Participate in Opt-Out Day without flying?

Old Nov 16, 2010, 12:52 am
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Participate in Opt-Out Day without flying?

A coworker is thinking about participating in Opt-Out Day by purchasing a refundable ticket, clearing security, and then leaving the airport. But it was suggested this could somehow be construed as unlawful interference with the screening process, since he'd have no intent of actually flying, and would just be trying to add to the chaos.

I have not had a chance to research the applicable laws, but I fear the TSA would try to make some sort of civil penalty or criminal charge stick.
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Old Nov 16, 2010, 1:01 am
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Originally Posted by morcheeba
A coworker is thinking about participating in Opt-Out Day by purchasing a refundable ticket, clearing security, and then leaving the airport. But it was suggested this could somehow be construed as unlawful interference with the screening process, since he'd have no intent of actually flying, and would just be trying to add to the chaos.

I have not had a chance to research the applicable laws, but I fear the TSA would try to make some sort of civil penalty or criminal charge stick.
If he cleared security how would anyone know if he walked back out again? He could just claim he felt unwell and decided not to fly.

He has a valid ticket!
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Old Nov 16, 2010, 1:05 am
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Sounds like your coworker has a decent plan, if he's willing to execute it. He's not required to chat with the TSA or anybody else about his plans or advance intent not to fly.

Assuming he goes through the screening process "opt out" of course, and clears to airside, then turns around and goes through the exits then gets his ticket refunded, what is the TSA going to do? What was unlawful about going through the screening process? Also, TSA doesn't check ID's at the exits, last I heard, so how would they know he left? What criminal charge would there be? What civil penalty would apply?

And why do YOU "fear" anything anyway? After all, you're not the one putting themselves out there--your co-worker is.
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Old Nov 16, 2010, 1:13 am
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Originally Posted by jiejie
And why do YOU "fear" anything anyway? After all, you're not the one putting themselves out there--your co-worker is.
Exactly. Thus far, I've declined the invitation to join him in this stunt, for the reason I mentioned.
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Old Nov 16, 2010, 1:14 am
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Originally Posted by morcheeba
Exactly. Thus far, I've declined the invitation to join him in this stunt, for the reason I mentioned.
There is nothing to fear beyond the usual rush of a protest
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Old Nov 16, 2010, 3:05 am
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Originally Posted by morcheeba
A coworker is thinking about participating in Opt-Out Day by purchasing a refundable ticket, clearing security, and then leaving the airport. But it was suggested this could somehow be construed as unlawful interference with the screening process, since he'd have no intent of actually flying, and would just be trying to add to the chaos.

I have not had a chance to research the applicable laws, but I fear the TSA would try to make some sort of civil penalty or criminal charge stick.
That's a time-honored technique for gaining airside access when you're not actually flying, e.g. to get into a lounge, for example.

If your coworker's not one of us, he should be.
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Old Nov 16, 2010, 3:36 am
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Originally Posted by morcheeba
A coworker is thinking about participating in Opt-Out Day by purchasing a refundable ticket, clearing security, and then leaving the airport. But it was suggested this could somehow be construed as unlawful interference with the screening process, since he'd have no intent of actually flying, and would just be trying to add to the chaos.

I have not had a chance to research the applicable laws, but I fear the TSA would try to make some sort of civil penalty or criminal charge stick.
There is no way they could make a case out of that. You went through, got to your gate, and changed your mind -- how are they going to prove otherwise?

In any event, please check the "meet-ups" planned for several airports around the country -- people who cannot fly can still hand out leaflets, etc.
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Old Nov 16, 2010, 4:54 am
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Just as a thought how many entrances and exits could you make on one refundable ticket?
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Old Nov 16, 2010, 5:15 am
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I've considered doing this for NOOD too. My only reservations (other than my time) are some guilt about needlessly blocking an airline seat on an otherwise swamped day. No matter how you look at it, there's a good chance you are depriving someone else of that seat, even if you cancel the ticket hours before flight.

Were I to do it, I would pack an "appropriate" carry-on bag for a day-trip. I.e., a laptop and a book and my sunglasses, etc. Going through with nothing whatsoever (and having no checked luggage) might draw suspicion unrelated to the scope of the exercise.
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Old Nov 16, 2010, 5:22 am
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Originally Posted by PhilaBurbTom
Just as a thought how many entrances and exits could you make on one refundable ticket?
I like the way you think.

Edited to add: Since they write on your Boarding Pass at the ID checkpoint, that would show you already went through and might tip them off.

But if you printed out, oh heck, half a dozen identical boarding passes at home before going to the airport... and went to a big airport with multiple security checkpoints... {wicked evil grin}

Last edited by MFMeow; Nov 16, 2010 at 5:25 am Reason: Add further thoughts...
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Old Nov 16, 2010, 5:25 am
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Originally Posted by PhilaBurbTom
Just as a thought how many entrances and exits could you make on one refundable ticket?
I wouldn't want to be seen more than twice by the same screeners to avoid drawing attention for things unrelated to the protest. A second trip is easily explained by "I forgot something." Bad press for acting "suspicious," getting arrested for things unrelated to the nude-o-scope, or getting caught "gaming" the system, will not help the NOOD message.

But at a big airport with a lot of checkpoints, you could make a lot of entrances. Or you could time your visit with a shift change and make 4 trips through 1 checkpoint.
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Old Nov 16, 2010, 5:55 am
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Originally Posted by studentff
I've considered doing this for NOOD too. My only reservations (other than my time) are some guilt about needlessly blocking an airline seat on an otherwise swamped day. No matter how you look at it, there's a good chance you are depriving someone else of that seat, even if you cancel the ticket hours before flight.
I would almost agree with you on this but the airlines have had ample time to step up to the plate and put pressure on TSA and the government to do something about these atrocities. To my knowledge, not one has done so yet (at least not with any real conviction). If they are not part of the solution, they are part of them problem. Their loss ultimately, and maybe that lost revenue will help spur them into action.
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Old Nov 16, 2010, 6:14 am
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I'd like to participate by handing out the leaflets at my home airport. I can't really afford a refundable ticket and frankly, I'm trying to steel myself up for the fun and games I'll experience in January.

I will go search for the appropriate thread (I'm pretty sure I saw one about a week ago) regarding handing out flyers at airports, but if anyone knows offhand where the thread is or what the title of the thread is, I'd appreciate the info so I don't waste others' time and to get info on how one legally does this form of protest.
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Old Nov 16, 2010, 6:31 am
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Originally Posted by morcheeba
A coworker is thinking about participating in Opt-Out Day by purchasing a refundable ticket, clearing security, and then leaving the airport. But it was suggested this could somehow be construed as unlawful interference with the screening process, since he'd have no intent of actually flying, and would just be trying to add to the chaos.
I'd be very interested what would happened if he had a late night flight and came in the morning, and just kept going through the C/P over and over and over and over and over again... Are there rules against that? Can you opt out all day long? The opt-out party train?

Originally Posted by studentff
Bad press for acting "suspicious," getting arrested for things unrelated to the nude-o-scope, or getting caught "gaming" the system, will not help the NOOD message.
Except that it's opt-out day. You are simply going through security, over and over. They have no rules against it, so it's a little like complaining that someone is asking for a tenth refill on a endless cup of coffee. If you don't specify...

And an arrest, along with the exact details is bad PR for them. It shows how much of a security theater they actually are. "Man enters secure area 20 times in one day and never flies!"

Last edited by Kiwi Flyer; Nov 17, 2010 at 1:36 am Reason: merge consecutive posts
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Old Nov 16, 2010, 7:15 am
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Originally Posted by studentff
I've considered doing this for NOOD too. My only reservations (other than my time) are some guilt about needlessly blocking an airline seat on an otherwise swamped day.
As a former corporate-level airline manager, I can tell you with absolute certainty that you should not feel guilty. Airlines forcast oversells and no-shows into the equation, so you will not be depriving someone of a seat in this situation.

What the airlines also want is revenue. If you purchase a refundable ticket, clear security, then request a refund, you have deprived the airline of revenue, and hence one of the overall goals of this campaign. The airlines will notice if refundable tickets are processed on NOOD.

Everyone should note, though, that you may not get as lucky as John Tyner. He had a non-refundable ticket refunded by AA. I would not recommend expecting a similar outcome. It's likely that he found a sympathetic TA. The rest of us may not be so lucky.

I have already purchased several refundable, round-trip tickets for NOOD across a number of airlines, and will opt-out through the c/p, leave, and request refunds 10 minutes prior to departure. Letters will follow to the CEO of every airline explaining that I refuse to fly under these conditions.

To the OP's point, all that is required is that one clears "security". If you clear the c/p and then decide to leave, there is no law against it. They only require that you complete the process.
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