China airlines flight cancelation
Jan 22, 2014, 10:26 pm
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 27
China airlines flight cancelation
I recently flew with China airlines to Bangkok from New York on a return ticket.
The airline has changed the schedule on the return, from a 1 hour layover in Taipei to a 15 hour stopover.
This new schedule does not suit me at all. The airline is refusing to put me on a different carrier or refund the ticket.
Do I have any rights with the airline or an I stuck with whatever China Airlines deems its "best efforts"?
Dealing with the airline on the telephone is very tedious as they always have to check with a different office. 2 weeks of my vacation has been spent on the phone trying to figure this out.
The airline has changed the schedule on the return, from a 1 hour layover in Taipei to a 15 hour stopover.
This new schedule does not suit me at all. The airline is refusing to put me on a different carrier or refund the ticket.
Do I have any rights with the airline or an I stuck with whatever China Airlines deems its "best efforts"?
Dealing with the airline on the telephone is very tedious as they always have to check with a different office. 2 weeks of my vacation has been spent on the phone trying to figure this out.
Jan 23, 2014, 1:22 am
#2
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: CAN, LAX, TPE
Programs: AA, AS, CI, DL, UA
Posts: 2,896
You can try to use their own tariff to make them follow it. If they do not follow, you can complain to DOT.
http://www.china-airlines.com/en/en_def.pdf
10.2 Cancellation, Changes of Schedule, etc.
10.2.1 When circumstances so require, Carrier may without notice substitute alternate Carriers or aircraft, or cancel, terminate, divert, postpone or delay any flight or the further right of carriage or reservation of traffic accommodation and determine if any departure or landing should be made, without any liability except to refund in accordance with these Conditions of Carriage and the laws, regulations and orders of the country where the flight is departing, the fare and Baggage charges for any unused portion of the ticket, if it considers that it would be advisable to do so:
10.2.1.1 because of any fact beyond its control (including, but without limitation, meteorological conditions, acts of God, force majeure, strikes, riots, civil commotion, embargoes, wars, hostilities, disturbances, or unsettled international conditions) actual, threatened or reported, or because of any delay, demand, condition, circumstance or requirement due, directly or indirectly, to such fact; or
10.2.1.2 because of any fact not reasonably to be foreseen, anticipated or predicted; or
10.2.1.3 because of any government regulations, demand or requirement; or
10.2.1.4 because of shortage of labour, fuel or facilities, labour difficulties of Carrier or others.
10.2.2 If due to circumstances beyond its control CAL cancels or delays a flight, is unable to provide previously confirmed space, fails to stop at a Passenger's stopover or destination point, or causes the Passenger to miss a connecting flight on which the Passenger holds a reservation, CAL will abide by the laws, regulations and orders of the country where the flight is cancelled or delayed, and shall either:
10.2.2.1 Carry the Passenger on another of its scheduled Passenger services on which space is available; or
10.2.2.2 Reroute the Passenger to the destination indicated on the ticket or applicable portion thereof by its own scheduled services or the scheduled services of another Carrier, or by means of surface transportation. If the sum of the fare, excess Baggage charge and any applicable service charge for the revised routing is higher than the refund value of the ticket or applicable portion thereof, CAL shall require no additional fare or charge
from the Passenger, and shall refund the difference if the fare and charges for the revised routing are lower; or
10.2.2.3 Make a refund in accordance with the provisions of Article 11; and shall be under no further liability to the Passenger.
11.3 Involuntary Refunds
If the Carrier cancels a flight, fails to operate a flight reasonably according to schedule, fails to stop at a point to which the Passenger is destined or ticketed to stopover, is unable to provide previously confirmed space or causes the Passenger to miss a Connecting Flight on which the Passenger holds a reservation, the amount of the refund shall be:
11.3.1 if no portion of the Ticket has been used, an amount equal to the Fare paid;
11.3.2 if a portion of the Ticket has been used, the refund will be the higher of:
11.3.2.1 the one way Fare (less applicable discounts and charges) from point of interruption to destination or point of next stopover, or
11.3.2.2 the difference between the Fare paid and the F are for the transportation used;
You can file with DOT here...
http://www.dot.gov/airconsumer/file-consumer-complaint
http://www.china-airlines.com/en/en_def.pdf
10.2 Cancellation, Changes of Schedule, etc.
10.2.1 When circumstances so require, Carrier may without notice substitute alternate Carriers or aircraft, or cancel, terminate, divert, postpone or delay any flight or the further right of carriage or reservation of traffic accommodation and determine if any departure or landing should be made, without any liability except to refund in accordance with these Conditions of Carriage and the laws, regulations and orders of the country where the flight is departing, the fare and Baggage charges for any unused portion of the ticket, if it considers that it would be advisable to do so:
10.2.1.1 because of any fact beyond its control (including, but without limitation, meteorological conditions, acts of God, force majeure, strikes, riots, civil commotion, embargoes, wars, hostilities, disturbances, or unsettled international conditions) actual, threatened or reported, or because of any delay, demand, condition, circumstance or requirement due, directly or indirectly, to such fact; or
10.2.1.2 because of any fact not reasonably to be foreseen, anticipated or predicted; or
10.2.1.3 because of any government regulations, demand or requirement; or
10.2.1.4 because of shortage of labour, fuel or facilities, labour difficulties of Carrier or others.
10.2.2 If due to circumstances beyond its control CAL cancels or delays a flight, is unable to provide previously confirmed space, fails to stop at a Passenger's stopover or destination point, or causes the Passenger to miss a connecting flight on which the Passenger holds a reservation, CAL will abide by the laws, regulations and orders of the country where the flight is cancelled or delayed, and shall either:
10.2.2.1 Carry the Passenger on another of its scheduled Passenger services on which space is available; or
10.2.2.2 Reroute the Passenger to the destination indicated on the ticket or applicable portion thereof by its own scheduled services or the scheduled services of another Carrier, or by means of surface transportation. If the sum of the fare, excess Baggage charge and any applicable service charge for the revised routing is higher than the refund value of the ticket or applicable portion thereof, CAL shall require no additional fare or charge
from the Passenger, and shall refund the difference if the fare and charges for the revised routing are lower; or
10.2.2.3 Make a refund in accordance with the provisions of Article 11; and shall be under no further liability to the Passenger.
11.3 Involuntary Refunds
If the Carrier cancels a flight, fails to operate a flight reasonably according to schedule, fails to stop at a point to which the Passenger is destined or ticketed to stopover, is unable to provide previously confirmed space or causes the Passenger to miss a Connecting Flight on which the Passenger holds a reservation, the amount of the refund shall be:
11.3.1 if no portion of the Ticket has been used, an amount equal to the Fare paid;
11.3.2 if a portion of the Ticket has been used, the refund will be the higher of:
11.3.2.1 the one way Fare (less applicable discounts and charges) from point of interruption to destination or point of next stopover, or
11.3.2.2 the difference between the Fare paid and the F are for the transportation used;
You can file with DOT here...
http://www.dot.gov/airconsumer/file-consumer-complaint
Jan 23, 2014, 5:30 am
#3
Join Date: Oct 2012
Programs: Dynasty Frequent Flyer (Elite Plus),Accor Platinum
Posts: 1,866
Wallydd
Can you give me the dates you flew from New york to Taipei? and which flight you was supposed to take?
Cheers.
Update: I just checked the flights in and out of Taoyuan airport and it seems there are no options to fly out at such apart from that final flight by CI.
So your next opportunity to fly out would have been around 7-8am in the morning on a direct flight. I would have assumed that for them not to put on the plane
that their flight must have been extremely overbooked otherwise they would have op-upped if possible to make room for you.
And even more surprising that their a330 flight was not overbooked as well considering that flight is even harder to ever get on due to the better times for locals to fly out on compared to 7am.
Also would like to know if they put you up for the night in Taoyuan novotel?
Can you give me the dates you flew from New york to Taipei? and which flight you was supposed to take?
Cheers.
Update: I just checked the flights in and out of Taoyuan airport and it seems there are no options to fly out at such apart from that final flight by CI.
So your next opportunity to fly out would have been around 7-8am in the morning on a direct flight. I would have assumed that for them not to put on the plane
that their flight must have been extremely overbooked otherwise they would have op-upped if possible to make room for you.
And even more surprising that their a330 flight was not overbooked as well considering that flight is even harder to ever get on due to the better times for locals to fly out on compared to 7am.
Also would like to know if they put you up for the night in Taoyuan novotel?
Last edited by tris06; Jan 23, 2014 at 6:17 am
Jan 27, 2014, 9:49 pm
#4
Original Poster
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 27
Follow up:
I finally managed to sort something out with China Airlines at the very last minute. After many phone calls and even a visit to their Bangkok office. They actually got useful once I presented myself in person and asked for a print out of their own rules.
Firstly they wanted to put me in to "Taoyuan Hotel", which after some questioning was "within one hour from the airport" and no it was not the Novotel, not an option. In order to stay at the hotel I would have gotten to the hotel at about 1am with a need to depart at 4:30am. They were nice enough to throw in a breakfast voucher at the hotel which they reluctantly agreed I would not have been able to use. I offered to change it to the earlier flight BKK - TPE so I could sleep and eat the evening meal, they would not agree to this.
After asking for the details in writing so I would have something to show the bank when they refund my credit card they offered Eva air - The schedule was OK but not nearly as good as the original ticket, so I refused.
At 5:30 on Friday afternoon they offered ANA (Stop in Tokyo) with a better schedule than I originally had, so I took it.
It took me hours of phone calls and an hour of my time visiting the office.
By all rights according to their own rules;
11.3.2.1 the one way Fare (less applicable discounts and charges) from point of interruption to destination or point of next stopover.
I should have been refunded a full fare one way ticket which is probably more than I paid for the entire return ticket.
In hindsight if any airline pulls this sort of crap again, I will give them 2 phone calls then I will contact my bank and simply buy another ticket, then sort it out with my bank/courts.
Thank you both for your help and comments.
I finally managed to sort something out with China Airlines at the very last minute. After many phone calls and even a visit to their Bangkok office. They actually got useful once I presented myself in person and asked for a print out of their own rules.
Firstly they wanted to put me in to "Taoyuan Hotel", which after some questioning was "within one hour from the airport" and no it was not the Novotel, not an option. In order to stay at the hotel I would have gotten to the hotel at about 1am with a need to depart at 4:30am. They were nice enough to throw in a breakfast voucher at the hotel which they reluctantly agreed I would not have been able to use. I offered to change it to the earlier flight BKK - TPE so I could sleep and eat the evening meal, they would not agree to this.
After asking for the details in writing so I would have something to show the bank when they refund my credit card they offered Eva air - The schedule was OK but not nearly as good as the original ticket, so I refused.
At 5:30 on Friday afternoon they offered ANA (Stop in Tokyo) with a better schedule than I originally had, so I took it.
It took me hours of phone calls and an hour of my time visiting the office.
By all rights according to their own rules;
11.3.2.1 the one way Fare (less applicable discounts and charges) from point of interruption to destination or point of next stopover.
I should have been refunded a full fare one way ticket which is probably more than I paid for the entire return ticket.
In hindsight if any airline pulls this sort of crap again, I will give them 2 phone calls then I will contact my bank and simply buy another ticket, then sort it out with my bank/courts.
Thank you both for your help and comments.
Jan 27, 2014, 9:54 pm
#5
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: CAN, LAX, TPE
Programs: AA, AS, CI, DL, UA
Posts: 2,896
Follow up:
I finally managed to sort something out with China Airlines at the very last minute. After many phone calls and even a visit to their Bangkok office. They actually got useful once I presented myself in person and asked for a print out of their own rules.
Firstly they wanted to put me in to "Taoyuan Hotel", which after some questioning was "within one hour from the airport" and no it was not the Novotel, not an option. In order to stay at the hotel I would have gotten to the hotel at about 1am with a need to depart at 4:30am. They were nice enough to throw in a breakfast voucher at the hotel which they reluctantly agreed I would not have been able to use. I offered to change it to the earlier flight BKK - TPE so I could sleep and eat the evening meal, they would not agree to this.
After asking for the details in writing so I would have something to show the bank when they refund my credit card they offered Eva air - The schedule was OK but not nearly as good as the original ticket, so I refused.
At 5:30 on Friday afternoon they offered ANA (Stop in Tokyo) with a better schedule than I originally had, so I took it.
It took me hours of phone calls and an hour of my time visiting the office.
By all rights according to their own rules;
11.3.2.1 the one way Fare (less applicable discounts and charges) from point of interruption to destination or point of next stopover.
I should have been refunded a full fare one way ticket which is probably more than I paid for the entire return ticket.
In hindsight if any airline pulls this sort of crap again, I will give them 2 phone calls then I will contact my bank and simply buy another ticket, then sort it out with my bank/courts.
Thank you both for your help and comments.
I finally managed to sort something out with China Airlines at the very last minute. After many phone calls and even a visit to their Bangkok office. They actually got useful once I presented myself in person and asked for a print out of their own rules.
Firstly they wanted to put me in to "Taoyuan Hotel", which after some questioning was "within one hour from the airport" and no it was not the Novotel, not an option. In order to stay at the hotel I would have gotten to the hotel at about 1am with a need to depart at 4:30am. They were nice enough to throw in a breakfast voucher at the hotel which they reluctantly agreed I would not have been able to use. I offered to change it to the earlier flight BKK - TPE so I could sleep and eat the evening meal, they would not agree to this.
After asking for the details in writing so I would have something to show the bank when they refund my credit card they offered Eva air - The schedule was OK but not nearly as good as the original ticket, so I refused.
At 5:30 on Friday afternoon they offered ANA (Stop in Tokyo) with a better schedule than I originally had, so I took it.
It took me hours of phone calls and an hour of my time visiting the office.
By all rights according to their own rules;
11.3.2.1 the one way Fare (less applicable discounts and charges) from point of interruption to destination or point of next stopover.
I should have been refunded a full fare one way ticket which is probably more than I paid for the entire return ticket.
In hindsight if any airline pulls this sort of crap again, I will give them 2 phone calls then I will contact my bank and simply buy another ticket, then sort it out with my bank/courts.
Thank you both for your help and comments.
Showing up in person helps cause it's easier to negotiate.