FlyerTalk Forums - Oh BEEEP No!

FlyerTalk Forums (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/index.php)

- Practical Travel Safety and Security Issues (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/practical-travel-safety-security-issues-686/)

- - Oh BEEEP No! (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/practical-travel-safety-security-issues/1195835-oh-beeep-no.html)

http://www.centreforaviation.com/new...industry/page1

Quote:

Panel by Tom Ridge, a former Secretary of Homeland Security...

...Nonetheless, they did come up with some very specific goals.

Implement a risk-based trusted traveler program. Doing so would allow greater focus on those who may pose a greater threat.
Improve the preparation of travelers by disseminating more information about screening earlier in the booking and planning process.
Encourage fewer carry-ons. The panel attributed the increased complexity of the process in part to bag fees that increase carry-on luggage. In a move that will doubtless generate an airline response, they recommended that one free checked bag be included in the ticket price and that all be more diligent in reducing hand baggage.
Reduce repeat screening of those arriving on International flights and connecting to domestic services.
Allow frequent international travelers to enroll in the US trusted traveler program.
Give TSA full authority in the checkpoint area and reduce confusion of security “ownership”.
Develop a comprehensive technology procurement strategy and make certain that programs are funded for the life of program rather than year-to-year.
Develop and implement well-defined risk management processes.
The group urged Congress and the administration to move towards implementing the suggestions, citing polls that indicate Americans are quite displeased with the present arrangement and many have cut back on travel to avoid the system.

Roger Dow, President and CEO of USTA, closed by saying, “When combining the staggering economic consequences of the current system with the widely held views of the traveling public – and with the American way of life hanging in the balance – the picture becomes clear. We must find a better way and build a new traveler-focused system for aviation security.”

Absolutely, unequivocally no way. I mean it. That can not happen. That bunch of fascist led thugs cannot be given free reign.

Does this imply that we would no longer be able to call for LEOs if a problem arises? Would this take the checkpoints out of LEO jurisdiction?

Quote:

Originally Posted by eturowski (Post 16059556)

Does this imply that we would no longer be able to call for LEOs if a problem arises? Would this take the checkpoints out of LEO jurisdiction?

I'm no lawyer, but that's the conclusion I'm drawing. Citizens would be left without hope of succor.

Quote:

Originally Posted by eturowski (Post 16059556)

Does this imply that we would no longer be able to call for LEOs if a problem arises? Would this take the checkpoints out of LEO jurisdiction?

I would take that statement item to indicate that some (all) TSA checkpoint trolls would enjoy police powers.

Totally unacceptable!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boggie Dog (Post 16059595)

I would take that statement item to indicate that some (all) TSA checkpoint trolls would enjoy police powers.

Totally unacceptable!

Well, I don't see this happening without some kind of authorization from Congress. Additionally, general police authority would cast doubt on the legality of the "administrative" search regime.

I will go for this part if this sentence is finished correctly:

"In a move that will doubtless generate an airline response, they recommended that one free checked bag be included in the ticket price" and

the airlines provide full replacement insurance for contents regardless of value and the airlines pay full replacement with a minimum of $10,000 per bag for any bag they lose.

Under these conditions I would not carry on and instead check a bag at least half the time. :rolleyes: Actually I would still carry on and check a dummy bag and hope they lose it. ;)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boggie Dog (Post 16059595)

I would take that statement item to indicate that some (all) TSA checkpoint trolls would enjoy police powers.

Totally unacceptable!

Well, I don't see this happening without some kind of authorization from Congress. Additionally, general police authority would cast doubt on the legality of the "administrative" search regime.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cartoon Peril (Post 16059879)

Well, I don't see this happening without some kind of authorization from Congress. Additionally, general police authority would cast doubt on the legality of the "administrative" search regime.

Pistole doesn't need authorization from anyone. His mandate is to do whatever he wants in the name of security. All he has to do is tell the President that this is needed to keep people safe. No hearings, no public input, no Congress, just like the sex assaults. I still don't see how it's legal for a beaurocrat to tell his employees they can touch strangers in places they should be arrested for touching. What if he said they could shoot anyone that refused to be searched? Sounds ridiculus, last year someone saying that being seen naked and routinely getting sexually assaulted at the airport would be ridiculus. I never understood how the Nazis could get so people on those trains. Now I'm starting to understand.

Quote:

Originally Posted by eturowski (Post 16059556)

Does this imply that we would no longer be able to call for LEOs if a problem arises? Would this take the checkpoints out of LEO jurisdiction?

Don't LEOs usually just side with the TSOs....

LEOs can do an administrative search. Happens all the time at court house entrances. As such, it is not so much as who does the administrative search as to what and how the search is conducted.

In some discussions that I have had with a congressional staffer, they noted that some would like TSA to have LEO credentials. Under the current system, (i.e. those currently employed) the vast majority of the TSO would probably not be able to pass the LEO standards. As such, if they were weeded out, the system might be much more professional and efficient. Think what if TSOs had to have the same level of education and LEO training as those in the Secret Service/Federal Marshall.

BTW I am not saying I am for it. But I am certainly all for raising greatly the standard for those being hired as TSOs.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cartoon Peril (Post 16059879)

Well, I don't see this happening without some kind of authorization from Congress. Additionally, general police authority would cast doubt on the legality of the "administrative" search regime.

I have little confidence that Congress would resist this. But if things go this far it ramps up the likelihood of more TSA cases coming before the Supreme Court.

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlyingUnderTheRadar (Post 16059962)

...the vast majority of the TSO would probably not be able to pass the LEO standards. As such, if they were weeded out, the system might be much more professional and efficient.

Efficient brown shirts are scarier than incompetent ones. We need to keep pushing the State initiatives. Outlaw the current TSA behavior, or for that matter outlaw TSA. The States have the resources to push this - almost no one else does.

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlyingUnderTheRadar (Post 16059962)

BTW I am not saying I am for it. But I am certainly all for raising greatly the standard for those being hired as TSOs.

Yeah, right. http://abc.daytonsnewssource.com/sha...vid_6103.shtml

That really worries me! :eek:

Quote:

Originally Posted by srirams (Post 16059961)

Don't LEOs usually just side with the TSOs....

Not always. I have read stories on ft where the LEO understands that the clerk is being an idiot, and told the traveler that they are free..

Quote:

Originally Posted by ElizabethConley (Post 16059520)

http://www.centreforaviation.com/new...industry/page1

Absolutely, unequivocally no way. I mean it. That can not happen. That bunch of fascist led thugs cannot be given free reign.

Give TSA full authority in the checkpoint area and reduce confusion of security “ownership”.

I'm thinking that TSA really is trying to get the authority to do custom style searches along with the authority to detain passengers like they do at border crossings. Because there is no other reason for them wanting total authority and security ownership of the checkpoint areas other than to have complete control of the passengers so they can do the searches they want since Pistole is former FBI and we all know that during the current searches he is looking for more than just items that can bring down a plane.