F and J fare levels?
I have seen bugs with differentials calculations (outside ITA Matrix), it could be the one too unless we can fully explain.

Originally Posted by ranskis View Post
Not sure if the fare type dictates the booking class of secondary airlines, to me it's more the prime fare code that is linked to the booking class of secondary airlines.
Airlines have 2 ways to restrict/ assign booking classes for interline airline partners where they are permitted by the fare rules depending on who controls the situation (based on the interline agreement and well some arbitraty factors like bugs sometimes):

1) primary booking class restrictions - the primary carrier decides; this type of restriction is really limited to franchises normally, seldom to some other 'close' airlines
2) secondary booking class restrictions - the secondary carrier decides. The classic way to decide is based on the industry fare type, however, currently there is a possibility to link primary booking classes and secondary booking classes so airlines use this more modern tool.

Here we can see 'ALL BUSINESS' but if a secondary carrier (JL in this case) wanted to differentiate booking classes by the fare type they could say 'BUSINESS UNRESTRICTED' for example.
IF VIA DL ALL BUSINESS
VIA JL J REQUIRED WHEN AVAILABLE WITHIN JAPAN
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Old Apr 23, 20, 1:46 pm
  #13  
 
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Originally Posted by Keter View Post
Airlines have 2 ways to restrict/ assign booking classes for interline airline partners where they are permitted by the fare rules depending on who controls the situation (based on the interline agreement and well some arbitraty factors like bugs sometimes):

1) primary booking class restrictions - the primary carrier decides; this type of restriction is really limited to franchises normally, seldom to some other 'close' airlines
2) secondary booking class restrictions - the secondary carrier decides. The classic way to decide is based on the industry fare type, however, currently there is a possibility to link primary booking classes and secondary booking classes so airlines use this more modern tool.
An example where UA screwed primary vs secondary booking class restrictions is here (BOM-NA UA fare in PE bookable to A class on LH)
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Old Apr 23, 20, 5:40 pm
  #14  
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
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Originally Posted by ranskis View Post
The F fares ATL CDG don't depend on the day of the week as far as I can see.
Maybe you missed Keter's question but which 2 fares are used in the diff calc exactly?
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Old Apr 24, 20, 3:55 am
  #15  
 
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Originally Posted by FrankTalk View Post
Maybe you missed Keter's question but which 2 fares are used in the diff calc exactly?
I guess you missed the point of my reply: the 150 USD difference per direction is not between J and F, it is between any specific business class fare for week day travel and the same fare for weekend travel. It seems that full interlinable J and all F fares apply for travel any day, whereas promo J fares have only 100 USD additional fare for weekend travel. ITA calculates the differential at 147 USD for weeday travel, and since weekend travel is 150 USD higher in business class and first class stays the same, the difference is -3 USD so no differential is charged for weekend travel.

As I don't have expertflyer, I cannot identify which fare is used to calculate the differentials but if you have access to such tools, feel free to post here all business and first class fares on Delta between ATL and CDG in USD for departure 05AUG and return 15AUG.
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