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-   -   Personal electronic devices at takeoff and landing (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/practical-travel-safety-security-issues/750393-personal-electronic-devices-takeoff-landing.html)

straygaijin Oct 26, 2007 11:06 pm


Originally Posted by JakiChan (Post 8627371)
I remeber once being woken up by the bump of the plane landing. I was in first. My seat was reclined. My earphones were in and my iPod was playing. They let me sleep through landing and didn't even make my sure my seatback was up the upright and locked position! But oddly enough the plane didn't crash.


I am asleep with my ipod playing for the majority of the flights I am on. If the FA asks, I am happy to remove it, but they don't bother waking me. My seatbelt is done up though!

mrdodgy Oct 27, 2007 12:09 am

Yes I'd tap them on the shoulder, and if it was a bad weather approach I'd be calling a FA directly. ILS receivers are very very sensitive. No? They've all been intereference-hardened? Have a look at this:

http://asrs.arc.nasa.gov/docs/rpsts/ped.pdf
(PDF - full of jargon - boring to many people)

Spiff Oct 27, 2007 1:36 am

"waiting is the hardest part..."

Evidence? Please?

JakiChan Oct 27, 2007 4:22 am


Originally Posted by mrdodgy (Post 8628619)
Have a look at this

Yeah, I did. And that seems to be the biggest bunch of bull I've ever seen. They could just as well have said "INTERFERENCE CAUSED BY INVISIBLE MONKEY SCREAMING AT PILOT". That document has nowhere near what I'd call proof.

Global_Hi_Flyer Oct 27, 2007 9:02 am


Originally Posted by mrdodgy (Post 8628619)
Have a look at this:

NASA. The same agency that buried a safety study because it might hurt profits.

This report (as noted by NASA) is not statistically valid. It is also based on self-reports by aircraft and cabin crew.

And, most people don't realize that the ASRS reports are a "get out of jail free" card for pilots/other FAA licensees. In other words, if you self-report under ASRS - unless the violation was outright willful - the FAA will waive any possible certificate/license actions against you. Thus, there is an incentive to file these reports and blame something other than crew action.

ASRS is a tool, and nothing more, that can identify potential issues for further study. It, by no means. provides a definitive result.

"Out of an abundance of caution we should think of the children"

CessnaJock Oct 27, 2007 7:47 pm


Originally Posted by birdstrike (Post 8628356)
Airliners have holes blown in their aluminum skin while the electronics survive.

Airliners have also blown up or become uncontrollable for unknown reasons. What's your point?

birdstrike Oct 27, 2007 8:48 pm


Originally Posted by CessnaJock (Post 8632119)
Airliners have also blown up or become uncontrollable for unknown reasons. What's your point?

I guess my point is you are going to have to come up with cold, hard studies to support your speculation. Of course, those don't exist.

Funny anecdote: my IFR instructor really didn't like flying in actual. It really made her nervous, yet it was her job and she did it over and over again. She was an excellent pilot, and a good instructor, yet I had to wonder if she had made the best career decision. @:-)

mrdodgy Oct 27, 2007 9:14 pm


Originally Posted by JakiChan (Post 8628993)
Yeah, I did. And that seems to be the biggest bunch of bull I've ever seen. They could just as well have said "INTERFERENCE CAUSED BY INVISIBLE MONKEY SCREAMING AT PILOT". That document has nowhere near what I'd call proof.

How many phantom TCAS alerts were reported when a pax was using cellphone in the back? As well recent (not 10 year ago) ILS diversions? No, that's my safety.

(Yes I'm an IFR private pilot, I know exactly what and what not an ASRS report is)

birdstrike Oct 27, 2007 9:38 pm


Originally Posted by mrdodgy (Post 8632345)
How many phantom TCAS alerts were reported when a pax was using cellphone in the back? As well recent (not 10 year ago) ILS diversions? No, that's my safety.

That is the wrong question. The correct question is "How many phantom TCAS alerts were caused by cellphone use in-flight?".

Consider the logic, then ask if you would rather Lycoming used my logic, or yours, when building the engine you fly behind.

One pilot to another: Your thinking, my friend, is an early link in an accident chain.

CessnaJock Oct 28, 2007 9:44 am


Originally Posted by birdstrike (Post 8632286)
I guess my point is you are going to have to come up with cold, hard studies to support your speculation. Of course, those don't exist.

I don't know whether these meet your criteria of "coldness" and "hardness," but google crash lightning factor and read a few dozen reports. See if you can discern a pattern emerging.


Originally Posted by birdstrike (Post 8632286)
Funny anecdote: my IFR instructor really didn't like flying in actual. It really made her nervous, yet it was her job and she did it over and over again. She was an excellent pilot, and a good instructor, yet I had to wonder if she had made the best career decision. @:-)

I fail to appreciate the humor. I have never met a CFII who lacked a healthy respect for the hazards of flying blind. My guess would be that only the very cavalier or adrenaline junkie would take it lightly. The same personality type might misconstrue their prudence as nervousness.


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