OW business class ranking
 

Just finish another DONE4, in the past 3 months flew AA, BA,CX, IB, JL, LA & QF on business. My ranking so far for long haul equipment is:

Seat (sleep comfort):
CX = LA > BA > QF > AA > JL > IB
*All New C seats

Service:
CX > JL > LA = QF > BA > AA > IB

What is your experience? Also would be good to include other OW members in this ranking.

I don't disagree any of the order rankings that you've offered....and would be very grateful if people might be able to add in MA, RJ and KA (none of which I've yet experienced in J) into the rankings.

AY ~ IB on both counts.

I wouldn't put JL so low on seat, nor CX so high.
On service I would drop LA several places. I've flown them quite a bit and yet to have a great flight.

RJ service is right up there with the best.

Consider me contrarian......:D

Partly because if I have enough space I'd just as soon be left alone to sleep or read. A bit of thought with meal content and service is nice but not necessary. And I do like to try regional wine varieties. CX and BA have to try harder there given the lack of domestic sources ;). And I can sleep anywhere so I only notice "issues". I would probably take an OPup to F but it is unlikely I would pay $$ or miles for the seat.

I don't like the new CX seats. Too narrow at the shoulders. Though the AVOD is fabulous. But it may be that Trans PAC flights are in themselves a pain. Nor do I have good memories of the AY 340 seats (2006). Too hard. (Yes I prefer the MD11 seats). And the best meal I remember was BKK-SIN on AY (Oct 2001 - also unlikely to be seen again). But anything almost will be better than Y meal service and content. I don't perceive a great deal of difference in the BA and QF seats - though I realize one goes flatter than the other. Would I specifically chose either over AA/CX at the roughly the same price? - No. Over AY/LA maybe.

Regional J is sometimes a pain but for daytime flights < 4/6 hours it is acceptable. CX regional / QF domestic beats anything European with AA domestic somewhere in between. But I do remember a very friendly and helpful IB FA between MAD and BCN.

Some of the best service I've had was on MA BKK-BUD (may it someday return ;) ). BA service seems more natural than QF. Or the FAs have a better appearance of being comfortable with their job. CX suffers with the new seats. (I think I mentioned that those seats are not my favorite) LA and IB it helps if you have some Spanish language capability but not strictly necessary. AA has no distinctive memories - good or bad.

Disclaimer I have never flown JL nor RJ in J. (Nor RJ since 1988 when economy was very inexpensive but unpredictable) My IB J flight was the regional seats. Nor have I flown LA/IB in Y.

Happily wandering in my own directions......

Fred

Good feedback!
As for my personal preference, I like better 180 flat seats, therefore LA, CX and BA score higher. CX seems to be narrower (maybe because of the high walls of the cocoon) but actually is almost same as LA. BA, good seat, but lacks of privacy. On my last HKG-JFK CX offered also underneath bedsheets added with my own PJ's could sleep very well for 10+hrs.

JL...well I just arrived from FRA-NRT, with their new flatshell seat. I can say is the hardest to sleep in + no privacy at all, very narrow seats no separator. The angled seat is the worst you can get for a good sleep. Even a regional CX or the old AA seats are better to sleep.

On LA service, I agree that it is very variable. A good crew can make a big difference. Food is not spectacular, but eatable. LA winelist much better than fancy French names offered on JL, probable the best wines on C are LA. And they really make an effort to bring interesting Chilean wines.

I tried to separate seat vs service rankings, because they seem to be almost always on conflict.

Also consider for this rankings only long haul products, since for regional (and most FTs) we can manage short flights (sometimes Y is ok, no need to go for C).

I guess you didn't fly QF in their new J seat which is fully flat and level (but only on the A380 -- however QF has 3 A380s now and will have 20 within 3 years). I have yet to fly J on A380 however it would seem to be the best J product in OW now (for hard product).

Contrary to what many others say, I am a huge fan of the new CX J long haul seats, especially in row 11 of the 773. As I travel solo most of the time, I really appreciate the privacy and happily disappear into the cocoon for hours. BA window seats are great for privacy too.
(For the same reason, I do not like AA F, because your head is completely unprotected by the aisle when sleeping; for me, row 4 would be intolerable because your head is right by the galley curtain.)

Small point, but I think the flight map system on IB is by far the best as you get to control the display, and can scroll the map all over the world at different zoom levels. I have not seen this on any other airline.
I found the CX flight map to be annoying as it constantly switches between different views with fancy rotating view-from-space images. Just because the technology makes it possible, doesn't mean it should be done.

Happy travels.

I agree on the new J CX seat, especially row 11 on CX 773. Two weeks ago I flew HKG-JFK and didn't feel the almost 15hr flight.

Can I assume you have tried the new QF J product on an A380?

I guess you haven't discovered how to use the privacy screen that is built in to the AA Flagship F seat; next time ask the FA to show you how (it is very easy, and solves the problem that you are complaining about -- the seat designers anticipated your needs, a shame not to use the feature).

CX is my current favourite, followed by QF (haven't tried the A380 yet - in May I will), AA, then BA (only NCW - seats were too short in bed mode hopefully NNCW is better).

I'm looking forward to flying LA's new business product for the first time later this year. They look nice.

I agree with your comments re BA, however if you get NNCW configured aircraft and either 62A, 62K, 64A or 64K the new design allow your feet to overhang which makes it significantly better than QF Skybed v1.0. The new design also means there is an extra 1" or so which means that if you are only a touch over 6 ft, you will find the NNCW seats very comfortable.

KA shorthaul biz is in another Universe compared to any other OW airline. Seats, meals, service...Amazing really.

I too was looking forward, but felt rather disappointed. They're surprisingly narrow-feeling, mainly because (I think) of the way the center console is shaped. The seat is one of those where the bottom cushion rises in order to slide forward into the reclining position (hope that's clear) and in doing so it impedes any movement in your thighs. The problem diminishes as it goes into full bed position, but I found it uncomfortable when in a "recline" mode. YMMV of course.

The IFE is pretty good, about on par with AA's new J product, including NC headphones.

I'm not clear from your post if you are saying that KA's universe is amazingly superior, or amazingly inferior to everybody else?
Clarification would be appreciated. Thanks.

Happy Travels.

I'm pretty sure the previous poster was saying superior. I would agree they are one of the best, certainly for consistency, although they are a little lacking in some areas (IFE for example).

Service wise, RJ over BA and the rest any day of the week.

I flew in Crown Class on RJ right after they joined oneworld... the service was stunning (LHR-AMM-BKK). I flew them again in 2008 in Crown Class (BUD-AMM-BKK-AMM-BUD) and it was just as I had remembered - amazing.

The reasons for that -

* The food service is nothing short of astonishing. Menus given out, then the trolley comes out with all the food on top and you pick and choose what you want. It's plated at your seat, is well presented, and has an unbelievably good taste. Out of all the ports above, the food quality was superb!

* At the end of your flight, all passengers receive a gift. The first time was Jordanian pottery (and I think we complimented the F/A so much that we were given seconds!) and the last time one of the gifts was a digital travel alarm clock. Very thoughtful and nice!

I feel that RJ is really going to come into their own once the 787s arrive. The flat seats on the A340 are extremely comfortable, but have absolutely no privacy whatsoever. The seats on the A310 (the Recaro ones now) are not flat, but do have privacy.

So yeah, if you haven't flown them do... I want to fly with them again because I am itching to try the brand new super lounge in Amman (check their web site - Crown Lounge at QAIA) ... :)

I recently did both QF long haul J seats, being a 332 flight and A380 flight, a BA 744 and BA 763 flight and a AA 763 flight. I avoided the CX 333 as I have previously tried the NZ seat and didn't like it in anyway shape or form. I avoided JL as the service is great but seat not so good.

For sleep I would rate
BA 744 - QF 380 - BA 763 - QF 332 - JL 744 - AA 763

For overall product and service (for example a day time flight, good sleep not required)

BA 744 - BA 763 - QF 332 - QF 380 - JL 744 - AA 763.

Here is what I like about BA - if you get a window seat it is very private, good for both rest and also relaxation. I found the crew on all four of my longhaul flights on BA in Jan to be excellent. Attentive, polite and frequently available in the cabin and quick to respond if needed. The food service was good, portions large enough, good variety (never ate the same meal twice) and was over and done with quickly enableing plenty of rest or work time. I understand this might seem rushed to some but it is just the way I like it. The AVOD is sufficient and onboard ammenities only lacking PJ's and slippers.

Qantas - I like the small cabin feel of the 332 with only 3 rows of J followed by another 3 rows of J. The seat is angle flat and is perhaps not the best for sleeping. AVOD is sufficient. The crew can be missing in action, meal service slow (2.5 hours for dinner after takeoff) and on SYD-HKG only 1 meal was offered for a 9 hour flight. The seat lacks privacy on the 332. The 380 is aweful and I hated it. My LAX-MEL flight had a full cabin load, the crew disorganised, service so slow that at 1:45 after wheels up I had to go and demand PJ's and missed dinner. After leaving the US East Coast at 6 am I couldn't stay awake any longer. The cabin reminds me of school camp dorm with all the beds lined up like camp stretchers. The BA seat is also better for sleeping and more private (if you have a window seat).

JAL - JAL is let down by two things, the seat is hard and on a funny angle and the AVOD is nearly non existant. It is a shame as the JAL service is excellent as is the food.

AA - They try hard. The crew are great but the seat is awefull (I am too short for it at 5ft 6). Food is not so great either.

Overall BA was a real surprise, having tried them a few years ago on a couple of occasions and not being treated that well they actually really came out on top in both product and service. Next time I know to pack my own PJ's.

Of course, if one can get an aisle seat in rows 11, 12 or 13 you have a cabin with 18 seats similar to that of the 332.

I just completed my first DONE4 (one more on reservation).

I flew JL (3), QF (1), LA (5), IB (2), BA (3), CX (2) on this DONE4 and was quite happy with all of the carriers. All had new generation lie-flat seats ^!

1) Seat comfort ranking (sleeping and lounging):

LA>BA>CX>QF>IB=JL

I really found CX seat cramped even for a normal sized 5'8" guy like myself. In a lie-flat position it was better and the cushion was adequate. QF seats on their A333 was also a bit tight, but comfy amongst slanted slanted lie-flats.

2) Service

CX>JL>>>QF>IB=LA=BA for your reference, I'd rate AC and UA much much lower than BA,IB,LA. This means overall service level on all of the six carriers I've flown were very good.

I really enjoyed my 50K mile DONE4 and currently in plans for another one that will net me almost 60K miles! :D

Out of interest, did you manage to get a QF A380 J seat, or was it the older B747/A330 product?

[my request for this information from another poster so far seems to have fallen on deaf ears]

*bump*

Still not heard from either the OP nor the other poster on whether they managed to try the new QF J on the A380. Personally quite interested in knowing as I am also yet to try it.

I've written about the new QF J in my recent TR:
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/trip-...-qf-744-f.html

Pics are down as my photobucket account bandwidth has been exceeded, something I hope to fix within the next week or so.

I travelled in 12E earlier this month after being called by Qantas and offerred an upgrade from Q class for 72K QFF points.

I enjoyed it, no TR. I just did my normal thing for a 13 hours flight - 4 hours wining and dining and 1½ movies, 7 hours attempted sleep and 2 hours for breakfast and the other ½ of the movie.

Bed was OK, however I did find the foot rest a bit narrow compared to the rest of the bed so had to keep feet centralised (but this is much worse on BA NCW).

I took advice I found here and on AFF and worked hard to get an inner ailse seat in the first three rows - it took several calls after being upgraded. Apparently, this front cabin of three rows is the new "upper Deck" (as in the 744's).

I would actually put LA ahead of CX. On a recent DONE5, I thought the LA equipment was the best we experienced, although the service left much to be desired.

My equipment ranking (for J) would be

LA > CX > BA > QF = AA > JL

LA J seats (at least on the 767's) are awesome. Best equipment I've experienced, overall.

CX J is really comfortable, but looks horrible, imo.
I think I've had the best sleep on the CX J seats compared to any other oneworld J seat.

LA and CX J are close to QF/AA F class (perhaps I say that just because the seats are flat. But LA J goes close to exceeding QF F (at least on 747)).

BA J is claustrophobic. There's no where to put your boarding card, let alone a book/magazine/wallet. Didn't like it at all. Quite a shame compared to the older J class BA had (when they had the first fully flat beds).

QF J is tortuous if you're on an over night flight. If it's a day time flight and you're just watching movies/working on the laptop, the seat is perfect. The upstairs deck is a must, at least you get the bins if you are on the window.

JL is the worst I've experienced on oneworld. I was actually shocked recently. Most of my JL flights have been short haul (intra asia) so I've grown to expect the same short haul sub J seats you get with QF. However, I always assumed I'd see better from JL long haul.

Just a couple of weeks back I flew NRT-SYD on JL in J for the first time, usually I've been on QF. Apart from the equipment being very ordinary, the entire experience was ordinary. Even on overnight flights there's no amenity kit, for instance - you can request a tooth brush. Fortunately NRT-SYD isn't that long in the scheme of things. I'd hate to do something like JFK-NRT on JL.

Well, looks like my first try of the QF A380 J seat was never meant to be. My flight tonight (LAX-SYD) has had an aircraft substitution to a 747, so looks like I will be sliding down the seat all the way to Sydney, as usual.

Was quite looking forward to it, as I have had 15 or so long-haul flights in AA J in the last couple of months (all evip upgrades from Y, so no complaints there) and was looking forward to something new (and lie-flat).

The answer is contained in post #4 of this thread:

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/qanta...-747-qf11.html

Besides the factors mentioned above, one reason I avoid JL whenever I can is because they do not pay out any status bonus mileage (just like BA)

Agree about JL, CX and RJ.

I only had two flights with LA and one of them (PPT-IPC) was absolutely fantastic service in J. The other flight was still okay.

Just weighing in on the CX seat, I like it. I am able to sleep very well with it. The service hasn't been the same, still good, but not like I remember it. I've actually had good luck with the JL service. The AA seat is horrible, can never get a good sleep in it and when I do manage a couple hours I usually wake up really sore some place or another.