TSA Mythbuster - Secure Flight 72-hr limit
#1
Original Poster
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TSA Mythbuster - Secure Flight 72-hr limit
MYTH: Under the proposed Secure Flight rule, I will not be issued a boarding pass unless I have booked my flight at least 72 hours in advance.
BUSTER: Under the Secure Flight proposed rule, airlines would be required to send passenger data up to 72 hours in advance, when available. This does not mean passengers will be automatically rejected if they need to book a last minute flight.
The Secure Flight system is designed to accommodate the changing needs of the flying public, without compromising security. TSA will have the ability to vet all passenger data provided against the No-Fly list and make boarding pass determinations up until the time a flight leaves the gate.
SOURCE: http://www.tsa.gov/approach/mythbust...re_flight.shtm
BUSTER: Under the Secure Flight proposed rule, airlines would be required to send passenger data up to 72 hours in advance, when available. This does not mean passengers will be automatically rejected if they need to book a last minute flight.
The Secure Flight system is designed to accommodate the changing needs of the flying public, without compromising security. TSA will have the ability to vet all passenger data provided against the No-Fly list and make boarding pass determinations up until the time a flight leaves the gate.
SOURCE: http://www.tsa.gov/approach/mythbust...re_flight.shtm
#2
FlyerTalk Evangelist
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MYTH: We live in a country where people are free to travel. As Justice William O. Douglas wrote for the US Supreme Court: "The right to travel is a part of the 'liberty' of which the citizen cannot be deprived . . . . Freedom of movement across frontiers in either direction, and inside frontiers as well, was a part of our heritage. Travel abroad, like travel within the country, . . . may be as close to the heart of the individual as the choice of what he eats, or wears, or reads. Freedom of movement is basic in our scheme of values."
BUSTER: People in the US now require the government's permission to travel, even leave the country. Other countries with exit restrictions: Russia (students must obtain an exit visa), People's Republic of China, Saudi Arabia (only for foreigners, not citizens), the defunct Soviet Union.
BUSTER: People in the US now require the government's permission to travel, even leave the country. Other countries with exit restrictions: Russia (students must obtain an exit visa), People's Republic of China, Saudi Arabia (only for foreigners, not citizens), the defunct Soviet Union.
Last edited by whirledtraveler; Oct 16, 2007 at 4:53 am
#3
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BUSTER: People in the US now require the government's permission to travel, even leave the country. Other countries with exit restrictions: Russian (for students), People's Republic of China, Saudi Arabia (only for foreigners, not citizens), the defunct Soviet Union.
What exit restrictions? If you have a valid passport, you can leave the country. Are you being restricted somehow I'm not? If so, why?
#4
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What exit restrictions? If you have a valid passport, you can leave the country.
#5
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What permission? You can purchase a ticket in a fake name, claim you have no ID, and still reach your destination domestically. Where is the "permitted" aspect?
What exit restrictions? If you have a valid passport, you can leave the country. Are you being restricted somehow I'm not? If so, why?
What exit restrictions? If you have a valid passport, you can leave the country. Are you being restricted somehow I'm not? If so, why?
#6
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Is this the indirect way to say you were incorrect as to the current state of affairs?
Sure there's a list. Are there possibly people on that list who shouldn't be? I'd bet on it. Are there people who shouldn't be allowed to leave the country? Absolutely. Are those countries you listed the only ones with exit restrictions for certain individuals? No. But if you want to list only your own little "exits of evil" to make a point, go right ahead. It's not a good point, but it's a point.
@ cpx
Please pin down the part where I need permission to travel in that link.
@ cpx
Please pin down the part where I need permission to travel in that link.
#7
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@ cpx
Please pin down the part where I need permission to travel in that link.
Please pin down the part where I need permission to travel in that link.
Forget the link, if you, by choosing to travel, submit your information and the government checks it before allowing you to leave, you do indeed need permission to travel. That's just logic and no amount of rhetoric can change that.
Last edited by whirledtraveler; Oct 16, 2007 at 5:33 am
#8
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#9
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When you are about to travel outside of the country, your information is
again reviewed. (indirect permission to leave) if for some reason if they think
you should not leave the country, DHS will make sure you do not leave the
country. Process is different, but concept is the same.
#11
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If a subsequent manifest is submitted less than 60
minutes prior to departure, the private aircraft pilot must resubmit
the arrival manifest and receive approval from CBP for the amended
manifest containing the added or amended information before allowing
the aircraft to depart the foreign location, or the aircraft may be, as
appropriate, denied clearance to depart,
......................
After CBP receives the
submitted information, DHS would send a message to the submitter of the
manifest information before departure from a foreign airport indicating
that the information has been received and specifying whether landing
rights have been granted at the requested airport, granted at a
different airport designated by CBP, or denied.
........................
After receipt of the manifest information, as in the case where the
manifest information is conveyed using a CBP-approved interactive
electronic transmission system, CBP would perform an initial security
vetting of the data and grant, deny, or restrict landing rights as
appropriate.
.........................
minutes prior to departure, the private aircraft pilot must resubmit
the arrival manifest and receive approval from CBP for the amended
manifest containing the added or amended information before allowing
the aircraft to depart the foreign location, or the aircraft may be, as
appropriate, denied clearance to depart,
......................
After CBP receives the
submitted information, DHS would send a message to the submitter of the
manifest information before departure from a foreign airport indicating
that the information has been received and specifying whether landing
rights have been granted at the requested airport, granted at a
different airport designated by CBP, or denied.
........................
After receipt of the manifest information, as in the case where the
manifest information is conveyed using a CBP-approved interactive
electronic transmission system, CBP would perform an initial security
vetting of the data and grant, deny, or restrict landing rights as
appropriate.
.........................
DHS is evaluating whether to inform the
pilot, in the event that CBP denies or restricts landing rights for the
plane, which passenger(s) has been identified by DHS on the selectee or
no-fly lists so that the pilot may better understand potential threats
to the security of the aircraft. In addition, such notification could
avoid additional flight delays or disruptions by allowing the pilot to
remove that individual from the flight until such time as the
individual resolves the selectee or no-fly designation with TSA under
TSA's redress system. Accordingly, DHS is soliciting public comments on
the economic costs and benefits of notifying a pilot about an
individual selectee or no-fly match being aboard the aircraft.
pilot, in the event that CBP denies or restricts landing rights for the
plane, which passenger(s) has been identified by DHS on the selectee or
no-fly lists so that the pilot may better understand potential threats
to the security of the aircraft. In addition, such notification could
avoid additional flight delays or disruptions by allowing the pilot to
remove that individual from the flight until such time as the
individual resolves the selectee or no-fly designation with TSA under
TSA's redress system. Accordingly, DHS is soliciting public comments on
the economic costs and benefits of notifying a pilot about an
individual selectee or no-fly match being aboard the aircraft.
This NPRM proposes to require the pilot of a private aircraft
departing the United States to a foreign port or location to submit a
departure manifest to CBP. Similar to the arrival manifest, the
departure manifest would contain information identifying all
individuals onboard the aircraft. The timeframe for submission of the
departure manifest would be no later than 60 minutes prior to departure
from the United States to a foreign port or location. This NPRM
clarifies the pilot's responsibility to ensure that a departure
manifest regarding all individuals onboard the private aircraft is
submitted
..............
2. Notice of Departure
This NPRM proposes to require private aircraft leaving the United
States for a foreign port or location to obtain clearance from CBP
prior to departing from the United States.
departing the United States to a foreign port or location to submit a
departure manifest to CBP. Similar to the arrival manifest, the
departure manifest would contain information identifying all
individuals onboard the aircraft. The timeframe for submission of the
departure manifest would be no later than 60 minutes prior to departure
from the United States to a foreign port or location. This NPRM
clarifies the pilot's responsibility to ensure that a departure
manifest regarding all individuals onboard the private aircraft is
submitted
..............
2. Notice of Departure
This NPRM proposes to require private aircraft leaving the United
States for a foreign port or location to obtain clearance from CBP
prior to departing from the United States.
3. Aircraft Required To Clear
The existing regulatory language in 19 CFR 122.61 exempts public
and private aircraft from leaving the United States for a foreign area
from having to obtain clearance prior to departing from the United
States. As such, CBP is proposing to revise paragraph (a) of Sec.
122.61 to indicate that private aircraft leaving the United States for
a foreign area are required to obtain clearance from CBP as set forth
in the language proposed for Sec. 122.26. The paragraph will further
state that all other aircraft, except public aircraft, leaving the
United States or the U.S. Virgin Islands are required to clear if they
carry passengers and/or merchandise for hire or take aboard or
discharge passengers and/or merchandise for hire in a foreign area.
..................
E. Landing Rights
CBP currently requires all aircraft arriving at a landing rights
airport to request permission to land, known as landing rights, from
CBP. Given CBP's authority to deny landing rights within the United
States and to restrict landing to airports designated by CBP,\14\ this
NPRM proposes to expressly state CBP's authority to deny permission to
land in the United States and/or limit aircraft landing locations.
The existing regulatory language in 19 CFR 122.61 exempts public
and private aircraft from leaving the United States for a foreign area
from having to obtain clearance prior to departing from the United
States. As such, CBP is proposing to revise paragraph (a) of Sec.
122.61 to indicate that private aircraft leaving the United States for
a foreign area are required to obtain clearance from CBP as set forth
in the language proposed for Sec. 122.26. The paragraph will further
state that all other aircraft, except public aircraft, leaving the
United States or the U.S. Virgin Islands are required to clear if they
carry passengers and/or merchandise for hire or take aboard or
discharge passengers and/or merchandise for hire in a foreign area.
..................
E. Landing Rights
CBP currently requires all aircraft arriving at a landing rights
airport to request permission to land, known as landing rights, from
CBP. Given CBP's authority to deny landing rights within the United
States and to restrict landing to airports designated by CBP,\14\ this
NPRM proposes to expressly state CBP's authority to deny permission to
land in the United States and/or limit aircraft landing locations.
Search for rulemaking USCBP-2007-0064-0001
(direct link not possible)
#12
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This is all well and good, and does certainly point to the requirement for permission as it pertains to air travel.
But where is it written or stated that the right to travel without permission extends to ALL modes of transportation?
But where is it written or stated that the right to travel without permission extends to ALL modes of transportation?
#14
Join Date: Aug 2004
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Posts: 97
http://www.cbp.gov/linkhandler/cgov/.../apis_faqs.doc
and see Question 3. Passengers are 'not cleared' unless they receive a response (permission to travel) when they will be cleared or become a selectee.
Compare with Question 16 for handling those on a list not allowed to fly.
#15
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As a matter of practicality, eliminating the ability to fly presents a de-facto prohibition to traveling to many destinations.