FlyerTalk Forums

FlyerTalk Forums (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/index.php)
-   Practical Travel Safety and Security Issues (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/practical-travel-safety-security-issues-686/)
-   -   The rigors of a "Screening Test." (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/practical-travel-safety-security-issues/985021-rigors-screening-test.html)

19103_aa Aug 14, 2009 5:00 am

The rigors of a "Screening Test."
 
As I went through the checkpoint yesterday at one of my favorite airports, a woman bypassed a long line of passengers waiting to send their bags through the xray. Instead, she walked behind the set of tables leading to the xray, placed a handbag in front of all the other bags, then walked all the way around and entered the metal detector after flashing her badge. The screener behind the xray monitor barked out the requisite code for a weapon. A supervisor came over, patted the screener on the back, then warmly greeted the so called screen test person (apparently they were old friends). After completingsome paperwork, everyone went on their merry way.

1) Is this REALLY the screening test TSA performs to ascertain the quality of screening?
2) What logic does it make for the screen test person to be so obvious?

IslandBased Aug 14, 2009 5:34 am

Does that gun count on the weekly report?:rolleyes:

Superguy Aug 14, 2009 5:51 am


Originally Posted by PHLbuddy (Post 12224584)
As I went through the checkpoint yesterday at one of my favorite airports, a woman bypassed a long line of passengers waiting to send their bags through the xray. Instead, she walked behind the set of tables leading to the xray, placed a handbag in front of all the other bags, then walked all the way around and entered the metal detector after flashing her badge. The screener behind the xray monitor barked out the requisite code for a weapon. A supervisor came over, patted the screener on the back, then warmly greeted the so called screen test person (apparently they were old friends). After completingsome paperwork, everyone went on their merry way.

1) Is this REALLY the screening test TSA performs to ascertain the quality of screening?
2) What logic does it make for the screen test person to be so obvious?

You should ask that at PV and see what kind of response you get. I think I know how it'll go though. :rolleyes:

sbm12 Aug 14, 2009 6:08 am

LEO?

What makes you think this was someone testing the screener?

We Will Never Forget Aug 14, 2009 6:13 am

It was probably just a local test, which has nothing to do with the Red Team.

HSVTSO Dean Aug 14, 2009 6:15 am


Originally Posted by We Will Never Forget
It was probably just a local test, which has nothing to do with the Red Team.

Agreed. Though I've never heard of them using a gun in a local test bag, before. Of course, it's not conclusive that there was a gun, either.

19103_aa Aug 14, 2009 7:11 am


Originally Posted by sbm12 (Post 12224763)
LEO?

What makes you think this was someone testing the screener?

Because after all the hello, how are yous, the woman turned around and walked back out to the exit area.

LoganTSO Aug 14, 2009 8:49 am


Originally Posted by HSVTSO Dean (Post 12224793)
Agreed. Though I've never heard of them using a gun in a local test bag, before. Of course, it's not conclusive that there was a gun, either.

We have guns up here in Boston, former handguns which have been rendered inert by sealing everything up... barrel, chamber, slide.

Everything from semi-autos to derringers, I've seen.

However, the test form has a check block if the STSO observed that the TSO was aware of the test.

Tom M. Aug 14, 2009 9:19 am


Originally Posted by LoganTSO (Post 12225427)
However, the test form has a check block if the STSO observed that the TSO was aware of the test.


Amazing, absolutely amazing....

If they are aware of the test, it isn't a test. At best it is training.

Is there a check block if the STSO decides not to check the check block that the TSO was aware of the test, even though the TSO was aware, to make it appear that the TSO passed the "test"?

Boggie Dog Aug 14, 2009 9:57 am


Originally Posted by We Will Never Forget (Post 12224784)
It was probably just a local test, which has nothing to do with the Red Team.

Or it could be a test with the outcome predetermined.

What better way to improve screening scores?

LoganTSO Aug 14, 2009 10:21 am


Originally Posted by Tom M. (Post 12225571)
Amazing, absolutely amazing....

If they are aware of the test, it isn't a test. At best it is training.

For the most part that's what these are for... training purposes. Now if it's local ATI/STAN team (at least' that's we call the standardization trainers) their tests are going to be a bit more hard and if you fail to catch it... you're yanked off the x-ray and sent to be re-trained.


Is there a check block if the STSO decides not to check the check block that the TSO was aware of the test, even though the TSO was aware, to make it appear that the TSO passed the "test"?
No.

Tom M. Aug 14, 2009 10:30 am

Does anyone know if the TSA will send employees through the new "strip search" machines with weapons "artfully concealed" on their bodies for training purposes or testing?

Bart Aug 14, 2009 3:44 pm

*****

Superguy Aug 14, 2009 3:48 pm


Originally Posted by Bart (Post 12227404)
Red Teams and TSIs don't test in this manner. Without knowing all the facts, looks to me like it was a training exercise.

I don't see anything wrong with this.

If the exercise is to train the screener in weapons detection, making it obvious with the actions the OP stated makes the exercise a lot less meaningful. The way that it was handled, the screener would have had to have been completely dense to miss the fact that something MIGHT be out of the ordinary.

If the purpose was to test screener for training purposes (not for statistical or Red Team type tests), it was an epic fail. Can't emulate the real world with something that obvious.

We Will Never Forget Aug 14, 2009 4:28 pm


Originally Posted by Boggie Dog (Post 12225783)
Or it could be a test with the outcome predetermined.

What better way to improve screening scores?

My sources tell me it doesn't change anything, that these scores aren't sent to DC.

Bart Aug 15, 2009 4:46 am

*****

Tom M. Aug 15, 2009 5:24 am


Originally Posted by Bart (Post 12229449)
Ever hear of crawl, walk, run?

Good to know that the TSA puts screeners who can barely "crawl" on duty.

Makes me feel very safe:rolleyes:

Bart Aug 15, 2009 6:03 am

*****

Tom M. Aug 15, 2009 6:08 am


Originally Posted by Bart (Post 12229574)
It's a training term used by the Army, especially in Special Forces, I'm not surprised that you're not familiar with it.


LOL!

Actually I am familiar with the term.

And I don't use it as an excuse, like you do.


Again, if you can't crawl, you shouldn't be on duty.

Superguy Aug 15, 2009 6:34 am


Originally Posted by Bart (Post 12229449)
Ever hear of crawl, walk, run?

What happened sounded more like breast feeding.

Bart Aug 15, 2009 6:43 am

*****

Combat Medic Aug 15, 2009 12:59 pm


Originally Posted by Bart (Post 12229641)
There's no excuse offered. Seems that you just want to quibble. Well, I'll lay it out for you in terms you can understand, cupcake. After an officer has certified for the checkpoint, the training continues. That officer is qualified to make independent judgments in accordance with the standards laid out by the Aviation Transportation Security Act passed by Congress in 2001. The challenge is to improve that officer's proficiency starting from a baseline. This is done a number of ways, and I can only speak about how I do it at my airport. However, in this specific example, from what I read, it seems as though this was the "crawl" phase for that particular officer, and subsequent tests should be more challenging.

A good trainer needs to be able to determine the trainee's level of proficiency and adjust from there. Otherwise, that trainer shouldn't be training people.

What surprises me is that no one has taken the perspective of applauding the effort to improve screener proficiency through training. The critics have come up with their own version of how they would do it, but I suspect that they've never been responsible for training a workforce. Or, if they have, then either they forgot it or are just taking pot shots at TSA because to admit a good effort would go against their silly anti-TSA agenda.

It's clear where you stand.

The problem Bart is that if a screener's level of proficiency is such that the trainer needs to basically yell out "Training Weapon!!!!" then the screener shouldn't be on the line at all.

Tom M. Aug 15, 2009 1:06 pm

Hey cupcake,

If a training officer is worried a TSO is going to fail this test, they should have bigger concerns.

If a TSO is on duty and at the "crawl" stage, then they weren't trained very well.

Set the bar low enough, and anyone can meet expectations.

Bart Aug 16, 2009 6:05 am

*****


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 7:34 pm.


This site is owned, operated, and maintained by MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. Copyright © 2026 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Designated trademarks are the property of their respective owners.