TaiwanAir

According to EVA Airways' website at http://www.evaair.com/html/b2c/engli...e/Fleet_facts/ "The new LOPA, Lay Out Passenger Accommodations will be in service starting from June 2007." Here is the new seat map on Boeing 747-400 with 36 Premium Laurel class seats, 56 Elite class seats and 280 Economy class seats!

USDHS1984

Yea!!!! And even Y upstairs. Woo Hoo!!!! This has to be that mystery "74W" that is coming to LAX as BR12 at the end of May. (and then apparently moving to YVR at the end of August)

jimbo99

Well spotted! I'll be flying BR68 in June so maybe can try it out.

36" pitch economy upstairs... That looks like a good catch for economy fliers.... I can see that cheesed-off eliters may decide that the extra cash and availability problems just for 2" more leg room isn't worth it. If they were to set aside some seats for FFs, it could be a boost for their programme.

Sad to see that "Elite" is a small 777-style pokey meat-in-the-sandwich cabin. But at least with 2-4-2 the width should be back to what it was when it was deluxe on the 747.

USDHS1984

Since they have always blocked out exit rows and some of the other prime seats prior to check-in for everyone except gold or diamonds. It would seem a no brainer that only golds or diamonds would be able to pre-reserve upstairs 36" economy seats.

jimbo99

No-brainer... but that seems to be the way they operate these days...

I tried booking 21D/G on Elite for a flight recently. (Slightly better leg room..). Was told I would have to wait 3 days because you can't reserve a seat more than 100 days in advance. (Used to be able to.) So they noted on the PNR "Gold pax prefers 21D/G".

Rang Taipei reservations within a couple of hours of opening on the first day for which reservations were possible. Was told they had already been allocated - and to non-FFs too. They didn't seem to know (=lie?) whether these seats are normally blocked for golds. Previously they had told me that they are.

Sadly the new 747 config has no exits in Elite. But at least you can "circulate" and dwell in the exits, which you can't do in the 777 Elite.

USDHS1984

I have concluded that recently they are blocking seats and many people working for them simply do not know how to assign them to elites. I have been told the exit row is full, and then called the next day and been assigned an exit row no problem. I have also been told an exit row was full at the transfer desk in TPE but went upstairs to the lounge and been assigned the exit row no problem. Agreed that there is a glitch in the system somewhere. I often get the impression that many of the reservation agents have access to exactly the same information and options available on-line and nothing more. In fact I have occasionally wondered if they are sitting there on the other end of the phone using evaair.com instead of an internal booking system.

On the subject of the new 747's I'm looking at BR11/BR12 TPE-LAX in June and still seeing the "74W". If I go to book C it shows Super Business class on a 74W but if I go to book F it says "Sorry! The flights you chose are sold out or no service class, please re-select travel date!". "74W" is now also linked to a seat map, however in classic EVA style it is a broken link .

It seems reasonable however to assume that "74W" is the new 747 and it will premier TPE-LAX. (And BR11 would be "my flight" )

jimbo99

Yep you are right about booking "blocked" seats. And when dealing in Taiwan, its difficult to get to the bottom of things - agents do seem to give you the BS rather than a straight answer. I do know that some are simply not authorised to unblock a seat. Eg in London it usually seems to be the "bloke on the end of the desk" that does the magic. The "girls" have to give him the PNR and get him to unblock it.

In Taiwan I generally get a Chinese speaker to deal with them. They really seem not to expect golds to be non-Taiwanese, and the higher up you go the poorer the English skills.

Case in point: at Taipei's gold check-in a few days ago I had my usual hassle. I asked the guy to put a "priority" label on my luggage rather than the "club" label. He told me that golds don't get priority baggage handling. I pointed out that they do and showed him the page in the guide (from his desk) that says they do. Well he was all very friendly about it and spoke to his colleague. He then said that the "club" sticker does mean a kind of priority, but "second" priority. I said that my experience was that it just doesn't work on BR67 to London. Worse than that, most PAX start at BKK. So anything that isn't "priority" tagged from TPE comes out after all the BKK luggage - ie towards the end. He noticed the "priority" tag already on the suitcase and asked me where I got it from. I explained that I got it in London (much to his horror) - and that most airlines seem to "priority" tag luggage for golds. I explained my theory that baggage handlers can't be expected to recognise anything other than "priority" as meaning "priority".

Sympathetic to all this, he calls his supervisor. A nervous chap appears with very dodgy English. He immediately capitulates saying "we will give you the priority tag, this time only" and seemed anxious to scuttle off. I try to explain that I'm not asking for any special favour... just they promise priority baggage handling for golds and that's what they should do. I'd accept a "club" tag if that worked. Second priority (behind C or diamonds) is fine. Also if they didn't promise priority I wouldn't ask for it. I don't think he really understood my point - just wanted to get out of the situation. He said he would make a report about the "London problem".

(Although the "book"/website doesn't distinguish between "gold" and "diamonds" - both get "priority" baggage handling regardless of class, it turns out that check-in staff are instructed to give proper "priority" tags to diamond fliers only.)

username

I have always wondered what LOPA meant although "Lay Out Passenger Accommodations" still does not make sense to me. Can someone explain? Does it mean all passenger? Is this a Boeing term?

Also, the new LOPA 744s will have 56 Elite seats insead of 142 or 104 in ED. That is a huge reduction. I guess once all the flights for a route have Elite, they will jack up the price.

I also wonder if the seats will be wider than the 777 Elite. Wouldn't that reduce the commonality and add to maintenance complexity? Or, they have to use different seats anyway.

Someone pointed out to me that the good news is the service differential between Y and Y+ will actually narrow - with AVOD PTV in Y and headrest. So, it will be interesting to see how the load/prices will end up.

Finally, anyone know how many they will retrofit and the schedule?

Thanks.

jimbo99

Also, the new LOPA 744s will have 56 Elite seats insead of 142 or 104 in ED. That is a huge reduction. I guess once all the flights for a route have Elite, they will jack up the price.

Well this is the situation with the 777s. Whenever there is some kind of promotion on BR67/8, it never applies to Elite. I think their idea is that people will go for PL class. Availability is a real killer - you often have to book weeks in advance and then face problems changing your flight, even on a flexible ticket. I've been waitlisted as gold for as long as 4 months when booking 7 months in advance for several December flights. In the end I gave up.

I also wonder if the seats will be wider than the 777 Elite. Wouldn't that reduce the commonality and add to maintenance complexity?

I don't think so. Its not a huge difference. I think a bigger problem will be managing the 36" economy seats upstairs. By running 36" upstairs and 33" inch economy downstairs, its almost like having two distinct classes. I'm sure it will end in tears as EVA "do deals" with tour groups and FFs and others are disappointed they can't get a 36" seat.

Frankly I would much preferred to see PL upstairs in the nose and upstairs. (Which would still give the same number of PL seats.) Then expand the Elite cabin by bringing it forward to the Exits. (Ie the config would be the same as the 747 with F in the nose - F and C cabins becoming PL and ED becoming Elite.)

That would maintain Elite as a "serious product" and avoid two different kinds of Economy. PL being split between upstairs and downstairs would not be a great problem in my view.

EWANMEBABE

seems to me they have lost the plot completely

AndyFlyer

I hear that by year end these 744s will be dedicated to LON! Wouldn't it make more sense to have PL upper deck and nose, and increase Elite to Zone B? As previous posters say, there will be tears!

jimbo99

Its very, very sad in my opinion. "Deluxe" class was what distinguished EVA in my opinion and they are killing it off.

Their economy/business products offer nothing not already offered by other airlines.

sadiqhassan

If you can get 36" in Y, who needs Elite Class?

ihate2fly

Any word on entry-into-service dates? BR is upgrading only 3 of the B744s and retiring the others as the B773ERs come into service. Service on the LOPA will be to LHR and YVR. The B773ER is being dropped from LHR and moved to CDG. All the US destinations will be B773ER.

PMMMColonel

Who really cares about the upgrade. Even the 777 is no better than high end cargo for this service. I found it just slightly better than US domestic first. No fun for 12 plus hours. I tired it in April 07.

I do not see ever flying a second tier airlines on long haul trips.