Can you tell me what "too easy on passengers" means?

Doesn't this concern you? Do you keep an eye on them for violations? I definitely don't agree with DHS and TSA but I do appreciate your posts.

Scares the living crap out of me.

Yeah, it does concern me. I think one of them is on the way out. And I do watch them (maybe I have an inflated ego thinking I can do something about it?). But I think they are just talk, besides being rude. Haven't seen them do anything.

Oh, I guess having come from prison work they have taken the attitude everyone is lying to them, they think we should conduct pat-downs as they did in prison, which is more invasive around the crotch area than what we do, with the passenger up against the wall, and they think (have told me) you can not screen people and provide customer service at the same time.

But these are only a couple of men; there are a few others who have prison work experience - one worked up to the captain level - who are actually pretty good guys. And most everyone I know at SAT wants the other ones gone. Not fun to work with them.

But besides them being rude, or sharp, or abrupt with passengers, whatever you want to call it, I haven't seen them do anything bad to people. Not that being rude is ok! It isn't.

I've told one of the them to quit, as they are obviously not happy at TSA. But he's full of excuses as to why he can't or will not. But, personally, I think he will eventually be force out..or maybe that's just my wish..

Seems to validate my earlier post, eh!

What eariler post?

#223

I found it.

I just started a thread in PR about

Arizona has nothing on Illinois - well Elmhurst

It is not just DHS and TSA. The whole country is buying the Stasi propaganda.

I don't think so. As I said this is several TSOs out of around 270 at SAT. And as I said I haven't actually seen them do anything more invasive to a passenger. And because they have worked for TSA for years, it isn't as if their attitude is recent.

It's not just physical, it is attitude which most people pick up on real quick.

I have no doubt that how you are addressed by someone helps you form an opinion about that encounter. How your property is treated by someone providing a service lets you know if that person/group is deserving of continued patronage.

With the airlines the passengers are pretty much held hostage and have no other choice except to stop flying. Some just can't do that and continue to earn a living.

That's why I and others speak out here and have no qualms dropping a dime on TSA employees when things are not right. It is pretty much all we can do.

TSA could make it right by acknowledging that passengers are TSA's bread and butter instead of treating the public like enemies or criminals.

edit to add: You need to expand your view point beyond one airport.

Regarding reporting what a TSO may find I cite this court ruling. I think most here will not enjoy the read:

http://www.ca3.uscourts.gov/opinarch/043841p.pdf

A man set off the WTMD, was hand-wanded and then the man claims that after he refused to remove the contents of his pockets the TSO actually REACHED into his pocket, finding the drugs and removed them. The man was arrested. And the court found that even if the TSO reached into the mans pocket without conscent, it satisfied the 4th admin search criteria. Wow! I didn't know I could conduct searchs like that! It's nit in the SOP, BTW; someone alarms at the pockets and refuses to empty said pockets, our procedure is to get the LEO. Here it seems to say I have the right to reach into said pocket... Or did I read that wrong? Seriously, I'm not a lawyer....

Further, the court rule that suspicionless searchs are perfectly fine. Does that give any of you heart-burn??


Not only that, the court rejected the defendants claim that once the TSO identified the object in his pocket - drugs - he should have had the right to leave the airport. The court rejected his claim.

Oh well.

Who's to say these judges got it right?

Let's reverse that: if a court rules against TSA is it then fair to ask if they got it right?

Our nations history does have examples where our courts have made mistakes. For example, at one time our courts upheld slavery - extreme example yes. But let me then state and ask, until a decision is overturned, is that the ruling that then applies?

In this case I agree with both of your comments but I also certainly believe that the judges completely screwed it up. They are letting agencies with suspicions outside of their purview be McCarthyists.

What is the rule regarding laptops coming out of bags?

On this point I have to agree with them. Despite anything that TSA says it is impossible for it or its employees to provide "customer service" for the simple reason that not a single person TSA screens is a "customer". I don't want to get in an argument about semantics but it is important to understand what is going on in the interplay between passengers and TSA.

A customer is one who voluntarily engages in a transaction or activity with the provider of a product or service. There are several principles inherent in the concept of a voluntary transaction. One is the ability to take one's business to a competitor. Another is the ability to negotiate the terms and conditions of the transaction. Lastly, a customer is allowed to change his mind and terminate the transaction.

None of these principles apply in the interaction of passengers with TSA. The involvement is far from voluntary; there is no possibility of being screened by some authority other than TSA (or a TSA contractor as at SFO). If I am part way through the screening I cannot change my mind and leave. And, far from being able to discuss and possibly negotiate the appropriate level of screening, TSA keeps many of its rules and procedures hidden from the public under the label of "SSI".

The ludicrous idea of a passenger being able to decide what level of screening he wants to purchase demonstrates just how ridiculous any talk of "customer service" is. TSA may wish to treat people with respect and dignity, just as most commercial enterprises do, but this is only a tiny aspect of "customer service". Is is really only the bare minimum standard of behavior that decent people should aspire to - a floor, not a ceiling. That TSA decided it needed to have a "customer focus" (i.e. treat people decently) after many years of existence is a damning indictment, not a praiseworthy development.

Let's be clear about the reality. Passengers are not TSA's customers. TSA is not offering a service that people can choose or not. TSA is a government entity, enforcing secret regulations on the traveling public with the full weight of governmental power. If a passenger is unhappy with the results of his interaction with TSA, that's just too bad. If TSA is unhappy the passenger is subject to administrative fines, retaliatory action, and criminal prosecution. That doesn't look much like a normal customer/provider relationship to me.

However; I may be wrong. If I really am a customer, tell me how to take my "airport screening business" elsewhere. I'd really like to patronize one of TSA's competitors.