Aknoff

Hoping the group can help me troubleshoot some issues my parents have encountered with Norwegian. Here's the backstory: They were flying BOS-CDG-BOS in Premium Economy on Norwegian in order to get to river cruise (they left 3 days buffer just in case). Booked with Chase Sapphire Reserve. Last night, Norwegian's 789 went tech and they cancelled the flight. I implored them to get documentation of everything for EU261 and travel insurance purposes. Not sure what transpired but Norwegian rebooked them JFK-CDG for the outbound, which is currently being operated by a Wamos A332 (someone please correct me if this is wrong). Norwegian didn't offer to get them to JFK from BOS, so parents booked a car and will plan to get reimbursed. Now, they're about 6 hours out and it looks like they're booked in economy. It looks like Wamos' A332 has business, so in my mind that's where they should be rebooked. Am I correct on this? Best way to convince Norwegian of this?

Add to this, in haste my dad booked a one-way Delta ticket BOS-CDG, and thought he could get Norwegian to pay for it ($2100 per person). I explained that would never happen and he runs the risk of having his return cancelled. If they choose to not fly Wamos (beyond the seating issue the online reviews are freaking them out...I know, I know), is there any way to get Norwegian to honor the back half of their RT ticket or will they be stuck in Paris?

To summarize: how do they get into Wamos' business or fly out on a different ticket without cancelling their return leg? Thanks for the help!

Often1

First, separate compensation issues from the practical issues they face. The two don't mix well.

Second, Norwegian will not reimburse the cost of the rental or the self-help ticket.

Third, your parents are likely stuck in steerage, but they can make the argument for J. It is possible that J is not being operated at all on the flight.

Fourth, if they do fly the alternate carrier, they do need to make certain that their return is preserved.

As to restitution, Norwegian is on the hook for compensation of EUR 600 per passenger for the delay (presuming that they will be delayed by 4 or more hours, EUR 300 is 3+ hours). It is also on the hook for a reimbursement (not compensation) of 75% of the segment fare for the downgrade (not just the fare difference). But, it will take forever to collect this and given Norwegian's financial stability, there is a good chance that they will have a claim for these amounts which will never be paid.

Mwenenzi

If they have comprehensive travel insurance (disruption) I would be contacting the insurance company now.
Given Norwegian's current financial stability flying with them is always going to be a risk.
A DL return may have been about the same price as the one ways purchased [2 x $2100]

Aknoff

Thanks for the quick feedback. They ended up getting themselves on AF BOS-CDG-BOS in J. I’m assuming they just purchased this fare outright but didn’t get a chance to connect before they took off. They also cancelled their Norwegian ticket (which was an option presented to them) and are expecting a refund. As a follow up question, since they cancelled their Norwegian ticket due to the cancellation of their first flight, are they still entitled to EU261 or is that out since they flew a different airline in the end? They were still delayed more than 6 hours due to Norwegian’s mechanical delay. I’m totally unclear on if/what they can claim in this scenario. Thanks again!

LondonElite

No EC261 compensation is due as they elected to receive a refund. They didn’t actually travel. There endeth their relationship with Norwegian. You don’t say whether or not the DL tickets were bought (I suspect not), but nobody is going to reimburse those. All that is left is to question whether your parents will get some love from their travel insurance for buying they last minute J seats on AF, but I don’t see a reason under what circumstances they might.

There are plenty of lessons here, not the least of which is remaining calm and methodically going over options before acting. I understand seniors probably don’t realise it, but coming to FT and getting help in real time is often the best option. Sorry to hear about the rubbish start to their holiday.

SK AAR

Sorry, but I don't believe this correct. One can elect to cancel/full refund and still claim comp. for cancellation under EU Reg. 261/04

Whether DY will pay/will be able to pay is a different Q.

oliver2002

If you booked all this with your CSR, I would call the insurance people at Chase and work out your options. I'm sure they will compensate the difference of the last minute AF ticket and the Norwegian ticket. Just make sure premium economy was not available on the AF flight.

warakorn

No!

EC261/2004 fully applies.
Norwegian owes you EC261/2004 compensation of EUR 600 per passenger due to the cancellation.

Pax cannot fly on a cancelled flight - naturally.

If Norwegian refuses rebooking onto another carrier, Norwegian has to refund that extra ticket (article 8).
This obligation is only waived, in case the pax elect to go for a full refund of the Norwegian ticket.

MSPeconomist

I'm confused. A DL/AF business ticket BOS-CDG would cost a lot more than $2100 per person, especially at a walk up fare, whether OW or RT. Could they have purchased premium economy?

LondonElite

OK, maybe Norwegian owes them for the cancellation, but I see them flighting or claiming exceptional circumstances. If the parents get a refund, that's probably the best that can be hoped for. I'd love to know whether any travel insurance will cover a business fare booking under these conditions, but I seriously doubt it.

Often1

There are several threads per day on roughly the same facts. FT is a microcosm of the universe of travelers, so the issue is broader.

The simple fact is that booking Norwegian is a mistake.
1. At best, one has to worry even if things go smoothly.
2. Cancellations are routine and rebookings are expensive and inconvenient, e.g. out of other airports.
3. Compensation for cancellations & delays, reimbursements for downgrades, and even duty of care expenses are nothing to count on as the carrier may well be insolvent before any claim is paid. In that instance, all one has is an unsecured claim and the chances of collecting anything significant are at best, slim.

If one is insistent on booking Norwegian, one ought to have high end comprehensive travel interruption, reimbursement, and incidental coverage as a hedge. Remember that the least costly ticket is not necessarily the least costly journey.

MSPeconomist

It might be possible to do a chargeback on the credit card used to pay for the Norwegian tickets. That would be better than having an unsecured claim if the airline goes bankrupt. Of course it wouldn't pay any EC261 obligations.

Often1

I doubt that the refund will be an issue. I would counsel against a chargeback unless the refund is denied. At least until the parents are back from their trip. They may well want the return and thus, it is important to cancel the outbound and preserve the return

Norwegian has no current interest in increasing chargebacks as the card issuer holdback rate is increasing due to the credit risk and the more chargebacks, the worse it gets.

Aknoff

Thanks all. Looking back this was happening quickly so I can see where I made it confusing. While at one point they did book a one way DL ticket I cautioned against taking that path since I was concerned Norwegian wouldn’t honor the return segment. Flash forward a few hours and I got a text saying they were flying AF in J and we’re planning to cancel their Norwegian ticket. They landed a few hours ago so still unclear on the whole picture but assuming that AF J is a round trip, which they booked because Norwegian cancelled their original flight, do they have an EU261 claim? They’re planning to get the original Norwegian ticket refunded in addition.

I’ve advised them to get with Chase as soon as possible to discuss options, what’s covered etc. My hope is somewhere between 261 and Chase they chip away at the cost of what I’m sure was a costly last minute J fare. Thanks.

warakorn

Norwegian may claim extraordinary circumstances.
But it is not an extraordinary circumstance.

I haven't done any research about current insurance offers. However, most insurance do not cover risky airlines. Air Berlin, Germania, Monarch, Malev etc. were already on the blacklists of insurance companies - some time before they went bust.

Overall, it is certainly not a good idea to buy a walk-up fare ticket in Business Class - In practical terms, Norwegian will only reimburse that money with a court judgement. Morever, until this court judgement had been granted, Norwegian could be bust already.

Norwegian is not listed on the covered supplier list at (e.g.) Allianz.

https://partner.allianztravelinsuran...ier%20List.pdf

Or read here: