chollie

Actually, another frequent poster here (can't remember who) did just that on one occasion. It was late in the evening and the TSOs clearly wanted to shut down and go home. He declined to go through TSA screening to exit the airport after coming in on an international flight. I think it took summoning LEOs, threats and the time an patience on his part to out-wait them before they blinked and he was escorted outside. I think the late hour worked in his favor. He couldn't go 'back' because he had just cleared customs/immigration and you can't go back through once you have cleared. TSA was saying he couldn't go forward to leave the airport without going past them. He was content to wait them out.

I think the outcome might have been much more uncomfortable if it had happened early in the day. I think he might have been tied up for hours and depending on the mood of the LEOs, I think they might have tried to say he was interfering with the screening process. Their argument would have been that he wanted to leave the airport through the sterile area (the only way to leave the airport if you have arrived on an international flight) so he had to submit to screening. The eventual outcome wouldn't have mattered - they could have treated him like TSA and ABQ PD treated Phil Mocek (or like TSA treated the guy that told them he'd call an LEO if they 'touched his junk'). Even if you 'win' in the end, they can make it very very inconvenient for you in the short term.

Fredd

Is this it?

DeafBlonde

I'm with you, Fredd! Anybody that wants to screen me on the way into the restroom will get stiff-armed, NO DOUBT ABOUT IT!!!

chollie

Nope, but there was a reference in that thread to this:

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/trave...hreat-tsa.html

It was Polonius. I thought it was ATL (and he might have had a similar encounter at ATL and I just can't find it). This was at IAD. Clearly something would get real ugly real fast if lots of pax tried this during daylight (or busy) hours.

CelticPax

Yep, this and the reports of extensive screening at Union Station now.

I knew it was bad, but I didn't realize how bad. Their tentacles are getting into everything very fast now.

I'd say you could still do rental car, so you don't have to put miles on your car. But I foresee some sort of random check their too in the future.

(I really do, I'm not exaggerating.)

saxman66

This begs the question that is the Savannah station sterile, or does it have a sterile area? I've never been to that particular station but it looks like there is station and a platform. It looks like you can access the platform from outside according to Google Maps unless there is a fence blocking it. Even if they are looking for drugs, they can't legally do that without probable cause. That and the fact that they not Law Enforcement Officers. They cannot detain you, nor can they arrest you. They can certainly call a LEO to question you. So if it were me, I would have refused. It's no different than walking down the street.

FlyingUnderTheRadar

As others have posted and I would have to do a search but there was the recent case of the gentleman in ATL who refused to be searched after clearing Immigration/Customs so that he could leave the airport. It took 2 hours but eventually he was allowed out of the airport without a search. He was escorted by three LEOs and I believe a TSO.

Cartoon Peril

This used to be tin-foil hat stuff, but it is coming to a reality. On the car thing, there exist multiple technologies to track the location of a vehicle, and I suspect that GPS could theoretically be installed on every vehicle in the country.

I doubt it the courts would accede to this directly, but they might be persuaded to go along with something smaller where an "administrative search" type of exception could be gotten at.

For example, if you wanted to drive a vehicle to the airport, you need a vehicle that can be tracked via GPS. This gradually expands, so that if you want to drive a vehicle on a strategic transportation asset (such as the Golden Gate Bridge) you would need it to be GPS tracked, and so on.

The default then would become tracking on all vehicles as a matter of market forces, and eventually it would become a crime to disconnect the vehicle's GPS, much as it is a crime to roll back the odometer now.

This sounds crazy, but I never thought we'd be seeing what we have now.

G_Wolf

I guess this really is Random & Everywhere.

Cartoon Peril

According to Wikipedia 180 people a day board or detrain at the station, for a total of about 65,000 per year. By comparison, a smaller regional airport such as Eugene Airport handles 740,000 annually, over ten times as many.

The few people using the Savannah train depot are hardly worth setting up a sterile area for it. There is just no way that TSA could afford to establish sterile areas for transportation points handling such a low volume, and indeed it would seem to be particular waste to screen people getting OFF the train at such a low volume destination.

So some other motive other than transportation security must have been going on here.

PhoenixRev

My guess is it's a fishing expedition for contraband.

I find it hard to believe the TSA and/or DHS would seriously believe that Osama Bin Ladin is sitting in his cave in Pakistan saying, "Yesterday was the World Trade Center. TOMORROW IS THE SAVANNAH TRAIN STATION!!! BWAHAHAH. (Psst. Guys? Where's this Savannah?)"

Then again, it is TSA and DHS.

gatelouse

Time for a letter-writing campaign to Amtrak and NARP. I for one will cancel all my Acela Express bookings if I'm stopped by a single TSA rep on my Amtrak travels, coming or going.

Amtrak, paradoxically, may be better able to push back against DHS than the airlines. They have their own police force, own/rent a number of their station buildings, and are a quasi-government entity themselves.

Diehard fans of train travel will be sure to put up a fight at every encounter—just go to any railfan site for countless stories of train photographers vs. security. Your usual sheeple they ain't.

Isobel

Right on. People have got to start sticking together on this -- it won't be until enough people start resisting nudoscopes and pat-downs that we have any hope of stopping this train before we're all flattened into submission.

And for those who say, I can't resist, I'll miss my flight/trip/vacation/business meeting...fine, don't stand up. And don't complain 10 years from now when you're living in a police state the extent of which even George Orwell couldn't imagine.

I tweeted it. We've got to reach a wider audience for the TSA's thuggery than the small group of people who frequent this bb.

erictank

Two words for those attempting to engage in such an illegal search. Okay, three - GET. F***ING. BENT.

And walk away, going calmly about your business. If they attempt to interfere, *YOU* call the cops on THEM.

Side note - "If you don't want to submit to the Nude-O-Scope and/or perp-frisk, you don't have to fly." Oh, wait - they're doing this unConstitutional crap at BUS AND TRAIN STATIONS now, too. What now, jerks? What other methods of travel should those of us seeking to retain their Constitutionally-protected rights just give up, in order to temporarily assuage your irrational, hysterical fears?

What the hell is happening to my country?

IrishDoesntFlyNow

Anyone who owns a vehicle with OnStar (or any similar service) already has GPS installed, by default. And you can't just pull a fuse to disconnect it on later models -- it's integrated into more of the electrical system than just the GPS. I'll be keeping my 15-year-old Jeep.

~~ Irish