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Originally Posted by LuvAirFrance
(Post 15125317)
Bizarre. Who created DHS and TSA? The leftists?
I assume that you asked wanting to know. If your comment was a rhetorical one and an attempt to bring politics into this discussion, please, let's avoid that. This is not a political problem at this point but it may be resolved in the realm of politics. Late addition: WND is still at it today! They are beginning to post experiences. Updated article is at the top of the first page. They have posted an Online Petition. Also a click through to the poll results that are coming in are interesting. An update from World Net Daily, still top of the web site, still piling on. They are bringing in the politics now, which is what they do with most reporting on issues, but that is what has made them a popular site with the ones that read them. These guys are serious. And, when they grab an issue they are tenacious. |
Originally Posted by InkUnderNails
(Post 15125365)
Not leftists as such, but a republican administration that agreed an authoritarian solution was in order, usually a "leftist" type solution, but this time applied by a center-left administration, not an ideologically conservative administration.
You and I are told increasingly that we have to choose between a left or right, but I would like to suggest that there is no such thing as a left or right. There is only an up or down–up to a man’s age-old dream, the ultimate in individual freedom consistent with law and order–or down to the ant heap totalitarianism, and regardless of their sincerity, their humanitarian motives, those who would trade our freedom for security have embarked on this downward course. -Ronald Regan |
Originally Posted by janetdoe
(Post 15132291)
Left-right is a false dichotomy:
You and I are told increasingly that we have to choose between a left or right, but I would like to suggest that there is no such thing as a left or right. There is only an up or down–up to a man’s age-old dream, the ultimate in individual freedom consistent with law and order–or down to the ant heap totalitarianism, and regardless of their sincerity, their humanitarian motives, those who would trade our freedom for security have embarked on this downward course. -Ronald Regan And in the determination of what is truly right or wrong, people from across the spectrum of politics and beliefs will find common ground. It is a beautiful and amazing thing to see it happen in such a dynamic and exuberantly uncontrolled way. |
Originally Posted by JoeBas
(Post 15123137)
And let's not forget that the TSA is Bush's misbegotten abortion of a legacy to start with...
DHS/TSA was part of the Bush administration response to 9/11, but it was enthusiastically supported by the Democratic Congress. It was Tom Daschle who said, "You can't professionalize [airport security] until you federalize," or words to that effect. Neither liberals nor conservatives dared risk looking soft on terrorism. More recently, the Obama administration and Janet Napolitano have been more egregious still. But the beautiful thing about today's situation is that it unites WorldNetDaily and Washington Times fans with NPR, Mother Jones, ACLU fans against TSA. Putting aside all the other disagreements about how much government ought to do and how to pay for it, at the end of the day people of all political stripes who understand how America is built agree that TSA in inherently anti-American. When Drudge, WND, Alex Jones, Reuters, NPR, and the unions are all gunning for TSA at the same time, I'm impressed. |
Originally Posted by BearX220
(Post 15132359)
Neither liberals nor conservatives dared risk looking soft on terrorism. More recently, the Obama administration and Janet Napolitano have been more egregious still.
I would expect a law professor who taught courses in due process and equal protection law to be a little more zealous in protecting citizens' civil rights. :( |
Originally Posted by janetdoe
(Post 15132517)
After all the talk about civil rights and liberties, due process and habeas corpus in Guantanamo, this is the most disappointing thing about the Obama administration.
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Originally Posted by InkUnderNails
(Post 15132319)
And in the determination of what is truly right or wrong, people from across the spectrum of politics and beliefs will find common ground. It is a beautiful and amazing thing to see it happen in such a dynamic and exuberantly uncontrolled way.
Worth a read, right up to these final lines: ...But in that same period, more than 150,000 people have been murdered in the United States. We haven't put the entire U.S. on lockdown -- or even murder capitals like Detroit, New Orleans and Baltimore. While reducing the murder rate to zero is very desirable, we also understand that the costs, in terms of liberty and resources, are too great. But when it comes to air travel, 9/11 seems to have stripped away our ability to put things in perspective. Politicians feed into that paranoia with their rhetoric. And lobbyists and government contractors feed on the paranoia. |
This isn't a right/left issue. I know someone who is a die hard leftie who is in the "Anything for Security" crowd.
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Originally Posted by janetdoe
(Post 15132291)
Left-right is a false dichotomy:
You and I are told increasingly that we have to choose between a left or right, but I would like to suggest that there is no such thing as a left or right. There is only an up or down–up to a man’s age-old dream, the ultimate in individual freedom consistent with law and order–or down to the ant heap totalitarianism, and regardless of their sincerity, their humanitarian motives, those who would trade our freedom for security have embarked on this downward course. -Ronald Reagan [sic :)]
Originally Posted by LV702
(Post 15134999)
This isn't a right/left issue. I know someone who is a die hard leftie who is in the "Anything for Security" crowd.
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